HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
MR. BERNACCHI:-Can I endeavour to answer this question? (Laughter).
CHAIRMAN:- Would be grateful for your help. (Laughter).
MR. BERNACCHI:-I think the answer is that it has never been tested out in court. (Laughter). There is a dispute as to whether this Council can be sued at all, that is this Council as a Statutory Body and Incorporated Body. Secondly, of course, there are the ordinary rules as to liability in any particular case. So I can quite see why the Legal Department, in this case, gave the advice to Mr. WRIGHT that they did give, that really they hope it will not be tried out, but if it is tried out then it is anybody's guess what the answer would be. (Laughter).
MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, may I, on behalf of the appointed members suggest to Dr. BELL, that she does not sacrifice herself by trying it out. (Laughter).
(8) DR. A. M. S. BELL asked the following question:-
Recently a member of the Hawker Control Force was imprisoned for corruption. During his trial he implicated several of his colleagues in the force. What investigations have been made into these allegations and what action if any taken?
THE CHAIRMAN replied as follows:-
A Police investigation was made and the advice of the Attorney General was sought. The advice of the Attorney General was that there was not sufficient evidence to prosecute anybody except Sergeant No. 53 who was the officer imprisoned.
Police inquiries continue in respect of alleged corruption in the Hawker Control Force.
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, I would like to ask a couple of supplementaries. Who carried out the investigation for the Attorney General. Was it the Anti-Corruption Branch?
CHAIRMAN: -I would assume so. It was a Police investigation. I would have to check the point later if you wish to know if it was the Anti-Corruption Branch.
DR. BELL: Has there been any investigation by the Urban Services Department into this, or by the Urban Council Hawkers Select Committee?
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
CHAIRMAN: -Not by the Urban Services Department so far as I am aware. This was a police matter. As regards the Hawkers Select Committee, perhaps the Chairman would comment.
MR. BERNACCHI:-The question has not been referred to the Hawkers Select Committee and the Hawkers Select Committee has not considered it.
MRS. ELLIOTT:-Mr. Chairman, may I ask the Chairman of the Hawkers Select Committee if he realizes that I asked this question about a month ago, but it has not yet appeared on the agenda; I mean I asked for it to be brought up at the meeting?
MR. BERNACCHI:-Now that I am reminded, Mrs. ELLIOTT, I do remember that you raised the question when the matter was still sub judice, and I think I advised that it would have to wait until the action had been concluded. Having been concluded, if any member of the Hawkers Select Committee chooses to bring it up, of course the Secretary will put it on the agenda.
MRS. ELLIOTT: --Mr. Chairman, may I remind you I brought the matter up after the matter had been made public? (Laughter).
MR. BERNACCHI:--In Select Committee or to the Secretary?
MRS. ELLIOTT:--I wrote to the Secretary, Mr. Ross.
MR. BERNACCHI: --Well I have no knowledge of that, but presumably it will appear on the agenda for the next Hawkers Select Committee. If you did write to Mr. Ross, who is a very very capable Secretary, he will undoubtedly put it on the agenda.
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, a third supplementary. Is it not true that the Hawker Control Force is under the direction of this Council?
CHAIRMAN: That is true, yes.
DR. BELL:-May I put it to you, was there perhaps sufficient evidence—although there was not sufficient evidence to prosecute was there perhaps sufficient evidence to dismiss these people from the Hawker Control Force? Was any investigation made to this end?
CHAIRMAN : —The Police do not disclose the particulars of their investigations unless and until such investigations lead to prosecution before the courts or other positive results have led to departmental action, and all I can say is to repeat what is in my reply, that Police inquiries are continuing.
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, I would ask you to refer to the Hawkers Select Committee, or perhaps even to the Standing Committee
Page 222 of 382
422
...
882
Page 221 of 382
420
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
MR. BERNACCHI:-Can I endeavour to answer this question? (Laughter).
CHAIRMAN:- Would be grateful for your help. (Laughter).
MR. BERNACCHI:-I think the answer is that it has never been tested out in court. (Laughter). There is a dispute as to whether this Council can be sued at all, that is this Council as a Statutory Body and Incorporated Body. Secondly, of course, there are the ordinary rules as to liability in any particular case. So I can quite see why the Legal Department, in this case, gave the advice to Mr. WRIGHT that they did give, that really they hope it will not be tried out, but if it is tried out then it is anybody's guess what the answer would be. (Laughter).
MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, may I, on behalf of the appointed members suggest to Dr. BELL, that she does not sacrifice herself by trying it out. (Laughter).
(8) DR. A. M. S. BELL asked the following question:-
Recently a member of the Hawker Control Force was im- prisoned for corruption. During his trial he implicated several of his colleagues in the force. What investigations have been made into these allegations and what action if any taken?
THE CHAIRMAN replied as follows:-
A Police investigation was made and the advice of the Attorney General was sought. The advice of the Attorney General was that there was not sufficient evidence to prosecute anybody except Sergeant No. 53 who was the officer imprisoned.
Police inquiries continue in respect of alleged corruption in
the Hawker Control Force.
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, I would like to ask a couple of sup- plementaries. Who carried out the investigation for the Attorney General. Was it the Anti-Corruption Branch?
CHAIRMAN: -I would assume so. It was a Police investigation. I would have to check the point later if you wish to know if it was the Anti-Corruption Branch.
DR. BELL: Has there been any investigation by the Urban Services Department into this, or by the Urban Council Hawkers Select Com- mittee?
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
421
CHAIRMAN: -Not by the Urban Services Department so far as 1 am aware. This was a police matter. As regards the Hawkers Select Committee, perhaps the Chairman would comment.
MR. BERNACCHI:-The question has not been referred to the Hawkers Select Committee and the Hawkers Select Committee has not considered it.
MRS. ELLIOTT:-Mr. Chairman, may I ask the Chairman of the Hawkers Select Committee if he realizes that I asked this question about a month ago, but it has not yet appeared on the agenda; I mean I asked for it to be brought up at the meeting?
MR. BERNACCHI:-Now that I am reminded, Mrs. ELLIOTT, I do remember that you raised the question when the matter was still sub juidice, and I think I advised that it would have to wait until the action had been concluded. Having been concluded, if any member of the Hawkers Select Committec choses to bring it up, of course the Secretary will put it on the agenda.
MRS. ELLIOTT: --Mr. Chairman, may I remind you I brought the matter up after the matter had been made public? (Laughter).
MR. BERNACCHI:--In Select Committee or to the Secretary?
MRS. ELLIOTT:--I wrote to the Secretary, Mr. Ross.
MR. BERNACCHI: --Well I have no knowledge of that, but presum- ably it will appear on the agenda for the next Hawkers Select Commit- tee. If you did write to Mr. Ross, who is a very very capable Secre- tary, he will undoubtedly put it on the agenda.
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, a third supplementary. Is it not true that the Hawker Control Force is under the direction of this Council?
CHAIRMAN: That is true, yes.
DR. BELL:-May I put it to you, was there perhaps sufficient evidence—although there was not sufficient evidence to prosecute was there perhaps sufficient evidence to dismiss these people from the Hawker Control Force? Was any investigation made to this end?
CHAIRMAN : —The Police do not disclose the particulars of their investigations unless and until such investigations lead to prosecution before the courts or other positive results have led to departmental action, and all I can say is to repeat what is in my reply, that Police inquiries are continuing.
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, I would ask you to refer to the Hawkers Select Committee, or perhaps even to the Standing Committee
No comments yet.
Private notes are available after approval.