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(No. 329.)
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Enclosure in No. 179.
Sir E. SATOW to the MARQUESs of LansdowNE.
(Received November 18.)
MY LORD,
Peking, October 5, 1905. WITH reference to my telegram of the 21st September, and in continuation of my despatches, Nos. 312 and 314, of the same date, I have the honour to inclose notes of my conversation with Prince Ch'ing on the subject of the Canton-Hankow and Soochow-Ningpo Railways.
As your Lordship will observe, the Prince evaded giving a categorical reply, sheltering himself under the assumed obligation of consulting the Viceroy of Canton in regard to the former of these, while, in answer to my reference to the engagements given by the Chinese Government to my predecessor in 1898 (see "China No. 1, 1899," pp. 287-289), he said he must refresh his memory by reperusing the documents. Those assurances were to the effect that concessions should be granted to British capitalists to build both the railways in question (besides others) on terms not inferior to those granted to the Belgian Société d'Etudes for the Peking Hankow line.
With reference to the Soochow-Ningpo Railway, I beg to inclose translation of Prince Ching's reply to the note inclosed in my despatch No. 314. From this it will be seen that the Chinese Government assert the necessity of the local authorities ascertaining whether or no there are difficulties in regard to the construction of the railway before negotiations are entered upon. But both the English and Chinese texts confirm the view that the difficulties referred to are purely local ones, such as the question which would be the best track to follow, or the removal of graves-not such a fundamental question as that involved in the pretension now put forward that, as the native gentry and capitalists of the provinces are willing to build the railway, the British and Chinese Corporation's rights under the preliminary Agreement are, ipso facto, done away with.
I propose in a few days to return to the charge either by arguing the whole question with Natung or addressing an official note to the Prince recapitulating what Í said to him at our interview. It will be necessary, however, to leave him sufficient time to obtain some kind of replies from the Viceroy of Canton and the Governor of Chekiang.
Copies of this despatch and its enclosures will be sent to the Governor of Hong Kong and to His Majesty's Consul-General at Shanghae.
I have, &c.,
ERNEST SATOW.
CONVERSATION between Sir E. Satow and Prince Ch'ing on September 28, 1905, respecting the Canton-Kowloon and Soochow-Ningpo Railways.
Sir E. Satow summarized the course of the correspondence between himself and the Wai-wu Pu in regard to their railway. As long as six months before he had communicated a memorandum of proposals to the Wai-wu Pu, and up to the present bis requests for the appointment of a negotiator to carry out the terms of the pre- liminary agreement were answered by statements that the local people wished to build the line themselves. That was no reply to give to a plain request for the fulfilment of a written contract.
The Prince understood that the Cantonese wished to build their section just as the Hong Kong Government wished to build theirs. The Wai-wu Pu were in corre- spondence with the Viceroy on the subject. It was not one in which the Wai-wu Pu could use compulsion; they could not force the Viceroy and say he must do this or that, regardless of his own opinion or the feeling of the Cantonese.
Sir Ernest reminded his Highness that, over and above the preliminary Agree- ment concluded by his Excellency Sheng Hsuan-huai, on behalf of the Chinese Govern- ment, with the British and Chinese Corporation, there were the undertakings of the Chinese Government as registered in correspondence between Sir Claude MacDonald and the Tsungli Yamen, under which certain railways were to be constructed by British Syndicates on terms not inferior to those granted in the case of the Luhan line. The Canton-Kowloon and the Soochow-Ningpo Railways were two of those mentioned in the undertakings These and the preliminary Agreement were explicit engagements
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His
which His Majesty's Government required the Chinese Government to carry out. Highness should bear in mind that it was the Chinese Government to whom he applied in the matter, not the Wai-wu Pu, and it was for the Chinese Government to see that the Canton Viceroy fulfilled those engagements.
His Highness said that the Viceroy and the provincial officials had their diffi- culties, and these must be borne in mind by the Wai-wu Pu, who could not use coer- cion in such a case. He would have to look up the correspondence between Sir Claude MacDonald and the Tsungli Yamen to which Sir Ernest had referred and the purport of which he had forgotten. The preliminary Agreement contained a proviso that local difficulties should be discussed with the Viceroy, and that was only right and
proper.
The Chinese text of this proviso was referred to, and it was pointed out to his Highness that it read, "when his Excellency the Viceroy is consulted any local difficulties will be adjusted." Sir Ernest again pressed his arguments, and stated that he had received instructions from His Majesty's Government to warn his Highness that China would not be permitted to disregard these engagements. It was no answer to give to His Majesty's Government that the local people wished to build the railway themselves. He wanted to know, for the information of His Majesty's Government, whether China intended to keep to her engagements.
His Highness assured Sir Ernest that the Wai-wu Pu were in correspondence with the Viceroy and that the matter was not one which could be hurried. If Sir Ernest persisted in hurrying it, he would be able to do nothing. He also wished to look up the correspondence between Sir Claude MacDonald and the Tsungli Yamen which had been mentioned.
In the course of the above discussion the position of affairs in regard to the Soochow-Hangchow-Ningpo Railway was specially stated, and Sir Ernest's remarks in part referred to both that and the Canton-Kowloon Railway.
As regards the Soochow-Hangchow-Ningpo Railway, his Highness admitted that his Excellency Sheng had been commissioned by the Empress Dowager to consult with the Governor of Chekiang and endeavour to secure the cancellation of the preliminary Agreement. The matter had been referred by the Wai-wu Pu to the provincial authorities. Had not Sir Ernest seen Sheng?
Sir Ernest said he had not seen Sheng since a certain interview relating to the affairs of the Peking Syndicate.
(Translation.)
YOUR EXCELLENCY,
* PRINCE CHING to Sir E. SATOW.
September 23, 1905.
I HAVE the honour to acknowledge the receipt of your Excellency's note of the 16th September, stating that the British and Chinese Corporation are ready to proceed to a final agreement in regard to the Soochow-Hangchow-Ningpo Railways, and requesting the Chinese Government to appoint an officer with whom the Corporation may negotiate for that purpose.
I would observe that it is for the local authorities to ascertain whether or no there are difficulties in regard to the construction of the railways before negotiations can be entered upon.
The Wai-wu Pu have requested the provincial authorities to make a careful inquiry, and as soon as their report is received, a communication will be addressed to your Excellency.
In the meantime, I avail, &c.
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(Secret.)
SIR,
No. 180.
GOVERNOR SIR M. NATHAN to MR. LYTTELTON. (Received December 2, 1905.)
Hong Kong, Government House, November 3, 1905. In continuation of my secret despatch of the 20th October* on the subject
• No. 170.
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