PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE
Reference :-
C.O.885
18 PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON
ALLY WITHOUT PERMISSION OF THE BE REPRODUCED PHOTOGRAPHIC- COPYRIGHT PHOTOGRAPH-NOT TO
Fifteenth Day. 14 May 1907.
MAIL SERVICE TO AUSTRALIA AND NEW
ZEALAND ria
CANADA. (Sir
Joseph Ward.)
141
as to geographical position. We cannot allow that condition of matters to exist. I am making my own position clear and not presuming to suggest what anybody else thinks, but from the point of view of New Zealand, in order to approach this from the practical point of the usefulness to England to Canada and to New Zealand, and to Australia, too, the route for that service distinctly from the Pacific side would be shorter from Vancouver to Auckland, which, as I say, is nearly 300 miles shorter than the distance stated in this chart furnished here. It is about 6,300 miles to Auckland from Vancouver, the contractors at their option would call at either Wellington or Auckland. I approach it from the standpoint that we must have New Zealand as one of the intermediate ports for touching at only, that is, steamers would remain there half-a-dozen hours as has been the case all along with the San Francisco mail steamers. We gave the major portion of the subsidy to that service, and Australia, Sydney especially, got the full benefit of it, being a terminal port, and giving a very small amount of subsidy towards it. That position we recognised as unavoidable.
Now coming to the question of the speed across the Pacific, there are two touching places for coaling. From Vancouver to Honolulu, with a service such as we are contemplating here, would be done under three days.
Dr. JAMESON: You are limiting your remarks to a fast mail service, nothing to do with cargo at all?
Sir JOSEPH WARD: Yes, I said we require cargo to be carried by tramps. This is a fast mail service-a passenger service with a fast speed, such as, if we gave a large contribution from our country, we should expect. For coaling purposes and for the necessities of carrying on a big steamship service, Honolulu is within three days steam of Vancouver. It is only four days under the existing service from San Francisco to Honolulu with the ordinary steamers trading there, and only four days when the San Francisco steamers were running to New Zealand. The next point is from Honolulu to Suva, which is the other place they would touch at. That would be about six days with the high speed I am talking of. It was done in seven or eight days with the mail steamers that were engaged.
Sir WILFRID LAURIER: At what speed?
Sir JOSEPH WARD: Only 15 or 16 knots. Then from Suva to New Zealand would be well under three days. The coaling places referred to by Sir William Lyne, which is the all-important element from a steamship point of view, are within easy distance for fast steamers which require coal at intervals, and require a few hours' rest at intervals for machinery purposes. The question arises what speed is a steamer to put into operation to cross the While Sir Wilfrid Laurier was speaking, I was looking into the Pacific? matter and I find that with under a 22-knot service-only a little over 21 knots-the whole business from Vancouver to New Zealand could be done in practically 13 days. The whole point comes back to this: Are you looking at the Pacific Ocean as a long sheet of water upon which a steamer is supposed to be coaled up to the eyes, and prepared up to the hilt to do a 6,000 mile journey without any assistance whatever in the way of coaling facilities?
Sir WILFRID LAURIER: You can only stop at Honolulu for coal. Sir JOSEPH WARD: And at Suva, which is within six days steam from Honolulu. It is the stopping point now from Honolulu, and so you get a coaling depôt at Honolulu, and a depôt at Suva, and a coaling depôt at Auckland. Now, our steamers do it in 3 days 3 hours from Auckland to Sydney, which is quite common. With a steamer of the speed I am speaking of, they would do it under three days quite easily.
at low
145
TO AUSTRALIA AND NEW ZEALAND ria CANADA.
We come to the point of the project of bringing the outlying possessions Fifteenth Day. into touch. This is all-important. We have been talking about emigration
14 May 1907. schemes and of subscribing large sums of money for the purpose of assisting
MAIL SERVICE emigrants going from the British Islands out to Canada, Australia, and New Zealand. If you gave them the opportunity of third-class accommodation upon those steamers of going with this speed to these countries it would be a good thing. Canada has the inestimable advantage of being very much closer in that respect, and to some extent it would minimise its importance to them, but speed, of course, is a very important element to Canada. From our point of view, instead of spending anything for emigra- tion, we would one hundred thousand times rather give it as a matter of practical business to a fast service to bring our countries within three weeks of London. Supposing this service were to rost probably 300,000l. or 400,000l. a year by way of subsidy.
Mr. LLOYD GEORGE: Do you mean in the aggregate?
Sir JOSEPH WARD: Yes, between the whole of us.
Mr. LLOYD GEORGE: Not with a 20-knot service. I am afraid that does not agree with my information.
Sir JOSEPH WARD: To-day you have got running, and for many years have had running, from London to Australia through the Suez Canal, a weekly steamship service between two lines of steamers, a fortnightly one by each company, and by that route as far as your subsidies went for under 180,000l. a year. Australia has entered into a contract, I understand, for less.
Mr. LLOYD GEORGE: There is a pretty big trade there-that is the difference.
is
Sir JOSEPH WARD: Well, it is a passenger and mail service -- there very
little cargo.
Sir WILLIAM LYNE: And a weekly trade.
Sir JOSEPH WARD: A weekly trade. I understand a contract has been entered into by Australia for 125,000l. a year, I do not know whether I am right in the figures.
Mr.
DEAKIN :
That was the figure, 125,000Z.
Sir JOSEPH WARD: If we are going to aim at getting something superior in the way of speed to bring these countries together you cannot hope to get a fast service unless you pay for it.
Mr. LLOYD GEORGE: How many knots would that be? Is not that a 15 knots service?
Sir JOSEPH WARD: The new service?
Mr. LLOYD GEORGE: No. The service you are referring to now, that we are subsidising through the Suez Canal.
Sir JOSEPH WARD: They run about 15 knots, I believe.
1 49270.
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(Sir Joseph Ward.)