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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE
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C.O. 885
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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON
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exempt from duty. Well, unfortunately in all the Colonies of Australia, at any rate with the exception of New South Wales, we are dependent, entirely dependent, for the bulk of our revenue, or for very nearly the customs duties, and it is therefore moiety of our revenue upon our impracticable for us to remit those duties as against English products. But if the suggestion would be acceptable to the British Government, I, for my own part, would be very pleased to recommend my Parliament to give a preference to British goods by imposing an additional duty on all foreign goods, and supposing the federation which we hope for comes about, there is very little question that my right honourable friend, Mr. Reid, will try to secure that free trade tariff which he hopes for, but that the federated Colonies, having obtained that tariff, that federal tariff, which is necessary for us, I have no doubt, as he has said, he will work with us in framing such a tariff as would give the required preference to England.
Mr. Reid.] In other words, if I am compelled to be a Protectionist, I should be a Protectionist with the strongest disposition to protect the English against foreigners.
Sir E. N. C. Braddon.] Then you and I would be in entire agreement.
The Secretary of State.] I am not quite certain whether I understand it. Do I understand that assuming the treaties disappeared you would be in favour of increasing the duties on foreign goods?
Sir E. N. C. Braddon.] Certainly.
The Secretary of State.] Immediately?
Sir E. C. N. Braddon.] Yes.
All
Mr. Reid.] Might I make one observation upon what my friend Mr. Kingston said. It may not have occurred to him, but he did not seem to give sufficient prominence to it. On this question of doing something at once without something being done for the Colonies. My friend is so intelligent that I must apologise for making this remark, for, I am sure that it must have occurred to him. He did not seem to lay sufficient stress upon it. foreign nations shut out Australian raw products by heavy duties, Great Britain does not; SO that on
a question between Great Britain and foreign nations at the present moment it seems to me that there is an element which might be taken into consideration; I mean as between Great Now I Britain and foreign nations, giving Great Britain an advantage. would have no hesitation myself in reference to, say, spirits, although it is a very undesirable element to touch, I would have no hesitation myself in doing something in that direction, except that we have got exactly the same duty against our own people in distillation. Our distillation laws and excise laws compel our own manufacturers to pay exactly the same duties that we call upon the British to pay, so that inasmuch as we do not give our own people a preference I am on perfectly safe ground in having a difficulty in giving England a preference.
The Secretary of State.] But you might do what Sir George Turner pro- poses to do, and increase the foreign duty.
On
Mr. Reid.] Yes, but my standpoint is entirely different from that. principle I am against all these things, but I say that if I were on a protectionist footing I should certainly be prepared for these new departures, just as England would find no difficulty in these new departures. I would venture to come out of my own paddock for a moment in order to point out to Mr. Kingston that, inasmuch as Great Britain is the only open market that Australians have got for their raw products, there might be some opening for an immediate preference, and I would be prepared myself, feeling so strongly in the matter, even to appear inconsistent with my own I should policy of free trade if the other Colonies would take the matter up ; be inclined to follow them on that point even at the risk of being taunted a good deal as a free-trader with inconsistency. I feel so strongly about it that if the other Colonies went in for such proposals,-I cannot promise it
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exactly, but I should be strongly disposed at any risk to imitate them in the few matters that we have on our tariff.
Mr. Kingston.] The same reasons that induced Mr. Reid to comment ou my observations induce me to reply to him. He puts it that in New South Wales they make no distinction between their own people and others in the question of the excise duties. Now I am happy to say that I am not responsible for that. But in South Australia we do; we give a preference to our own distillers over the foreign importers, and we find it works to very considerable advantage. Mr. Reid also puts it that we should give a preference to Britain because Britain admits our goods free, and other nations do not. But Britain draws no distinction between foreign nations and her own Colonies, and the goods, the food she takes from foreign hands which might be busily employed next day in attempting her national destruction, are taxed no more heavily than the goods which she receives from her own people across the sea, who might be relied upon at all times to help her.
Mr. Seddon.] There is another question as regards trade with the Colonies and foreign countries as regards raw products, and it has been given effect to Canada has her treaty with France, and arranges by Canada and France.
to take French wines. France, of course, will take her timber and other products. That is now in existence, and that in no way injures Great Britain. Any of the Colonies can do that without interfering or injuring the mother country. I myself might make an arrangement with South Australia to take her wines if she in turn would reciprocate with New Zealand. I simply say that I reserve to myself, as far as New Zealand is concerned, that where it can be done without injury to the mother country to
do it.
Sir W. I'. Whiteway.] The only observation I have to make is this: we have a warm aspiration to cultivate the best relationships with the mother country, but we are peculiarly situated, inasmuch as our whole revenue is dependent upon our import duties.
Sir H. M. Nelson.] That is precisely our case,
The Secretary of State.] That would not prevent you putting a higher duty on foreign goods.
Sir W. V. Whitewny.] I was just going on to observe that so far as our exports were concerned the mother country takes a comparatively small to the Brazils, the West Indies, the amount of them; our exports are Mediterrancan, and foreign countries. In respect of manufactured goods,, we import almost all from the mother country at the present moment: we import very little of that description from elsewhere. It would be difficult for us to draw any distinction between those articles which are imported for food, such as flour, pork. &e. Of these, at the present moment, we get a certain quantity from Canada, but more, and that such as our fishermen require, from the United States, and not from Canada, Now we should like to have a free hand to make concessions to those countries where the markets suit our purpose in order to obtain some concessions as regards our exports to those countries. For instance, we will take Spain; we lower our duties on the wines imported from Spain in order to obtain lower duties on our fish exported there. We desire to open the United States market for our fish and raw ores, and to make concessions to them in return. Therefore, with all that strong disposition to do any thing which can be done in relation to the cultivation of better feelings between the Colonies and the ruother country, I scarcely see my way at the present time to point out a definite course of action; therefore I must be satisfied with simply laying down a general principle that I should wish to follow in the lines which have been suggested. Sir John Forrest.] Mr. Chamberlain, I am quite in accord with the other speakers on this question to the extent that I should be very glad if it were possible to assist legislation by which preference could be given to the products of the mother country as against the products of foreign countries. I do not know exactly what is understood by the term "mother country," whether it means the dependencies of the Empire
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COMMERCIAL RELATIONS.