་
PUBLIC
RECORD OFFICE
Reference :-
PC.O. 882
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It must have decreased; it is no longer clandestine. There is no such thing as clandestine prostitution now. All the rikisha coolies know where these people live.
Mr. Evans-Do you not know that there is now more prostitution among would-be I refer to Chinese respectable women, having husbands of sorts, than there used to be? almost entirely; you can take all my remarks as referring to the Chinese more par- ticularly. Have you heard that!
No.
You have not heard complaints by respectable Chinese that would-be respectable women are now more apt to take to prostitution than they were before, because they have not the fear of the law before their eyes! In the old days they were afraid to do it because they were afraid of being arrested.
Is it supposed they carry on prostitution in their own houses!
Mr. Evans-No, not in their own houses; they go to these accommodation houses, where you can go and pay $1 or 50 cents for the use of a room.
I have not heard that.
Colonel Pennefather-Don't you think the possibility of being brought within the operation of the C.D. Act would act as additional deterrent to some wonnen not to lose their chastity!
Yes, I suppose it might.
With regard to No. 4, the Chairman asked whether it was not rather reversing things; because a woman first unsexes herself, you reproach us because we examine her.
Then you think the examination does not outrage her?
The Chairman-With a view to prevent her from injuring others.
Colonel Pennefather-Do you think it degrades any of these prostitutes in their
own eyes?
Yes. Ladies who have spoken with these women have been told by them that they object to the examination. They consider it degrading.
Mr. Evans-Does it appear to you to be more degrading to these women to be examined by a medical man and sent to hospital for treatment, or to be compelled, as they are now, to carry on prostitution when they are suffering from venereal disease?
I don't see why you should compare the two.
Dr. Simon-Because those are the existing conditions.
Mr. Evans--The majority of prostitutes in Singapore are suffering from venereal disease and practise prostitution; they are not free agents. Can you, under any cir- cumstances, imagine that it is better for them to practise prostitution when they are diseased than to be examined by a medical man?
The question of their being degraded by the inspection does not enter into that at all. The question which you raise is whether it is more degrading for a woman to practise prostitution when she is cliseased than when she is not?
Mr. Evans-The majority of women are unwell and practise prostitution. That may be the case. I don't know that that justifies you in committing a
further outrage upon them.
Dr. Simon--A lesser outrage.
A further outrage.
From any point of view you cannot contend that it would be an outrage to have these women examined by a medical man and put in hospital?
Certainly, I think it is an outrage.
Dr. Middleton-Do you consider it an outrage for a woinan who is not a prosti-
Lute to be examined medically?
Not if she undergoes it willingly.
But suppose the prostitutes are willing?
It is the compulsory nature of it which is the degradation.
Mr. Evans-Don't you think a married man would be justified in ordering his wife to submit to examination if he knew she were suffering from a disease which must bo attended to?
Yes, but he is her husband.
Colonel Pennefather-I understand you to say that examination is an outrage when made compulsory by law, but not when sought by private persons out of regard for their own health?
The Chairman---Why do you object to the Government doing systematically what private persons may do on a small scale?
It is a degradation because it is done for a certain purpose, the purpose being to make the woman fit for further prostitution.
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The Chairman-Are you not asking too much? Mr. Evans-You are begging the question, sir.
The Chairman-It may be so on the part of the brothel-keeper. Examination tends to that end.
The Chairman-It might tend to the rescue of the woman also?
It might, but in the majority of cases it does not.
Are you aware that at present the prostitutes in many of the brothels are obliged
to go before a medical man for examination by the brothel-keepers?
I don't know what has taken place in the last year or two, but some two or three
years ago I know that a certain amount of compulsion was brought to bear.
As that is done by the brothel-keepers in certain cases at present, do you think it would be more of an outrage to have it done under the law?
I think it is an outrage now.
It is an outrage you cannot prevent under the present system. You do not propose to prevent it.
We do not propose to prevent it, we only propose to do it under regulation. Under No. 4, might I ask you what is the alternative if examination is not to be compulsory? Is not the only alternative that these women must continue in disease? They cannot be cured unless somebody steps in.
The women ought certainly to go to hospital and be cured, but it is quite another thing to compel them to go.
Mr. Evans-Do you know that these women are not aware that they require treat- ment, and allow the disease, which could easily be cured if taken at once, to develop until they are absolutely incurable? Do you think it is an outrage to point out, when they are thus diseased, that they require treatment?
It depends upon the means employed.
The Chairman-Although you approve of women coming voluntarily and being examined by medical men, yet you disapprove of their being examined systematically and compulsorily; but where is the difference between the compulsory examination and segregation of a man suffering from small-pox in the public interest? Why should you object to the examination and segregation of a woman who is communicating disease to
others?
One is an indecent outrage. You do not require to examine a person's private parts to see whether he has got small-pox or typhoid fever.
The Chairman-I don't see where the outrage comes in. In the indecency of it.
You cannot cure people without it. They themselves have committed the outrage. All the arguments which have been adduced are precisely the same for European women as for Chinese.
I think the question turns upon The Chairman-The women are not the same. whether the women are free agents or not.
There are hundreds of women in European countries who are not free agents. Passing on to No. 5, the Chairman said he failed to see why the registration of prostitutes was contrary to common law; they registered all other dangerous trades
You propose to make it a trade then?
place.
We don't make it a trade, it is a trade, and one of the most paying trades in the The Chairman-By No. 6, do you mean that the same treatment should be meted out to both sexes? In what way does the State forget its duty of affording equal pro- tection to both sexes?
I should say from improper pressure being brought to bear on the prostitutes. Colonel Pennefather-Improper pressure to do what.
As you are aware, I suppose, prostitutes who are licensed have suffered very cruelly in European countries from all sorts of abuses by the police-blackmailing and being driven into prostitution. Men are not required, according to the C.D. Act, to submit themselves to registration or anything of the kind.
The Chairman-No, because they are not carrying on a trade. They are carrying on the traffic, which is practically the same.
as much engaged in the trade as the woman is.
The Chairman-No, because he makes no money out of it.
The man is just
The
How does that affect the question? The man is just as guilty as the woman. man cannot be touched because he refuses to be touched; the woman we touch because she is in our power.
1917
K
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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON
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