184
| PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE
Reference :--
C.O. 885
8
PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON
ALLY WITHOUT PERMISSION OF THE COPYRIGHT PHOTOGRAPH-NOT TO BE REPRODUCED PHOTOGRAPHIC-
158.
to be a departmental question. It is a political question rather. Every. effort has been made to unify the Empire, and we must also seek to unify the people in the different parts of the Empire. The native population of Canada, or the population of British origin are comparatively small. Its relative proportion must become less as time goes on. There are streams of population setting into our country from all sources, and we are therefore anxious that they shall, as much as possible, be brought into touch with the sentiments of the Empire. Our country is flooded with literature from the United States, and we would prefer it, if we could, to put into the hands of our people litera- Lurb from the Mother Country. It would also be of service to the Mother Country. I presume the Press is not opposed to increasing its circulation with the Colonies, and the circulation of the English Press would also tend to promote English trade with the Colonies. You have a material interest as well as a political one. I do not see that Canada has any material interest in the matter directly. I do not see at all that a reduction in the postal rates would lead to an increased circulation of Canadian papers in the United Kingdom. We are not asking anything for ourselves, but desire to bring about a condition of affairs that will keep our people more in touch with Imperial sentiments. I recognise the fact that all the Colonies in the Empire and the Mother Country as well may not be ready at the same time to come down to a dead level of rates. That consideration, however, need not block the movement. It might suit one Colony-one part of the Empire to-day, to consent to the reduction. It may not suit the other. Shall we all stand stili until all are ready, or shall we all proceed step by step? The latter was the policy adopted in 1898 when a reduction of the postage on letters was adopted. There was nothing compulsory about it, but it was left to any parts of the Empire to agree upon a reduction, and it began in a limited way, and step by step advanced until to-day it is almost universal throughout the country. And the same method is suggested in the resolution which is before you to-day.
Mr. SEDDON: Have you got the resolution ?
Sir WILLIAM MULOCK: I thought I sent it.
The SECRETARY OF STATE: The resolution is here :→→→
46
+4
That it is advisable to adopt the principle of cheap postage within the British Empire on all newspapers and periodicals published therein, and therefore this Conference approves of a policy looking to a substantial reduction in the rate, leaving it to each Government to "determine the amount to which it may reduce such rate and time *for such reduction coming into effect.”
Sir GEORGE MURRAY: I am afraid, Mr. Chamberlain, that from the point of view from which Sir William Mulock has opened this matter, I shall have very little to say. As he pointed out, this is not a departmental question. It is a question of Imperial policy, but if I may be allowed to say, from a purely departmental and parochial point of view, how it struck me, I should like, while sympathising entirely with what he says as to the desirability of encouraging inter-communication and the exchange of letters and papers within the Empire, to point out that to us it presents itself purely and simply as a financial question. Sir William Mulock did not indicate exactly how far the reduction which he proposed should be carried, but I gathered from a conversation I had with him the other day that his suggestion was that the rate between the United Kingdom and Canada should be assimilated to the domestic rate in Canada, or to the rate which is in operation between the United States and Canada—say d. per Ib.
Sir WILLIAM MULOCK; I do not know that I should venture to suggest to each country what the reduced rate should be,but it might be brought lower and lower. Between eight halfpence a pound and our rate of a farthing a pound there is a wide range. I would hope that it would come down to a
159
halfpenny a pound ultimately, and I hope that now between Canada and the United Kingdom.
Sir GEORGE MURRAY: Then perhaps I ought to say that the existing rate, which is a halfpenny for two ounces, leaves us absolutely no margin of profit at all. On newspapers and printed matter sent from this country to Canada direct, we have to pay for sea carriage nearly 244. a pound. For the same matter seut rid the United States-and a large proportion goes by that route from this side-the rate is still higher, and comes, I think, to something like 33d. a pound. As we only get for each complete pound fourpence, that leaves us hardly anything for handling, and for carriage in this country. To reduce it to anything like the figure which Sir William Mulock montions would meau, of course, a very large loss indeed. It is a loss, moreover, which could not be limited to the matter which goes between here and Canada. It must of course, be extended to any Colony which would agree to reciprocity on the subject; and I do not think it could be limited to the Empire. It would probably have to be extended to foreign countries. Then, again, it would be necessary to reduce our own domestic rate to the same extent, and it is impossible to say what the effect of that reduction would be. I think the loss on the United States Post Office approaches to something like 5,000,000/. sterling a year, and it is very largely due to the low rates conceded to printed matter. In Canada, I understand, you look upon the Post Office as a revenue-producing department, and we are bound by im- perious necessity to do the same, but I think there is no chance of getting the Chancellor of the Exchequer to agree to a rate which would involve so serious a loss. I should hardly like to commit myself to a liguro exactly, but I think 1,000,000/, might perhaps be a low estimate for it. But I shall be very happy to represent to the Postmaster-General what has been said, and no doubt he will cousider it in conjunction with his colleagues.
The SECRETARY OF STATE: In saying that it would mean the loss of 1,000,000%., you are not, of course, referring to the postage on newspapers and letters to Canada?
Sir GEORGE MURRAY: No; but it would involve a reduction of our own domestic rates which I think might perhaps result in the loss of some- thing like 1,000,0001. of revenue.
The SECRETARY OF STATE: Why should the reduction between here and Canada or between here and Australasia involve a reduction in domestic rates?
Sir GEORGE MURRAY: I think we can hardly charge our own people
a higher rate than we are charging for Canada and Australasia.
The SECRETARY OF STATE: Surely you are not quite so logical in the Post Office; you charge for instance a penny to go from one street to another and you charge a penny to go from here to Australia.
Sir GEORGE MURRAY: Yes, but we do not charge a penny to go from one street to another, and a halfpenny to go from here to Australia, which would be an analogous case.
•
Sir WILFRID LAURIER: What is the domestic rate here?
Sir GEORGE MURRAY: ¡d, for 2 ozs.
The SECRETARY OF STATE: That is 4d. per 1 lb. and we charge to Canada 8d. per 1 lb.
Sir GEORGE MURRAY: No; fourpence.
Sir EDMUND BARTON: The question involved here is one rather of form than of principle. The inclusion of this resolution with reference to
U 4