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for their comment and advice. And some very good comments and advice come from those whose duty it is to carry the proposed law into effect.

Mr. Chairman, I have nearly completed my address, but I would like to reimpress on members the emergency of this problem, and the fact that so many people are living in squalor, not of their own homes, but squalor of their surroundings i.e. the communal parts of the multi-storeyed buildings that they live in. Squalor which may be a very severe health risk during the coming summer and squalor which every citizen has a right to ask Government to see is removed, without having as a first preliminary to get together with a lot of other people perhaps of different views, and entering into a Deed of Mutual Covenant as regards sweeping the Communal parts, with the resulting difficulties of even thereafter enforcing this Deed.

I so move, Mr. Chairman,

DR. BELL:- Mr. Chairman, as I rise to second Mr. BERNACCHI'S motion, I would like to say that there was no collusion between us over what we were going to say in our speeches. I was informed by Mr. BERNACCHI at half past six last night that he had no seconder for his motion (Laughter) and could I please oblige. So any similarity in text is purely co-incidental.

I also would like to say that I see, whether I second it or not, the official members of this Council have received their instructions as to how they are to vote. (Laughter).

As a member of the environmental hygiene select committee of this council I have seen and studied a recently proposed scheme for voluntary management of subdivided buildings. I believe this scheme originated because so many members of the public who are owners and tenants of flats in nearly 200 different multi-storeyed buildings have been, to put it mildly, dissatisfied with the present condition of filth existing in communal parts and poorly operated communal facilities (e.g., lifts or supplies of flushing water) in these building and have complained to the Secretariat of Chinese affairs. In our Select Committee we were informed of the main outline of the proposed legislative backing for the management by owners of subdivided buildings. During the study of this proposed legislation Mr. CHEUNG Wing-in made some very valid legal points for possible inclusion and which of course would assist the voluntary management where it existed. I myself made a point that there should be a statutory limit on the charge to be levied for the services provided by the voluntary management and that the limit could perhaps be based on a percentage of the average rent paid and the number of flats in the building. My point being that tenants at present in some multi-storeyed blocks are being charged as much as $70 or $80 or more

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per month for such services and they have little or no redress if these charges are put up and up as when the management decides. The owner or landlords of vacant premises should also pay their share. Mr. BERNACCHI's motion today provides a further safeguard for the owners and occupiers of flats in multi-storeyed buildings by requesting that legislation should be enacted providing for the right of the Urban Services department staff (acting under the direction of this council) to go into and clean the communal parts of multi-storeyed buildings where there is no effective scheme for voluntary management and recover the costs of cleansing from the legal owners or occupiers. I think that this legislation would also be necessary where a voluntary management might exist but not be effective or efficient in the carrying out of its duties. I think that many owners and occupiers of flats would prefer to see the cleansing work of the communal parts of their buildings done by the Urban Services Department rather than by a Voluntary Management Scheme and I do not think the cost would be higher than the amounts now collected by the Voluntary Managements. These voluntary management Committees are often having changes of Chairmen and committee members and there is sometimes petty jealousy and scheming factions within the Committees resulting in lack of supervision of the actual staff employed for the carrying out of the cleansing jobs.

Mr. BERNACCHI has also asked that this Council should have the draft of such a bill as he proposes circulated to members of this Council before it is laid before members of the Legislative Council. A similar request was made during the Environmental Hygiene Select Committee regarding the draft for the suggested Scheme for Voluntary Management of subdivided building but the request was flatly turned down with no adequate reason given. I deplore this attitude because it is only this Council of the three Councils in Hong Kong which is intimately concerned with public health and cleansing and obviously it is most competent to initially vet the draft of any proposed legislation concerned with cleansing. This is not in any way usurping the role of our legislators in the Legislative Council but on the contrary it would surely be appreciated by them that the legislation to be passed had the full backing of this Council which is basically concerned with cleansing and has all the experienced staff on hand to give advice with regard to the implementation of the legislation.

As I see it this motion before us will provide an alternative for the cleansing of these multi-storeyed blocks where other means or schemes have failed and as it is our duty to protect and help the public in every way possible to maintain good public health and clean environment. I think this legislation in addition to legislation backing up the Voluntary Management Scheme would be very desirable. I have pleasure therefore to second this motion.

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