Page 201 of 382
380
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
good job indeed, and that the Ambulance Service under its control has been improved considerably after constructive criticism offered by the Hong Kong Reform Club a couple of years ago. (Laughter) But there is still room for improvement in this latter service and the further removal of any question of corruption in this Service, or indeed in the Service as a whole, has to be gone into.
I support the Motion before the Council.
MR. WILSON WANG:-Mr. Chairman, I rise to support the Motion, although I may say I have a different point of view of the efficiency of the Fire Services Department--which has always been and will be and still is after hearing previous speakers, with my best respects. Certainly, as Dr. BELL has said, they have proved their effectiveness-that they are prompt on the scene of fires and they are men who have displayed gallantry in the course of duty. Certainly we can't rule out the possibility that there is room for improvement just as much as there is room for improvement in any other department. We must admit that their task is not an easy one. No short line can be drawn when it comes to judging what conditions should or should not be improved to avoid fire hazard, so that one can say that above this line conditions are safe and below that it is not. Indeed it is difficult to convince a person that fire hazards do exist in a certain point in a certain place until an actual fire has occurred, and when that fire occurs the Fire Services Department will receive all the blame that they could have warned the occupants well beforehand. But prior to such occurrence, the occupants might persist in the feeling that they were placed under undue hardship for having to install fire-fighting equipment, to avoid using inflammable materials, or to keep a good clearance for fire escapes.
Now such kind of complaints and grumblings, whether justifiable or unjustifiable, are always occurring and it will be increasingly so as the density of population increases, as every resident is fighting for every inch of living space, and businessmen have to take into account the running cost of every square foot of available space. But it is on this point that I feel strongly that it would be a great advantage if the Fire Services Department is equipped with a vehicle to provide two-way traffic between the Department and the general public for the conveyance of information between them. Such a vehicle would enable explanations pertaining to the principles and reasons behind every action taken by the Fire Services Department to be given to the public, and would provide for the Department an opportunity to listen to complaints-complaints such as we have heard-and to give an opportunity for the Department to review their policy and if such policy cannot be reviewed, a good explanation will be given to avoid misunderstanding.
Indeed, in the supervision of the designing of a new building in which the Department is able to deal with intelligent, professional persons
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
381
the matter is much easier, but as soon as the building is occupied by residents, the Department might be brought face to face with people who are ignorant of all causes of fire and of the necessary precautions they must take. When the occupants start to abuse regulations, then the task of supervising will not be an easy one and the task of exercising discretion and the extent of relaxation permissible and the course of action to be taken will be equally difficult, especially when the Department has to deal with millions of residents and many and varied types of buildings.
Now this is what makes me feel that the Department might welcome the idea of associating itself with a supervisory body which is strongly represented by unofficial members and there is no such a body better than the Urban Council.
MR. BERNACCHI:-Hear, hear.
MR. WILSON WANG:-As things are today, the Director is not a member of any Council, nor does there exist a strong advisory board to enable the Department to hear the views of the public and the public's reactions to the work of the Department. Such a condition indeed is most unsatisfactory, and it is only for the good of the Fire Services Department that I support the Motion today.
MR. SALES: Sir, I have yielded the floor to two of my colleagues and now with your indulgence I would like to put in a plea for the Fire Services Department. Dr. BELL has rightly said that the Fire Services Department is efficient when a fire breaks out-were this not so the loss of life in Hong Kong would have been very great having regard to the living conditions which obtain here. On the other hand, members of the Urban Council are dissatisfied with the relations which exist between that Department and our own Council. And rightly so, Sir. Because, while this Council tries to protect the public interest by issuing instructions and requirements in clear and concise terms, the experience of at least one of our Select Committees has been that the Fire Services Department does not let the public know in advance what their actual requirements are. We have heard the instance cited by Mr. K. S. Lo in most eloquent terms about how that Department works. And it is the duty of the Urban Council, as the watch-dog of the public interest in Hong Kong, to ensure that the public knows at any given time what public rights are and what the requirements of Government Departments are in respect to the enterprises which public bodies wish to carry out. It is because the Fire Services Department has displayed in their relations with the public, as far as those relations touch upon the work of the Urban Council, that they have not been clear and accurate, which has given rise to much public hardship and dissatisfaction, we are asking for the Fire Services Department to be put under our jurisdiction. That, Sir, may not meet with Government's own concep-
382
Page 202 of 382