176
31 July 1908.]
CROWN AGENTS' ENQUIRY COMMITTEE:
Sir E. BLAKE.
than is usual in an officer of such high standing?— Of course, you must think of what the organisation of the office is that the secretary is appointed really to try and safeguard the position of the Crown Agenta. As. I explained before, we want to secure that every paper that is of the least importance should go to the Crown Agents, that they shall not be in the dark with regard to anything happening, and, therefore, we appoint a man who has no concern whatever with the actual administrative business of the office to look after that. His most important function is practically to secure us against surprises.
4158. Would not the same purpose be more naturally secured by the Crown Agents having private secre- taries -It does not matter in the least.
4159. It does matter, to my mind; you put a person nominally at the head of the office, and you take away from him control of every department except five. You give him the largest salary in the office, and then you say that he has nothing to do with the administration of the office-The position, of course, would be this. The office could be reconstituted just as it is for the Responsible Government agencies if there was one man and a secretary, and the secretary is practically the second man. All the office would be under him in that case; but we have a different organisation. That is what it amounts to.
4160. (Mr. Bailey.) And you think it necessary, do you, on full consideration of the case, to have a man primarily for that purpose, so that you may get all complaints brought to your notice?-I think it essen- tial that we shall have someone who practically looks at all questions from the point of view of the Crown Agents.
4161. As against their staff?-As against the staff; just in the same way as our friends, the Audit Office, are of enormous benefit to us. Instead of resenting the audit I feel they are our best friends, because if anything happens they will call attention to it.
4162. (Sir Albert Spicer.) How far do you consider that your secretary's duties correspond to these three divisions: first, that the secretariat shall take over by degrees all miscellaneous business of the office not strictly appertaining to any other department: is he doing that? He is doing that.
4163. The second is that the secretariat shall keep a record of all precedents and questions of principle which may arise and be dealt with in the course of business in any department of the office ?-That, I am sorry to say, is not being done.
4164. (Mr. Gibson.) That would necessitate all the work of the various departments passing through him? -All the precedents being sent to him to register that is all.
4165. (Sir Albert Spicer.) That has fallen through ?— Yes.
4166. The third is, that doubt may arise as to the proper action to be taken on a particular case, and application should be made to the secretariat for infor mation as to precedents?—Yes.
4167. Has that been carried out?--That follows on the other.
4168. Therefore, two and three are not being carried out? They are not.
4169. Simply No. 17-Simply No. 1.
4170. (3fr. Gibson.) Would you think it a preferable arrangement to let the secretary perform the duties of a secretary or an under-secretary of a large office, ading the number of Crown Agents by one?--That would be an alternative way.
4171. Do you think that would be a preferable alternative?—You are in this difficulty: if you adopt that system I think there might be one Crown Agent, a secretary, and an assistant secretary; but I think our organisation is better, having regard to the enor mous amount of our work. It is far better to have three men than to have one man, or even two.
4173. I would suggest two Crown Agents?—Even two I would object to, because one might fall ill. I think it is rather & dangerous position to have only one Crown Agent.
4173. Just passing to a general question about salaries and recruitment, with regard to your minute about the supplementary clerks, may I take it that in the scheme you are to put before the Committee you will not have varying rates of pay for people recruited from different sources?—No, because that system has broken down; we contemplated that these lads would pass the examination, but as a matter of fact very few of them have done so.
4174. You admit it is impossible to bring people in. coming from various sources, at varying rates of sulary We began doing that, but we have had to abandon it,
4175. I see it is stated in the evidence of some of the witnesses that the posts of the heads of depart- ments vary in importance?—They vary very much in importance; that is one of the difficulties of having a scale.
4176. Is it the case that they vary so substantially that it is impossible to have one scale that would be applicable to the whole?—I am afraid it would happen if you had a scale that some men would be overpaid and some men underpaid.
4177. I ain not referring to the technical heads, such as the Head of the Engineer and Works Department and the head of the engineering inspection brauch, who stand in a special category 7-Yes, they will always have to be got specially.
4178. Perhaps the chief clerk aud accountant might stand somewhat by himself, but taking the other heads. the chief cashier, the head of the Miscellaneous Department, the Registrar of Inscribed Stocks, the head of the Shipping and head of the General Stores, are their duties so varied or different in importance that you could not have one scale applicable to those five persons-You might have one scale for those
men.
4179. There are one or two miscellaneous questions, leaving the scales of pay and the method of recruit- ment. With regard to the issue of loans we had some evidence from the Accountant-General of the India Office, describing how they issued their loans through the Bank of England and the rates they paid; they paid £1,250 per £1,000,000 for the issue of a fixed price loan and £625 per £1,000,000 for the issue of a tender loan 7-Yes.
4180. I think you admitted that your rate of per cent., which works out at £5,000 per £1,000,000, was rather high ?—No, I do not think that was brought before me.
The position is this, that our per cent. is practically i per cent. We pay out of that per cent, brokerage on all applications received from banks and brokers, so that it reduces it to very little more than per cent.
4181. I have put to you what I understood from your previous evidence. You were prepared to make a reduction of charge?—I was speaking about the paying-off of loans; there we can afford very substan- tially to reduce the commission if we are given a little more for paying interest which is heavy work.
4182. You have explained that your City office was a very small affair?-It is merely for the convenience of the Stock Exchange that is all.
4183. It is a permanent office, however, with two men in it? We have three men, and on the account days we send whatever staff is necessary.
4184. What is it precisely that is done there ?-Do you know about transfer and stock-keeping? The people write their names'in a book, our staff keep the register, and they send day by day to us a record of any transactions, and those recorded in our registers.
4185. You have various balances from the Colonies in your handla ?—Yes.
are
4186. You have floating balances which you lend out to other Colonies ?--Yes.
4187. With regard to the interest on those balances. the office fund takes these?-No, of course, it goes to the Colony to whom the money belongs.
4188. In every case?—In every case.
The only thing
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