1967 — Page 108

of 259

Page 108 of 25π

Page 108 of 259

192

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

MR. BERNACCHI:-Mr. Chairman, I am not quarrelling with the proposition that a large number of smaller swimming pools is preferable to a large expanse of water, but I am questioning the advisability of swimming pools of international standard when, as Mr. SALES says in the last part of his question, we have been talking about the need to provide swimming pools for so long. I would like to ask Mr. SALES whether this proposal to provide swimming pools of international stand- ard will mean a reduction in the number of swimming pools because of an increase in the expense of the individual pools?

MR. SALES: Sir, I would like to answer that question in separate parts as it was posed. First, I would like to repeat the sentence which I mentioned earlier on in my main reply. A careful study of local requirements was made by the Urban Services Department and the Public Works Department in an effort to find a solution best suited to our needs. I think that is a statement of policy. Secondly, I would like to say that the Select Committee has gone over this question for months on end, and the Select Committee knows what it is talking about. I think at that time Members of the Urban Council, other than members of the Select Committee who might have had a contribution to make to the discussions, had the opportunity of doing so. Thirdly, I think the term international swimming pool has been bandied about by Mr. BERNACCHI, perhaps without knowing what the term means in actual measurements. Perhaps, Mr. BERNACCHI might like to explain to me what he means by an international swimming pool before I answer that question?

MR. BERNACCHI-I said international swimming pool standards.

MR. SALES: What does Mr. BERNACCHI imply by that term; inter- national swimming pool standards? Perhaps he and I are not talking on the same wave length when he referred to that term.

MR. BERNACCHI:-Mr. Chairman, I am asking a question, not being asked a question.

MR. SALES: -I am asking for a clarification before I can give an intelligent reply.

MR. BERNACCHI:-Mr. Chairman, I think Mr. SALES is being slightly obstructive. He knows perfectly well what I mean. Con- struction of swimming pools to international standards requires the length, the breadth, the depth and the construction generally to be up to those standards. Those standards require, or perhaps require, con- siderably greater expense than just a mere pool where one can swim, and I am questioning the advisability of constructing swimming pools at international standards when the demand in Hong Kong is so great for swimming pools.

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

193

MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, Mr. BERNACCHI's clarification has brought to light the fact that he does not know what the dimensions of an international swimming pool are. The matter has been thoroughly examined by the Select Committee in conjunction with the two Depart- ments concerned. The Select Committee is conscious of the fact that the main purpose is to provide bathing facilities and teaching facilities for the young people in Hong Kong. The Select Committee is also conscious of the fact that there is the need to distinguish between national facilities and neighbourhood facilities, and these come within the category of neighbourhood or district facilities, and the dimensions are tailored accordingly. Not a cent more is spent than the Select Committee deems wise. The Select Committee considers it would be foolhardy not to provide dimensions which would enable schools, clubs and other organizations in their respective neighbourhoods to conduct their competitions adequately and, at the same time, pools to serve the greatest number of people. If Mr. BERNACCHI wishes to pursue the question, I should be delighted to answer in more technical detail.

MR. BERNACCHI:-I do indeed wish to pursue the question in greater detail. The answer that Mr. SALES has given as Chairman, and a very able Chairman of the Parks, Recreation & Amenities Select Committee, is in paragraph 3, the design of the new district swimming pools. He is speaking about the district swimming pools and he says "as well as facilities for competitive swimming at international stand- ards". My question is, I repeat, is a swimming pool designed to comply with international standards more expensive than a pool where one can go and swim, and if so, whether that will have any effect on the amount of swimming pools that the Urban Council can afford, either by its special vote or by the vote of the Finance Committee?

MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, if Mr. BERNACCHI, my colleague, had framed his question differently, he would have elicited the information that he wanted. Sir, how many swimming pools are there in a complex: there are seven swimming pools, ranging from toddlers' paddling pools, teaching pools, diving pool, to a full sized swimming pool, the surface area of which conforms with international standards, but not necessarily the depth, and that is where the saving in costs is brought about. The cost of a swimming pool need not necessarily be in the expanse, but in the capacity of the pool, and these swimming pools are designed so that various age groups can use them at one and the same time without the other pools having to be closed to the public. This is the point that has been brought out in the answer, and that is the purpose of the Select Committee. So conceivably, in any swimming pool complex, seven different organizations could use the same swimming pool complex in that area at one and the same time.