CO885-(6-7) — Page 474

480

PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE

Reference :-

C.O. 885

6

PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON

ALLY WITHOUT PERMISSION OF THE BE REPRODUCED PHOTOGRAPHIC- COPYRIGHT PHOTOGRAPH-NOT TO

78

this would

Mr. Kingston.] Possibly a full inquiry may assist us in convincing our Parliament and people that it will be a reciprocal advantage; if So, help us very much."

The Secretary of State.] What form do you propose that such an inquiry should take; a Royal Commission, is it?

Mr. Seddon.] Yes, a Royal Commission, and composed of manufacturers and commercial men, and you might, I think, have Colonial as well as home representatives on the commission.

The Secretary of State.] It would not be very much use without, I think. Mr. Seddon.] No.

The Secretary of State.] But where is the Commission to sit to make this inquiry?

Mr. Seddon.] We think it should go to the Colonies.

Sir George Turner.] A certain portion of them, not the whole Commission; certain representative men should there.

go

Mr. Seddon.] Visit New South Wales and Victoria.

Sir Wilfrid Laurier.] Have you come to any understanding at all as to what should be the scope and object and composition of the Commission ? What would be the character Can you give us any information as to that.

and the composition and the object and the purport of that Commission ?

Mr. Seddon.] First of all, it should be composed of commercial men and manufacturing experts, I would say, as regards the manufactures and that class of goods now exclusively used in the Colonies.

Sir Wilfrid Laurier.] Class of goods what ?

Mr. Seddon.] That are markets.

Sir Wilfrid Laurier.] Yes.

now in favour and suitable for the Colonial

Mr. Seddon. Then what is more material than anything else is the way that business is done. The English custom here is f.o.b., while Germany and other countries are all doing c.i.f.

Sir Wilfrid Laurier.] Yes, very well, I understand that.

Mr. Seddon.] Then independently of that they have the travellers who go everywhere, and go over the head of the importers who are in the Colony, who keep up and who are in touch with the British importers; they go over them altogether and they go direct. Unfortunately some of the im- porters in the Colonies commenced doing the retail as well as the importing ; that drove the smaller class of merchants in the interior second class towns to go past the importer in the Colony and give their orders to the foreigner.

Mr. Reid.] And the English too.

Mr. Seddon.] And the English too.

Sir George Turner.] It will extend to the foreigner because they think they get it a bit cheaper.

Not only that they have got their cheap freight; Mr. Seddon.] That is so. with these subsidised foreign boats the freight is arranged by the exporter and the manufacturer. The retailer simply gets his invoice, and he has nothing marked off his goods. He has no insurance or trouble with that as with the old system; it is all done for him.

Sir Wilfrid Laurier.] I understand all this, but I do not see how the information which you could have through this Commission upon any of these points which you have just enumerated would at all bear upon the question of giving a preference or otherwise to British goods.

Mr. Seddon.] Another question which would have to be carefully inquired

79

into is to what extent foreign-made goods are sent here shipped from the mother country as English-manufactured goods, imported into the Colonies as British-marked goods, now which are known by the Customs authorities. It would have to be determined at 12 per cent. of the total, that is, by an That is estimate; but from very reliable evidence the actual is 33 per a report signed by Mr. Best, Commissioner of Trade and Customs for Victoria, and in the hands of the Imperial Government. There are instances of that kind but we want to get at them.

cent.

Sir Wilfrid Laurier.] If you had a Parliament in favour of British- made goods, the moment you ascertained that 33 per cent. of goods came in through Great Britain, but not from Great Britain, only through it, they would not be subject to that preference.

Mr. Seddon.] The difficulty is in stating what are British goods. For We know, of instance, we will take the Manchester paper card business. course, in the Colonies that all the editorial work is done here, and they are sent away, and the printing is all done in Germany or Holland, and it is sent back here and shipped as British.

Sir Wilfrid Laurier.] You would have a tariff whether such goods should

be admitted or not.

Mr. Seddon.] It is not a question of the goods.

Sir Wilfrid Laurier.] The question we have to consider is whether or not it would be advisable at this moment to give this preference which Canada has given. If the Colonies are prepared to follow, I think it would be a great advantage, from the moral point of view-a very great gain to the Imperial idea, which is one of the chief benefits which I see in it at present I think, very myself. Of course, there are indirect advantages which are, great; indirect advantages by way of not so much increasing the trade of Canada as by a displacement of trade between Canada and Great Britain, and in favour of Canada and Great Britain.

Then

Mr. Seddon. And then what we think with respect to this inquiry; we think first of all that you have got to show what the volume of trade is, and that for some time past the mother country has been losing ground. you want to find out next what is the cause; how has she lost ground; is it by her inferior manufacture of goods; is it her mode of doing business, or what is the cause of the loss of trade. Is it this subsidising or these bonuses by foreign nations? That you could arrive at, and you want them in England.

The Secretary of State.] Is not that really a matter which is chiefly for the manufacturers and others concerned. Our great manufacturers here in every line of trade send their agents out to the Colonies, and they are travelling there and getting this information. Practically the whole of it is more or less. at our disposal already. Questions of this kind are not absolute questions of fact which can be determined by any Commission; they are questions of estimate, and there is always a difference of opinion as to the result. But I may point out the other day I sent a circular round to all the Colonies. That brought together a great deal of information of this kind both as to the amount of foreign business being done, which appeared to be very much less than some persons on this side imagine; as to the causes of that preference

of which is

some now given to foreign goods in

our Colonies, form

blue book and general observations, which

very large which has been published and circulated, and has resulted, I think, in a con- All this is very siderable awakening of the public mind on the whole subject. desirable, but I do not think we would get anything more from the Commis- sion suggested.

8

Sir George Turner.] Would not the Commission give more publicity to that and send it further.

The Secretary of State.] Oh, certainly not. A Commission is nothing more public than this report. This is a Parliamentary blue book, that is all.

K 4

COMMERCIAL RELATIONS.