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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE

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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON'

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out that proposal, and there would be less difficulty in assimilating arms and equipment, and in endeavouring to have our men, who may be called the Militia, trained, as well as armed and equipped, as nearly as possible according to the methods which approve themselves to the Imperial services. The Ross rifle may be a bettor rifle than any that exists in the service, and it might be a vory hard thing, and would, no doubt, be a very hard thing, to ask a great Dominion like Canada, to abandon the small arm which it has adopted. On the other hand, it may be that the Ross ritto, il tested here, would approve itself to the Imperial services, but it consideration which only wish to mention, and for this reason, that however good a particular arm may be, it is better almost to sacrifico something in the more point of officiency, if we can obtain uniformity of conditions which will enablo our troops, from whatever part of the Empire they come, to be brigaded together in time of action. That is the real requirement which manifests itself now after what the Secretary of State for War has said, and considering as I do, that the maintenance of such a reserve as is indicated both by Mr. Brodrick and by Mr Sedon will be difficult, if not impossible, I should be disposed to suggest some fort of resolution that may approve itself to Mr. Seddon, adopting that part of his resolution which is common to all of us. The resolution I suggest is en

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(1.) That it is desirable that each self-governing Colony should endeavour to assimilate its arms, ammunition, and equipment as far as possible to patterns adopted for the Imperial Army.'

(2.) That the respective Governments recognise the wisdom of establishing factories and works for providing arms, ammunition and equipment for their requirements.”

may not be able, all of us, to get on more common ground than that, and what is desirable at a Conference of this kind is to find out what common ground there is, and to apply the principles which govern it all round. It seems to me that by beginning in this way, and with respect to all the services in this matter, the Conference can proceed from little to more, until we cover a larger field.

With reference to the report of certain military men, a military Committee appointed by the Commonwealth, which points out the diversity, the lack of periodical inspection, save in one State, and the irregularity of arms and equipment which prevailed in Australia, a word of explanation as to that may be useful.

This Committee was appointed by the Commonwealth Government in view of the work before it of welding into one amalgamated body the half dozen military systems which had prevailed in half a dozen separate States. The work of welding them into one is now proceeding, but it cannot come to a satisfactory conclusion until a Federal Defence Act is passed, and the passage of such an Act will be part of the work of next session. In the meantime the matters which are commented upon by the officers forming the Committee concerned, while they are patent facts, are such diversities within Australia as she will rectify for herself as opportunity allows. Of course, that

a work of time. It is not a work that is likely to be delayed, because it is one into which my hon. Friend, Sir John Forrest--and I am sorry he is not well enough to be here to-day--but this is a work into which he has put his heart, and we all know what a resolute man he is when he makes up bis mind. But the lesson to be drawn from the report is the lesson that the differences in arms, in equipment, and in system generally, should be wiped out, as between those who have hitherto had separate administrations. If the lesson is true us far as Australia is con- cerned, surely, as we are likely to be linked together in future struggles for the defence of the Empire, it is a lesson which should be drawn for the Empire itself, and to the whole of the extent of these points I think we ought to co-operate with the War Department, and to remove any differenes which may stand in the way of perfectly effective action when troops are brigaded together. Differences in arms, differences in the way in which small arma may be used, such differences in the parts as may prevent a

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soldier to whom they may be served out from understanding them when troops are brigaded together, these are matters which should give way before the necessity of assimilating small arms, ammunition, and equipmont throughout the Empire to every extent that is really practicable.

A consideration that is very strongly put forward by Mr. Brodrick is one that I think must appeal to all of us. In warfare, the best chance is with the man who gets in the first blow. If it has been the fact that the Navy has been reasonably prompt, it is also admitted to be the fact that the Army of Great Britain has generally been the last to act. Diversities in equipment, and in arms and matters of this kind generally are the very matters which delay the process of getting ready for action. Similarly, uniformity in these matters is the very thing which will expedite action. There- fore, the greatest help 1 think that we can render to the Empire, in playing our part of being ready, is to wipe out differences within ourselves in these points, and also to arrive at some common system with the Empire in respect of such matters as arms and equipment. I could wish to have gone further, but I have already pointed out what is public opinion already in Australia, and we can go no further than public opinion will take us.

I should like to name another matter while on this subject. Reference has been made to the number of the permanent forces, which I take to mean, what we call pormauent forces together with the Militia. There has been a little paper which has been published in the Commonwealth, which shows the state of the forces there in point of numbers.

The SECRETARY OF STATE FOR WAR: Is this it?

Sir EDMUND BARTON: That is the permanent, or partially-paid, Volunteers, but I was going to add to that. This is it. I am inuch obliged. This is a statement showing the number in each of the several States of permanent soldiers, militia, volunteers, and members of rifle ciubs. That

shows:--

Total permanently employed Militia

Volunteers

Members of rifle clubs

1,457

18,603

8,860 29.250

Now, these Rifle Clubs—of course there is a far larger proportion in one State, and there is already a strong opinion, one with which I am not in accord myself, that one lesson to be drawn from the Boer War is that former ideas as to the necessity of discipline and training have got to be modified, and that such necessity exists to nothing like the substantial state in which it is supposed to exist. 1 cannot say I agree with that, but as I say that leads to the strong opinion that safety is to be found in large numbers of Volunteers and members of Rifle Clubs. We hear very frequently the expression :--"Take a man to the butts. put a rifle in his hand, make a good marksman of him, and then he can "defend his country as well as anyone." I do not agree with that. But this is an opinion we have to reckon with, and calls for more expenditure on Volunteers and Rifle Clubs, and the contraction of ex- penditure with regard to the force which I regard as the really valuable one, and that is the Militia. Now, we have in Australia, as I pointed out, some 18,000 militia. In times like these, retrenchment is in the air, but nevertheless we are spending in respect of military forces on a reduced estimate, something like 600,000l. a year, which is equivalent to three million dollars, and that is apart from loan expenditure on fortifications and the like. Now, we shall, no doubt, be asked to provide more liberally for Volunteers and Rifle Clubs, and less liberally for Militia. That is a tendency which I mean to resist, but it is a tendency which shows, that when we are with Sir Frederick Borden in endeavouring to perfect, as far as can, our Militia, not in respect of one portion of it, which is specially set aside, but in respect M f

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