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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE
Reference -
11C.O. 885
6
ALLY WITHOUT PERMISSION OF THE BE REPRODUCED PHOTOGRAPHIC- COPYRIGHT PHOTOGRAPH—NOT TO
PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON
26 November 1896.] The Marquess of TWEEDDALE, Mr. H. A. C. SAUNDERS,
and Mr. F. E. HIESSE.
Mr. Murray-continued, convey your messages at anything like a reason- able speel. The cable that has been suggested, that is, 650 lbs. copper and 400 lbs. gutta percha (the weight of our last Atlantic cable), is considered the best cable that has ever been laid. The greatest capacity that has been laid up to this date. Well, according to the figures which lave just been submitted to the Committee, that would only give you about two payable words a minute, working simplex, as the whole of the traffic is The whole practically one way at any one time.
of the business from both sides of the Atlantic is compressed into a very short time--about an hour or two, and, therefore, the duplex is of immense value. Then there is one point which has not been dwelt upon I notice, under the head of Mainten- ance; and that is the question of the necessity for amortisation. I observe that it has been stated that this is not necessary, at any rate in the early life of the cable, but that does not accord at all with my experience either in the Eastern seas or in the Atlantic. On the contrary, we have always advocated a sum being set apart. from the very commencement of a cable's life, for reserve or amortisation of the capital, and I do not think it would be wise for a Government
or any company to go into cable-laying unless they intended to provide a sum either in the shape of a reserve fund or of amortisation of some character.
1935. Have you got any figure in your mind of what it is proper to set aside for depreciation? Yes, we consider that we ought to have a reserve fund equal, or nearly equal, to the cost
of a cable.
1936. In how inany years? For instance, taking the life of a cable, from 20 to 24 years,
1937. You think the operation ought to be, then, that you would lay aside each year a sum sufficient to provide a new cable in 25 years' time? That is the ideal. I think, but in practice -now, for instance, in the Atlantic Company's, before this last cable was laid, we had four cables of different ages. The figure that we settled upon. was 1,000,0002, which, of course is nothing like the value of four cables; but still we fix that as the minimum reserve fund that we should have. Well, that was reduced by the moking of this last cable the 1894 cable, as it was called-by the cost of the cable; but we still go on adding to the reserve fund, and we intend to do so up to the figure that I have mentioned.
1938. That is, over and above the actual cost of the repairs?—Well, the repairs come out of the renewal fund as a rule. (Mr. Hesse.) But the figure that I gave to the Chairman of 50,0007. for the ships without cable, was exclusive of amortisation or renewal.
Chairman.
1989. But the cable that would be used would be included?—It might be used, and at the end of 20 or 25 years, or whatever the period taken, the cable might have to be entirely renewed. We have had that experience in some
seas.
At the end of 14 years we have had to
Chairman-continued.
[Continued.
26 November 1896.]
entirely renew a cable, although we had effected many costly repairs previously,
1940. Was that a modern cable ? A modern cable. (Marquess of Tweedale.) Well, in the case of the Brest cable, as it is known, from Brest to St. Pierre, near Newfoundland, that cable has had to be abandoneil. It is an example, a very good example, of the danger of laying a rable without a proper survey.
The chief cause of the loss of that cable was a great depression outside Brest, about 150 miles to sea, There is a precipice or something of that sort, over which the cable ebafed; and besides that, further on towards America, the bottom proved to be ex- tremely rocky; and after an immense amout of money had been spent on the repair of that cable, and the renewal of it, we have had practically to abandon it, and our cables are now laid more to the north.
Mr. Murray.
YOU
1941. But, suppose we adopted what described as the counsel of perfection
just now, that is, complete amortisation in 23 years, how much would you allow for annual repairs besides the cost of the repairing ships.— That is the Pacific you are referring to now?
We
1942. Well, I was speaking generally? - You see we know so little about the Pacific. know a great deal now about the Atlantic; we know so much that we have actually got a little model of the bottom of the Atlantic; and, although it is only approximate, it still gives something like an idea; but you have no idea whatever of the bottom of the Pacific. think you have. Mr. Hesse) Not of the southern part of it. (Mr. Saunders.) No; well, there are large tracts which have been un- surveyed ; you do not know what you may get there. You come across 5,000 fathoms some- times.
I do not
1943. Passing to another point, I gather that it would be fair to say that your Australian lines are now working about 17 hours out of the 24 ?---
Marquess of Tweeddale. That is so.
1944. Seventeen hours continuously ?— (Mr. Hesse | Continuously. But we are not working all our cables (ie., duplicate and triplicate lines) similtaneously.
1945. That means that you could do, on the existing lines, about 35 per cent, more business if you had it-Exactly. (Marquess of
got Tweeddate.) If we had got it, yes; but still more business would be crowded into that time.
1946. If it came in at the right time?—If it
came in.
1947. At the right time?--Yes. All cables are in that condition; that is to say, the Atlantic cable can do four times or ten times the work that it has at present; but then you see the messages must come in at a certain time, or the parties do not get any advantage of them. (Mr. Hesse.) On some sections we could work duplex night and day, but we do not find it necessary to do so in consequence of the paucity of the traffic, so that we have a large reserve power.
The Marquess of TWEEDDALE, Mr. H. A. C. SAUNDERS, [Continued,
and Mr. F. E. Hesse.
Mr. Murray-continued. 1948. What possibility is there of delaying traffic-What are the limits, do you think, within which you could afford to delay telegrams? -(Marquess of Iwerddały Well, we have often considered the advisability of establishing first and second class messages: but I do not think it has ever taken. Mr. Hess.) No, the public a nut like the idea of having their messages delayed at all. In some places, where it has been tried, the public have preferred pay- ing double or treble rates in order to get the messages through quickly,
1949. The rule is, of course, to take every message in order. I suppose?—¿Marquess of Turrildale That is so.
1950. You could not vary the order?-No. Mr. Hesse. Of course Government messages have precedence always.
1951. You think that in the present and in the immediate fiture there could really be no demand, as a matter of business, for any further cable capacity ?—( Marquess of Tivi dúdles. Not so far as the mere e nveying of the words is concerned.
Of course, a strategic cable is another matter. Mr. Hose For commercial purposes there is no necessity, from our point of view, for any more cable power.
no
1952. Have you any difficulty in dealing with the traffic that you do get within reasonable limits of time? No, none whatever. Unless there are interruptions on the Government land lines, which eeur sometimes, there is difficulty in handling the traffic during the business hours. Marquess of Tweeddates We have had considerable traffic, as Mr. Hesse has mentioned, on the Western Australian fines, which are new land lines, and where the organisa- tion is very imperfect, and we have had block- in consequence of that, and that, of course, blocks the whole of our lines as well. Then an accumula- tion of messages takes place, and that delays our messages; but that is only temporary. The Western Australian Government are seeing the necessity of putting them in order, Mr. Hesse. On one or two occasions it has been necessary fo
send large batches of messages between Perth and Sydney, or Adelaide, round by the Java All the way to Java, then, by Port Darwin over the overland line to their destina- tion.
route.
1953. You estimated the traffic that would be diverted from your company at 672,000 words? —Marquess of Tweeddule. Yes,
1954-5. You calculated that on the assump tion that you would keep the whole of the West Australian traffic?-Yes, I think if
you would look at that you will see (showing map); that is the Australian land line to Port Darwin. That was made you know in the time of Sir James Fergusson, when he was Governor there. and this is the West Australian land line, You see it is not for love of us, I do not put it on that basis at all, although I have no doubt they have a regard for us, but it is their interest obviously to send the messages along their own lines.
1956. It is now?—It is now, and it would be
then.
1957. Well, that would be a matter of arrange-
Mr. Murray-continued.
ment, would it mot, You can conceive circum- stances, I mean, under which that inducement would disappear ? Some inducement made to take them along this way. (Mr. Hesse.) Com- pensating the Governments. Marquess of Tweeddal. Yes, I understand. (Mr. Hessr.) But I think our service would be
so much quicker, that this traffe would certainly go ciá India. Marquess of Tweeddale.) For instance, all this Traffic would go by the shortest route, the quickest route to many parts,
1958. Do you not think the other route would be quicker than yours?-Oh, it is impossible that it could be quicker.
1959, How many repeating stations would you have between Perth and London? Not more than eight.
1960. How many would there be the other way? -The repetition does not take many seconds, (Mr. Saunders. It is simultaneous. The clerk receives it and sends it on in many stations.
1961. Then what is the reason why the mes- sage takes two and three hours? It might be the lines may not be free for a message. You see very frequently messages get out in an hour. (Mr. Hesse.) Many of the messages take only half-an-hour. Of course we could send a message through in a few minutes to Australia if the line were clear; we have done so.
1962. If you had everything clear?—If we had the line clear. One message a year or two ago cost 1,000. It was an account of a recon- struction scheme; one of those bank reconstruc- tion schemes. Every word had to be trans- mitted.
1963. And you do not find as a matter of practice then that the number of repeating stations has anything to do with it. It does not make very much difference. (Mr. Saunders,) Not very much. (Marquess of Tworddale,). It rather reduces the number of paying words, that is what it does.
1964. Then is your estimate of a diversion of 672,000 words based on the assumption that the tariff would be the same by both routes?- (Marquess of Tweeddale.) Oh, yes, that is a necessity, because otherwise undirected messages would go by the cheapest route.
1965. Then you contemplate that would
you have to reduce your rate to whatever is fixed for the new line? Yes, because we should lose in addition all the undirected messages. (Mr. Hesse.) Oh, we should certainly have to reduce.
1966. Would that be the diversion that you would expect in the first year?-( Marquess of
Tweeddule.) Yes.
1967. And it would continue in the same proportions (Mr. Hesse.) Yes, it would vary according to the working of the Pacific cable. If there was an interruption during the second or third year, for some months, of course the present route would carry the whole traffic. Marquess of Twerddale.) Yos, and that raises the question of the necessity of duplication.
1968. I was just coming to that. You hold strongly, I suppose, that a single cable is in practice scarcely workable?—That is the principle that we have gone on, as you can see. You take
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