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So as to maintain the present position with regard to Itinerant Hawkers (other classes).
(Dr. DENNY M. H. HUANG signified his agreement to the Chairman's suggested amendment).
MRS. E. ELLIOTT (in English):- Mr. Chairman, I am pleased to second the motion.
MR. HILTON CHEONG-LEEN (in English):- Mr. Chairman, any reasonable person would agree that sooner or later hawker licences would have to be increased. The question is when.
There are some Councillors who are in favour of the increase taking effect immediately. There are others who accept the principle of an increase but prefer to wait until the upturn in Hong Kong's economy becomes more marked in the next few months. There are also others who favour no increase at all.
My view is the moderate and more reasonable approach, and that is to wait a few months more when the economy shows more definite signs of an upturn (which I firmly believe it will) before implementing any increases in hawker licences.
For this reason, I am in favour of the increases coming into force not earlier than April 1976.
It may be of interest to members to know that about 90% of all hawker licences are not due for renewal until April 1976 (on Hong Kong island and October 1976 (in Kowloon).
Therefore I cannot understand why there is all that great rush to gazette the schedule of increases this week so that increases could take effect immediately. If this is the intention of the Hawkers Select Committee, then I shall have no choice but to vote against the motion.
If it is a question of getting additional revenue for the Urban Council, one fair and practical way would be to issue pedlar licences to hawkers who are now operating in the Hawker Permitted Areas without any licence whatsoever.
Furthermore, as members are aware, the Urban Council is not operating at a deficit, and it is more than likely that it will end the current fiscal year with a surplus of close to $130 million.
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MR. B. A. BERNACCHI (in English):- Mr. Chairman, on a point of clarification. I do not think Mr. Hilton CHEONG-LEEN is correct,
the licensing procedure is such that licences can be renewed almost as from today, certainly as from the New Year, and we have already been advised by our legal adviser that we cannot charge the increase if it is not to take effect until April.
MR. HILTON CHEONG-LEEN (in English):- On a point of clarification, Mr. Chairman. I said if that will happen, I will vote against. I understand from Mr. BERNACCHI that according to the legal adviser, such increases will commence from April, could that be clarified once again?
CHAIRMAN (in English):- I will clarify unless the Chairman of the Select Committee wishes to do so himself. The increases will only come into effect upon the expiry of an existing licence when it comes up for renewal. So that's clear. As Mr. CHEONG-LEEN also pointed out, most of these licences do not come up for renewal until April, so there is no question of all hawkers having to pay more tomorrow. There is no such requirement, but only upon expiry of existing licences.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN (in English):- May I seek further clarification? Do I understand it that if a licence is due to expire during December that the licensee will have to pay the increased fee at once if and when it is passed by Council and gazetted?
CHAIRMAN (in English):- Yes.
MR. EDMUND W. H. CHOW (in Cantonese):- Mr. Chairman, increasing licence fee is a problem and headache. But the manner of increase is such that we do not necessarily have to agree or disagree and that it is not a method of socializing. Whether fees should be increased should be decided on several factors. Firstly, whether there are adequate reasons. Secondly, what are the circumstances and is the timing suitable. Thirdly will it directly or indirectly have any effect. The Urban Council increased hawker licence fees in 1973 and two years later, now, we want to increase the fees again. I would like to know whether the hawker management fees had risen rapidly during the past 2 years. I must emphasize that what I ask is just the 2 years since the licence fee was last increased in 1973. Does the proposed increase match the increase in the hawker management fees during the past 2 years? I must emphasize that it is purely hawker management fee. Although we do not want to subsidize hawkers from tax-payers' money, at the same time, I do not want the money earned by hawkers to be used to subsidize other services. We have said that things should be distributed very fairly and I would like to apply this to our present problem. As to fair increases, hawkers say that they are not afraid