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MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, in his reply, Mr. Li said "that he did bring this matter, or this matter was discussed by the Traffic Advisory Committee in July." In July of what year, this year?
MR. LI:-Sir, in July of this year.
MR. HU:-And this year, at that meeting, was this matter discussed in private or in public?
MR. LI:-Sir, the meetings of the Traffic Advisory Committee are always private meetings.
MR. HU: Since the establishment of the Traffic Advisory Committee was there any meeting of that Committee which was held in public?
MR. LI:-Sir, not to my knowledge.
(Laughter).
MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, through you, I would submit to Mr. Li, four photographs taken by me. Will you show them to Mr. Li?
You realize, Mr. Li, that this road is too narrow. Is it correct that this road is only 20 feet in width?
MR. LI:-Sir, I do not have any particular papers on this particular road or any other road, but I will look into the matter later.
DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS:-Mr. Chairman, I can answer that one-it is 20 feet.
MR. HU: Mr. LI, if you look at photograph No. 1. Do you agree that it is very easy for this road to be widened?
MR. LI: Mr. Chairman, I do not think that I need be subjected to any cross-examination. (Laughter).
MR. HU:-It has already been two years since the widening of this road was raised, yet it has not been finished. Is that correct?
MR. LI:-I think possibly the Honourable Director of Public Works would be in a better position to answer this question.
MRS. ELLIOTT:-Mr. Chairman, may we ask Mr. LI-I don't want to cross-examination him-but may we ask Mr. Li to bring the matter again before the Traffic Advisory Committee, because I know the same piece of road has been brought before them about two years ago by myself, as well as other people, and nothing seems to be done. I think it is very serious?
MR. LI:-I will do that, Sir.
DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS:-Mr. Chairman, perhaps I could say, if the Council would bear with me on the question of Government
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finance, that, in this particular case there is some money in this year's estimates for the work to be done, and I hope it will be possible to start before the end of this year. I only hope this will be possible. Funds are available, the necessary drawings and so on have been done, and unless something unforeseen happens we should be able to let a contract before the end of this year.
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, in connexion with what Mrs. ELLIOTT was saying about "having been brought before the Traffic Advisory Committee more than two years ago", may I perhaps say that I think the crux of the matter there is where Mr. Li says in his reply "that none of these accidents was fatal." I have noticed that there is a tendency when black spots arise, or what I would call black spots, the traffic police here don't call them black spots unless they have had a number of fatal accidents at these spots. I think what everybody here, if I may say so, have been trying to do, is to prevent those fatal accidents occurring, and I think if Mr. Li could perhaps convey our intention to the Traffic Advisory Committee in those terms, perhaps they would take some more definite action, rather than just having the police keeping a watch on this road, because I have noticed, if I may say so, Mr. Chairman, that the Police tend to keep a watch on a great many of these black spots, or what I would call black spots, but perhaps they are only known as grey spots to the police; but they do only keep a watch, they do not take any active action in directing traffic as we would expect, and I would like Mr. Li to convey my remarks to the Advisory Committee on traffic.
MR. SALES: Sir, may the appointed members also be given your indulgence for making speeches at question time? (Laughter).
MRS. ELLIOTT:-Mr. Chairman, may we strengthen this argument about crossings by reminding the Traffic Advisory Committee that we do have fatal accidents near Lo Fu Ngam on Junction Road, and we have been promised a crossing and it is still not there?
MR. LI: I will put the remarks of Dr. BELL and Mrs. ELLIOTT to the Traffic Advisory Committee.
MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, through you I would ask Mr. Li, does he know that there was one accident on the 2nd October, just after the 30th September, as he indicated in paragraph 3, and there were two accidents on the 9th October this year. On the 2nd October one small child received very serious injury, and on the 9th October another child was badly hurt. On the same day another old woman was also knocked unconscious. Does Mr. Li know of these three accidents? (Laughter).
MR. LI:-Mr. Chairman, I thank Mr. Hu for putting these figures to me.
The figures in my reply I think were actually supplied by the Traffic Department of the Police Department, and if Mr. Hu would
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MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, in his reply, Mr. Lr said "that he did bring this matter, or this matter was discussed by the Traffic Advisory Committee in July." In July of what year, this year?
MR. LI:-Sir, in July of this year.
MR. HU:-And this year, at that meeting, was this matter discussed in private or in public?
MR. LI-Sir, the meetings of the Traffic Advisory Committee are always private meetings.
MR. HU: Since the establishment of the Traffic Advisory Com- mittee was there any meeting of that Committee which was held in public?
MR. LI:-Sir, not to my knowledge.
(Laughter).
MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, through you, I would submit to Mr. Li, four photographs taken by me. Will you show them to Mr. Li?
You realize, Mr. Li, that this road is too narrow. Is it correct that this road is only 20 feet in width?
MR. LI-Sir, I do not have any particular papers on this particular road or any other road, but I will look into the matter later.
DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS: -Mr. Chairman, I can answer that one-it is 20 feet.
MR. HU: Mr. LI, if you look at photograph No. 1. Do you agree that it is very easy for this road to be widened?
MR. LI: Mr. Chairman, I do not think that I need be subjected to any cross-examination. (Laughter).
MR. HU-It has already been two years since the widening of this road was raised, yet it has not been finished. Is that correct?
MR. LI-I think possibly the Honourable Director of Public Works would be in a better position to answer this question.
MRS. ELLIOTT:-Mr. Chairman, may we ask Mr. LI-I don't want to cross-examination him-but may we ask Mr. Li to bring the matter again before the Traffic Advisory Committee, because I know the same piece of road has been brought before them about two years ago by myself, as well as other people, and nothing seems to be done. I think it is very serious?
MR. LI: -I will do that, Sir.
DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS:-Mr. Chairman, perhaps I could say, if the Council would bear with me on the question of Government
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
369
finance, that, in this particular case there is some money in this year's estimates for the work to be done, and I hope it will be possible to start before the end of this year. I only hope this will be possible. Funds are available, the necessary drawings and so on have been done, and unless something unforeseen happens we should be able to let a contract before the end of this year.
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, in connexion with what Mrs. ELLIOTT was saying about "having been brought before the Traffic Advisory Committee more than two years ago", may I perhaps say that I think the crux of the matter there is where Mr. Li says in his reply "that none of these accidents was fatal." I have noticed that there is a tendency when black spots arise, or what I would call black spots, the traffic police here don't call them black spots unless they have had a number of fatal accidents at these spots. I think what everybody here, if 1 may say so, have been trying to do, is to prevent those fatal accidents occurring, and I think if Mr. Li could perhaps convey our intention to the Traffic Advisory Committee in those terms, perhaps they would take some more definite action, rather than just having the police keep- ing a watch on this road, because I have noticed, if I may say so, Mr. Chairman, that the Police tend to keep a watch on a great many of these black spots, or what I would call black spots, but perhaps they are only known as grey spots to the police; but they do only keep a watch, they do not take any active action in directing traffic as we would expect, and I would like Mr. Li to convey my remarks to the Advisory Committee on traffic.
MR. SALES: Sir, may the appointed members also be given your indulgence for making speeches at question time? (Laughter).
MRS. ELLIOTT:-Mr. Chairman, may we strengthen this argument about crossings by reminding the Traffic Advisory Committee that we do have fatal accidents near Lo Fu Ngam on Junction Road, and we have been promised a crossing and it is still not there?
MR. LI: I will put the remarks of Dr. BELL and Mrs. ELLIOTT to the Traffic Advisory Committee.
MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, through you I would ask Mr. Li, does he know that there was one accident on the 2nd October, just after the 30th September, as he indicated in paragraph 3, and there were two accidents on the 9th October this year. On the 2nd October one small child received very serious injury, and on the 9th October another child was badly hurt. On the same day another old woman was also knock- ed unconscious. Does Mr. Li know of these three accidents? (Laughter). MR. LI :-Mr. Chairman, I thank Mr. Hu for putting these figures The figures in my reply I think were actually supplied by the Traffic Department of the Police Department, and if Mr. Hu would
to me.
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