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As regards the last part of the question, the Department will, of course, investigate any known blackspots and take action on illegal graves within the limit of available resources, as part and parcel of the Department's responsibility over crematorium, columbarium and cemetery matters. However, to a large extent, priority will have to be given to referrals by other government departments and complaints made directly to the Department.
Mr. Lee Kwok-keung (in Cantonese): I ask this question because we have read from press reports that people are selling illegal graves to make money, and yet, as revealed in the reply document, we do not know the number of illegal graves outside designated cemeteries. If this is the case, how can we tell which graves or urns are new ones so as to stamp them out?
Secondly, it is stated in the reply document that 13 cases were handled in the last 2 years. Was there ever a prosecution or was anybody fined?
Thirdly, 4 such cases are being handled at present. I want to know how long it would take to finalize them?
Mr. Joseph Chan Yuek-sut (in Cantonese): Mr. Chairman, about the first question on the number of new graves, there is no way for us to know. About people trying to sell illegal graves, let me point out first of all that such activities do not fall within the ambit of the Urban Council. If someone tries to sell a grave, it is fraud because the public does not have the right to sell land for this purpose. If someone says he has the right to, it falls outside the ambit of the Urban Council and should be taken over by the Police. As such, all we do on receiving complaints or referrals from departments concerned is to remove illegal graves.
On prosecution, we have never prosecuted. There is provision in the Ordinance for a fine of $5,000 and imprisonment up to 6 months, but it has never been invoked to prosecute anybody. In the first place, there is no way to find out who is responsible for an unclaimed grave. The Department puts up a notice. If no one puts in a claim, the grave is removed after seeking the approval of the Secretary for Home Affairs. There is no one prosecuted in respect of an unclaimed illegal grave. Secondly, it is hard to find out and prove the person making the burial unless one is caught in the act. It will be difficult to identify the person responsible afterwards. Needless to say, it would be more difficult to prove that person's responsibility. That is why this legislation has never been invoked to prosecute anybody.
About the third question on the time required to handle 4 cases involving 57 graves, I do not have information in hand. The normal procedure is to affix notices on the graves or urns and if necessary put in public notices in newspapers. If nobody claims them, they are removed. If somebody claims them, they are responsible to remove them.
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Page 44 of 654
Page 44 of 654
42
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
6 +4 of 654
As regards the last part of the question, the Department will, of course, investigate any known blackspots and take action on illegal graves within the limit of available resources, as part and parcel of the Department's responsibility over crematorium, columbarium and cemetery matters. However, to a large extent, priority will have to be given to referrals by other government departments and complaints made directly to the Department.
Mr. Lee Kwok-KEUNG (in Cantonese):-I ask this question because we have read from press reports that people are selling illegal graves to make money, and yet, as revealed in the reply document, we do not know the number of illegal graves outside designated cemeteries. If this is the case, how can we tell which graves or urns are new ones so as to stamp them out?
Secondly, it is stated in the reply document that 13 cases were handled in the last 2 years. Was there ever a prosecution or was anybody fined?
Thirdly, 4 such cases are being handled at present. I want to know how long it would take to finalize them?
MR. JOSEPH CHAN YUEK-SUT (in Cantonese):---Mr. Chairman, about the first question on the number of new graves, there is no way for us to know. About people trying to sell illegal graves, let me point out first of all that such activities do not fall within the ambit of the Urban Council. If someone tries to sell a grave, it is fraud because the public does not have the right to sell land for this purpose. If someone says he has the right to, it falls outside the ambit of the Urban Council and should be taken over by the Police. As such, all we do on receiving complaints or referrals from departments concerned is to remove illegal graves.
On prosecution, we have never prosecuted. There is provision in the Ordinance for a fine of $5,000 and imprisonment up to 6 months, but it has never been invoked to prosecute anybody. In the first place, there is no way to find out who is responsible for an unclaimed grave. The Department puts up a notice. If no one puts in a claim, the grave is removed after seeking the approval of the Secretary for Home Affairs. There is no one prosecuted in respect of an unclaimed illegal grave. Secondly, it is hard to find out and prove the person making the burial unless one is caught in the act. It will be difficult to identify the person responsible afterwards. Needless to say, it would be more difficult to prove that person's responsibility. That is why this legislation has never been invoked to prosecute anybody.
About the third question on the time required to handle 4 cases involving 57 graves, I do not have information in hand. The normal procedure is to affix notices on the graves or urns and if necessary put in public notices in newspapers. If nobody claims them, they are removed. If somebody claims them, they are responsible to remove them.
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