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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON
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5 January, 1920.]
COLONIAL MEDICAL SERVICES COMMITTEE,
DR. B. H. R. Lucr.
1888. What is the highest salary that he could attain to think £800 a year. He gets foes, of course, as well; and less than that in Penang; I think it is £600 or £660.
1889. Is there anyone on the medical side in the same position, a physician?--No, that is one of the grievances.
1870. Why not? I do not know.
1871. Dr. Hood: Do the Principal Medical Officers
[Continued.
of the Unfederated Malay States issue an Annual Report? I cannot say; I have never seen them, though I think the medical officer in Johore does.
1872. You issue an Annual Report? Yes. 1878. You do not embody the medical work of the Unfederated State-Ob no, I have nothing to do with it. I think Kedab probably is published, and Johore.
Chairman: Thank you.
(The Witness withdrew.)
DR. G. B. MASON, M.R.C.S. England, L.B.O.P. London, D.P.H. Cambridge, Certificate London School of Tropical Medicine (formerly District Medical Officer and Magistrate in the Leeward Islands and
Bt. Vincent, West Indies), called in and examined.
1874. Chairman: You were formerly Medical Officer in the Leeward Islands P-Yes, sir.
1875. How long were you there?-I went out in 1903, and I came home on leave in 1908
1876. Five years?-Yes: I came home on a year's leave in 1908 three months' full pay, nine months' half pay. I gave up three months of the leave and went out to St. Vincent in 1909.
1877. This Committee is considering whether it is advisable to assimilato the conditions of service in various Colonies, more or less federate them. Do you think that could be done in the West Indies at all; have one Medical Service P-I have written several articles on Federation in the West Indies. I certainly think with regard to the Medical Service it should be done and can be done.
1878. Without federation of the Governments?- If you wait for the Colonies themselves to do it, they will never do it; at least, not for a long time. They are trying to get them to do it now.
1879. Would you then have recruitment from England generally for the West Indies, not for any particular Colony; a candidate for employment would be given an appointment to the West Indian Medical Service --That has always been done.
1880. No; I think now he is always told that he will go either to this Colony or that Colony!-Yes, I beg your pardon; that is true. Yes, I think he should be sent out to the West Indian Medical Service, and sent where he was wanted.
1881. Ha would not know where he was going?- He ought to be told where he is going before he goes. What usually happens is this. They tell you what vacancies there are. I was first of all appointed to Dominion, and before I went I got a telegram from the Government to say I was to go to Antigua instead. When I got to Antigua they said, "You are supernumerary officer; you are sent to this par- ticular district for a time.' That was the ground they made for moving me from a job of £500 a year to one of £800 a year.
1882. When you accepted the appointment was it purely as a Medical Officer? As far as I know, that
was su.
1889. Or were you told in England that you might Le called upon to perform other duties?-No; I was not told that; there was nothing in my contract at all to say that I was to be employed as a Magis- trate, as far as I remember. I have not got the contract here, but the contract is in this Office, so that I am bound to say I liked daing Magis- you can see. trate's work; I got on all right with it.
1884. Do you think it is a good thing to ask a niedical officer to do other duties than medical duties? No, I do not. I certainly do not know, but, as far as I know, I think that that has been dropped.
1885. Would it not be rather difficult to have a poneral Medical Service for the West Indies, if they were still separate Governments and separate Gover- nors? I do not think that is an insuperable difficulty, air. The conditions are much the same, the pay is much the same in the various Colonies; it is merely » question of adjustment, I should think.
1886. From your knowledge of conditions out there, do you think the various elected Legislatures would welcome a proposal of that kind? Well, sir, the elected Legislature which I know most about is the Legislature of Barbados, where I was born, They
are rather jealous of their prerogative, and the Hus pital in Barbados is managed by a Committee which consists almost entirely of the Members of the House of Assembly, with the Bishop of the Island on it, and they flatter themselves that they manage that Hospita! quite well. They have sometimes had diffi- culty in getting men to go there, because they usually appoint Barbadians to the job, and they cannot always get them. Recently they advertised for Medical Officer over there; they advertised in "The British Medical Journal," There was an M.D. London upplied, a lady M.D. applied, eight men applied; I applied. I had had experience in the West Indies and I was a Barbadian. They did not give it to any of us; they gave it to a Graduate from McGill College, Montreal, who is a young chap of 28. They were quite right in appointing him; they wanted a young man and they got him, but the point of view of quali- lications does not count for much.
1887. Do you think that they would accept a system under which, if that appointment fall vacant, it would be given to a Medical Officer from British Guiana P-I do not know that they would like it. You see, sir, in Barbados at the same time you have a Hospital managed by this Hospital Committee. and you have the Asylum under the management of the Governor and the Executive Committee, while there you get the Hospital under the management of the Government direct-the Governor which is a different condition from being under the management of a Committee of the House of Assembly.
1888 But before you could introduce a general Government Medical Service for all the British West Indian Colonies, you would have to get the assent of the Legislative Body of each Colony to the introduc- tion of such a scheme: you would have to get them to agree to it? Yes, Sir, you would; that is true.
1889. Do you think that could be done?-I think it could.
1600 Do you think the Barbadians would agree?— I think they would agree, if it were put to them properly. The only three Islands that have repre- sentative Government are Barbados, the Bahamas. and Bermuda.
1801. And British Guiana, you might almost say? --Not altogether.
1892. They have a majority?—They have, I believe, in British Guiana,
1893. The Government cannot get a penny without the assent of the elected Members?-From a financial point of view that is correct.
1894. Then you would have to have a general scale of salaries, would you not; the same commencing salary in every Colony?--It would be advisable, if it could be arranged,
1805. You could not have a general Service without it, could you?—Yes; you would have to start from bedrock somewhere; you would have to start, and then perhaps give a man more for a bad district, according to what the conditions are, because the conditions count for a great deal, not only in different Colonies but in different islands. One district in an island is a good one, and another district is a bad
one.
1890. What in your opinion are the advantages of such an amalgamation? The advantages are, that if a man gone out, the newcomer gets sent to a bad district and is then subsequently transferred to a bettor district,
6 January, 1920.]
MINUTES OF EVIDENCE.
DR. G. B. MASON, M.R.C.S., L.B.O.P., D.P.H.
1897. Or a better Colony?-Or s batter Colony; it is in the nature of promotion for them.
1898. You think it would be easier to get medical recruits if there wore a general Service?--I think it would give them a prospect.
1899. What scale of salary do you think would be reasonable for service in the West Indies; take the first salary of a newly-appointed Medical Officer?-- Well, what I think, and what a Medical man would get, are two very different things, but the question ie, you want to give a man enough to enable him to live with some sort of decent surroundings, and the ost of living has gone up a lot. I should not think less than £500 a year would be of much use.
1900. £500 a year for a young man of 25 or 26 ?— Yes, plus private practice, because for the first six months he would go to Hospital, he would not have private practice.
1901. Would he get free quartera?--I would suggest he should get them, if the Government would agree to it. The question is, you cannot get the Govern- ment to give these things.
1902. Do you think the Barbadian Government would agree to it? Well, the present pay to the Senior House Surgeon is £300, plus quarters.
1908. £900-That is all he gets.
1904. The senior man?-Yes.
1995. I think they are very unlikely to give £500 to every newly-appointed Medical Officer ?-Then, of course, you would have to arrange with them and SAY, "Very well, you can start your men with £400, and we will transfer them later on. healthy, that might be done."
As you are very As to the mimimuni, however, that would be a matter to be settled by those persons who pay, I suppose.
1900. Sir James Focler: We have your views in the Memorandum which you have sent us?—Yes.
1907. You suggest that there should be an Advisory Board?--Yes, Sir.
1908. And that one of the duties should be to advise the Secretary of State, and recommend the candidates most suitable for appointment to the existing vacan- ties. The second was: To interview candidates, if necessary. There has for a good many years been a Board of that kind?-I did not know that.
1909. For the past ten years? I am very glad to hear it.
1910. On which there are two medical men and two members of the Colonial office Staff?--I am very glad to hear it.
1911. And all candidates for appointment during that time have been interviewed by that Board, and the appointments have been made practically on their recommendation. The candidates are classified accord- ing to the estimate of the Board as to their capabili 11es, and so forth. So that is met? That has been since my time.
1919. To inspect and approve all Contracts before they are submitted for signature by the Officer appointed to the Colonial Medical Service." The Contract is the conditions of service?-Yes, you have to sign one; I signed one. I beg your pardon--a passage agreement; I am wrong about that.
1919. Sir Harry Verney: There is nothing in the passage agreement!-I did not know there was any- thing in the passage agreement about getting my passage back to England; I had to pay my own and my wife's as well. I wrote to ask if I was entitled to it, and I believe they said I was not.
1914. Sir James Powler: The fourth is: "To in- vestigate and report to the Secretary of State on all conplaints coming from Medical Officers in the Ser- vice," But the Medical Officer in a Colony is under the Senior Medical Officer or the Director of Medical Services in the Colony?-Yes, that is so.
1916. And from him the appeal is to the Governor? --As a rule, yes.
1916. And from the Governor to the Secretary of State?--Yos.
1917. Would you recommend that an Officer whore Appeal has usually, so to speak, gone through the Senior Medical Officer to the Governor, and then to the Secretary of State, should have the power to "e-open his case before a Board here?-Certainly not; through the usual official channels.
·
[Continued.
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1918. Is not that rather what you suggest here?-- No, I did not mean to suggest that; that would not be feasible.
1919. You agree that would not be desirable?--No, not under those official arrangements. I think they ought to stick to the official channels. I was suggesting that as an alternative.
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1920. Every Medical Officer should have the right of appearing in person at the Colonial Office, and interviewing the Medical Board, or the Officer ap- pointed by the Secretary of State to deal with his case." It is probably since your time, but at nearly every meeting of the Advisory Board for Tropical Africa Officers of the Colonial Service attend and are interviewed. That is the regular aystem in opera- tion at the present time, and has been for many years? I did not know that.
1921. They have not the right to appear, but they are invited P-I only suggested that, as I thought it would be more satisfactory.
1922. You had rather in mind something in the nature of a case?--Not a case which has arisen, but one which might arise.
1923. I do not wish you to understand that ques- tions of that kind come before the Advisory Board; they do not? They do not.
1924. No. Then there is the question of passages; well, I think we have had a good deal of evidence un that point, and the Committee understand what the views of the Medical Officers are, whether they can be met or not?-In my case, I resigned and I never got my passage back to England. I got my passage out, but I never got my passage back; I had to pay it myself. I resigned in England.
1925. Chairman: Did you resign in the Colony?— No; I resigned in England at the end of my leave.
1928. You had naturally paid your passage home when you came on leave?-I did, and I resigned in England.
1927. Sir James Fowler: Then you think that that Aught to have been paid by the Colonial Office?--- Well, I thought that it ought to be, if I could get it, but if it was not in my Contract, or in my Passage Agreement, I was not entitled to it, and there was an end of the matter. I do not remember whether it was or was not. I asked the question, I was told I was not entitled to it, and I never got it.
1028. You agree that Officers who do not serve for three years should not have their passage money refunded if they resign before the three years are their passage money? That has always been the completed; that they should be required to refund Regulation; I do not know whether it is quite a just Regulation.
1929 Not quite equitable, perhaps?—I do not think it was. They will not give you any pension, but I thought that a man's passage might be paid; there might be some very valid reason for him having to 1+sign: you never know.
1930. You were born in Barbados?--That is so. 1981. And you obtained your qualification over heref-Yes. I went out to work at the age of 18, when I left school, from 18 to 23; I came over here and I sat for the Matriculation of the University of London, passed in the First Division, went down to the London Hospital, then I went on and took the Pre- liminary Scientific, and then I had no money to complete, so I took the L.R.C.S., M.R.O.P. After the London Hospital, I came down to Brompton, and was under you for a time.
1932. You were House Physician at Brompton ?— Yes, under you.
1933. You mentioned, in your letter to me, that you knew Mr. Knollys at Barbados?-I know Mr. Knollys when he was Colonial Secretary at Barbados. 1994. You were not qualified at that time?-Oh. no; my father never had the money to send me over till I was 23.
1935. Have you any suggestions to make that are not in your memorandum? The only official sug. gestions I have to make I have put in my meno- randum.
1936. Still, the Committee would be pleased to hear any? I thought it out; I do not think I have anything else to say unless the Committee want to esk me. I wrote you privately what my experience
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