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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON
40
22 December, 1919.]
COLONIAL MEDICAL SERVICES COMMITTEE.
Dr. E. LANGLEY-HUNT, C.M.G.
men who made their living by practice. It was a question of registration, and under that Ordinance it became a criminal offence to practise unless regis- tered.
1311. That was as regards those then practising?- Those then practising.
1919. All newly qualified apothecaries were put on the register as if they were in practice ?—Not absolutely.
1313. This class of certificated apothecary will gradually die out? Yes, it will, but it will take a considerable time.
1811. That is what I want to get at?-Now, we absolutely refuse to recognise or register any apothe cary as a private practitioner, unless he can prove he has had independent charge of a station. He must have been in independent charge, with no one to appeal to but his own knowledge of his work.
1815. Sir James Fowler: How many of them are there P-The men who are now registered, I put at about 600. They will cease to exist, but it will take some considerable time.
1316. Chairman: It is hard on the more highly qualified medical men? It is hard on them; it is extremely hard on the Principal Medical Officer. I do not know whether the members of this Committee know it, but it seems to me the most valuablo fees the Medical Officer makes are not for looking after serious cases; they are for attending to people with an ordinary cold in the head, or a cut finger, or any- thing else; that pays better. These men get all that work and fully qualified medical men are never called in at all.
1817. Sir Humphry Rolleston: I gather that, although there might be difficulty in affiliating the Ceylon Service with that of other Colonies, as far as regards men locally recruited and approved by the Governor, you would see no objection to amalgamat- ing it as far as regards the upper grade of the European Medical Officers?-Yes, certainly; if you mean Officers recruited from this country; certainly. 1318. It is only the local element that you think it would be very injurious, I suppose, to attempt to transfer to the Straits Settlements, say, or Hong Kong? A man would not go, though he were offered an appointment. He is better off where he is.
1319. As for amalgamating the Bervice, from the point of view of the British Medical Officer, there is no objection P-That existe at the present moment. Take myself, for instance; I have been transferred. 1320. From three places, I see?-Yes. The man we have now in charge of the Bacteriological Station came from East Africa, and the Superintendent of the General Hospital in Colombo came from South Africa.
1321. These branches are not officially amalgamated? --No.
1322. There would be no objection to making them one, would there? Well, from my point of view, I did not see any objection; I think it would be a Found thing.
1323. What about the question of pay? We all realise that the conditions of pay, which might have been satisfactory formerly, are not so now?-Cer- tainly not.
1324. Do you think they were satisfactory six years ago? What was a living wage before the War is not a living wage now.
1925. Was the amount at which the men joined the Service before the War satisfactory, do you think?
..Yee.
1326. He joined at £400? They never paid any. thing like that in Ceylon. The smallest salary of the European recruited officer in Ceylon was £800 to £800, Then, he is a whole-time officer on a sterling salary. He is allowed no private practice, and he gets a salary. 1327. Chairman: An officer who is a senior officer ? He is a senior officer,
1328. Sir Humphry Rolleston. You have got no officers serving who have recently joined the service? We have not a single European officer who came out to Ceylon at the salary at which he joined.
1329. Which was satisfactory?-Yes, then.
[Continued.
1330. What does it represent now out there? That is very difficult to say.
1331. Chairman: You are on the rupee there. The rupee has gone up?-Yes, it is fictitious, as far as we are concerned. The rupee jumped from ls. 4d. to . now it is 28. 4d., and the Government are rather inclined to think that the increase in the value of the rupee is of considerable value to the officer em. ployed in working in Ceylon, They seem to me to forget that the bulk of one's salary has to be ex- pended locally. You cannot remit home; the rise in the value of the rupes do not actually help us to any great extent.
1992. It is the value of your money in Ceylon?— Yes,
1332. Probably the 28. id. rupee does not buy more than the ls. 2d. rupee?-It was never ls. 2d.; it was always la. 4d.; that was the fixed rupee value, which was fixed in India
1934. ls. 4d.?—18. 4d.
1335. Sir Humphry Rolleston: I think you were a Civil Surgeon in South Africa ?—Yes.
answer
1336. What would you say it would be desirable to introduce as regards making the Service more popu- lar? That is rather a difficult question to without giving it consideration. I am of opinion that unless the rates of pay are increased, you will not get the type of officer that you want in the tropics.
1337. That is since the War, because the value of money has gone down so much?--Yes, but in most cases I only speak for Ceylon--we are paid now, I am paid at the present moment, on pre-war rates. We all agitated; I did ask for some increase owing to the increased expense of living, and the Govern- mant out there very lately gave us a concession which, in my case, amounted to £70 a year, to date from the 1st January, 1919; well, that was very little help.
1338. But apart from raising the salary, is there anything lacking-take your experience--in other points? I think Medical Officers are rather hardly hit over transfers. I do not know whether that is what you want, but we are very badly hit over the transfers. do not want to bring in the personal equation, at the same time I should like to give you my personal experience, which applies not only to myself, but to a number of other officers in the service. I was trans- ferred from the Gold Coast to Ceylon in 1911. I was informed that the conditions of service were so and eo, and so and so. I accepted; I came home to England, and after 14 months' service on the Gold Coast I got two months' leave at home. I then had to pay my way out to Ceylon, and was put on half pay during the passage out to Ceylon. My salary was £600. I not only had to pay my own passage, but I had to pay the passage of my wife and children there, with the result that I
was far
off on £600 than if I had joined the Ceylon Medical Department at £500. I did 7 years in Ceylon, and part of the inducement to me to serve in Ceylon was that, owing to my West Coast service, I was entitled to one sixth leave for every year I did out there. ! did 74 years, and at the present moment I am entitled to 1 year, 8 months and 26 days leave.
истве
1339. Mr. Fiddian: On half pay?-On half pay. I would be allowed ten months' full pay leave, but they have promoted me to Jamaica; I go out to Jamaica with, in actual salary, £180 less than I had in Ceylon, I drop my Colombo ambulauce remuneration which was £120; 80, with all deference, I think I might call that an Irishman's promotion. I go out at £290 a year less than I had in Ceylon; I have to pay my passage out to Jamaica, and my wife's, and I am put on half pay. I have nothing to show for the seven months leave I was entitled to when I joined the Ceylon service.
1340. Chairman: If it had not been for the War. you would in the ordinary course have come home to England some years ago? They certainly treated us very hardly. They asked us to repost an ordinary tour; it is five years in Ceylon.
22 December, 1919.]
MINUTES OF EVIDENCE.
Dr. E. LANGLEY-HUNT, C.M.G.
1341. In West Africa you had your salary paid both ways? We had our salary paid both ways, four months' full pay leave and first-class passage out and home.
1342. Mr. Fiddian: Did you apply for transfer from Ceylon-No; I only applied in the Annual Report which goes in, in witich you are asked to state whether you are 1repared to go and work elsewhere, and I did that.
1343. Did you apply for transfer from the Gold Coast to Ceylon P-Not any more than appeared on my Report, that I was prepared to take up service elsewhere.
1344. I suppose you accepted Jamaica because you liked to be the Head of the Medical Service? Well, that is also a difficult question.
1345. Why did you secept a salary less than you were drawing in Ceylon? If you get an offer of promotion-which it is, from the fact that I will eventually draw a larger salary out there; my income in Ceylon was limited to £900-I do not know that it is very wise to refuse it, notwithstanding the fact that if you go you do not improve your financial position, because you may not have another opportunity. I do not suppose the Colonial Office offered me Jamaica with any view to helping me as an individual I take it that new blood in a Colony is of some value and I did not dare refuse it under the circum.
some use. stances
1346. What is the passage to Jamaica?--An in- dividual passage is £35; then I have to take out my wife and two children, which will cost me £105, and my change from Ceylon costs me £125.
1347. You would have to pay that on leave in any case? No. Though I had oncluded seven and a half years' service in Ceylon, my principal, Dr. Rutherford, was on leave, and I could not obtain leave, although i had had a very long tour, before March, 1920. could not have come home before March, 1920, if I had, not been offered Jamaica.
I
1348. You have an exceptional allowance for living in Jamaica P.-Yos
1849. During your voyage out to Jamaica you have nothing to pay for lond-No. but I am put on half pay.
1350. The one goes against the other? Yes, I suppone it docs.
1351. You applied for South African work ?--Yes, for special work.
1352. Has it ever been suggested to you that there is any discontent in the Medical Service because they are not transferred?-No, I cannot say I have ever heard a man complain because he has not been trans- ferred.
1353. A great many complain, for instance, not that they do not get transferred, but that it should always be in Departments to which they belong? I cannot say I have heard any complaints made.
1354. You spoke of people who have been transferred from Ceylon to India; was that temporary or a per- manent appointment-They went on an engagement for 12 months, or longer if their services were ro- quired, and on occasion we would absorb them into the Ceylon Medical Service when they returned. The Indian Government were prepared to pay the deduc- tions made from their salaries for the Widows and Orphans' Fund, the Indian Government were quite prepared to pay that, and we were prepared to give them credit for any service they did in India.
1355. It wax general surgeon's work? It was general surgeon's work.
1356. Now, if you had been in West Africa on a military expedition you would have been paid an extra 10 shillings a day, is not that so?-I think so, I cannot say.
1357. The principle is established that a
man is entitled to war service pay?-A large number of our men left for war service and they were paid by the War Office. We will take, for the sake of argument, that a man who came home, say, ou £800 a year was paid £400 by the War Office, and the Ceylon Adminis-
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41
[Continued.
tration made up the difference between his war pay and the pay he received in Ceylon, so that he was in receipt of his £800 during the time he served.
1358. Whereas the man who went to India was probably better off P--He is better off.
1359. Are the people in the lower ranks of the Medical Service moved about quite freely? Of course, you might divide Ceylon into four or five zones, if you liked. We have unhealthy as well as more or less healthy stations. We have other stations in which we put a man where he has not very much trouble and a certain amount of private practice.
1360. But a man who applies for a transfer?-In the higher grades we move him on for various reasons. If he has influences in the immediate neighbourhood which are detrimental to his official work, we transfer him, without regard to the nature of his work.
1361. That is discipline?-Yes.
1362. It would be fair to say that in the lower ranks of the Ceylon Medical Service there are a number of private medical practitioners subsidised by the Government ?-I would not say subsidised; they are Government Medical Officers with the inducement to join the Government Service. They would be allowed to do private practice provided it did not interfere with their official position. It is not like Jamaica, which, I understand, is a subsidised Depart- ment. You pay your Medical Officer in Jamaica £150 or £200 a year, and you expect certain duties from him. From the fact of these men being in the De- partment and under our control, we can insist on their doing official work, and if their private practice inter- feres with their official work we stop their pay.
1863. Do you see any objection to the Jamaica Medical Officers being transferred ?-Well, I do not think it would apply to Ceylon. What kind of officer would you like to see? If you lay it down hereafter for all future Ceylon Medical Officers, that they should bo recruited from England-yes, every time; but where you have over 90 per cent, of your officers locally recruited, I fail to see that I could give any advice which would be of much value.
1964. You do not see any particular advantage to the Medical Administration of Ceylon from the occa- sional visit of an Inspecting Officer?-Yes, I think that, if there were a responsible Officer, a Medical Officer, recognised as an Officer worthy of having his advice asked, we would receive him with open arms. The great thing is, that he would be able to represent to the authorities at home the conditions which, under ordinary circumstauces, you cannot know anything about.
1365. That is more from an administrative point of view. Supposing someone were coming out to inspect how you carry out your medical and sanitary duties, how would you like it?-We would he quite prepared to have our work inspected, we would encourage it.
1366. As long as he was a good man?-As long as he was a good man and had previous experience of tropical work, and could tell us whether we were right or wrong.
1367. How would you suggest that such a Director or Inspector-General should be chosen ?—I suggest that a man who had already made his mark in the Tropies should be appointed.
1368. From the Indian Medical Service, or the R.A.M.C., or the Colonial Medical Service? I should say the Colonial Medical Service, because the Indian man's experience has been gained entirely in India?
1369. Have you any dentists in Ceylon, quite apart from the Department?-We have no dentists attached to the Department.
1370. Do you think you get on very well without them? We would get on very much better with them. 1371. How would you do?--The private practitioner may charge exorbitant fece. Formerly, if anyone desired a little attention paid to his teeth he would go to a man that he would not dare to go to now-a-days. They did considerably better work than they do now. 1372. You think it exorbitant compared with the Medical Officer's charge?-I am a medical man; I had a tooth extracted before leaving Ceylon, and I was charged £4.
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