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[Mr. McGovern.] have been seeing us off at Victoria Station and carrying on the struggle on the home front. No. I am not gambling in that kind of struggle either for world revolu- tion or for the chance of smashing Ger- many because behind all this there is the feeling of a large number of people Go out and smash Germany. who say
That is the This is the opportunity.' spirit which has continually led the work- ing class into disaster. It is the spirit of revenge and hostility.
"
I have been told, even by people in Germany, that the only way to get Hitler to modify his policy is to try every means of bringing him within the ambit of the civilised Powers of the world, to bring him into touch and relationship with the other nations. I asked Jews in Germany whether, if war came, they would not welcome it as a chance of getting out of the hideous nightmare in which they lived, and they said No, if war comes we will be the first victims. Every dis- aster will be blamed on us and before the war has gone on for very long, between beatings and shootings and imprisonments we will suffer even more than we do now." I say that Hitler with all his in- tolerance of mind has the ruling class grouped around him. You have Fascism in Germany under Hitler but the Indian worker is under British Fascism. The
worker in Trinidad and the worker in Newfoundland are under the dictatorship of the money-bags of London.
That is the same financial dictatorship and the same ruthless brutality that has existed in the past against the people in the British Empire, and I am not pre- pared to fight for that Empire and I am not prepared to defend that Empire. If Montagu Norman or the Duke of Suther- land or the Marquis of Bute want to defend their possessions, let them get on their kilts and get out their guns and go out to the front. I am not going to defend thern. I want to take possession of this country. I want to free the working class, and the German people are the people who have to free themselves from Hitler. It is not to be done by the people of this country. We have our own job. I heard a man the other day it almost made me sick-who came to me with a means test case. He had 175. a week and had a house to keep. He was a widower He and he could not even get clothes. was almost down on his uppers," but
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after we had discussed his case for a while he asked me, "What about Here was a man these poor Czechs?" reduced to the lowest standard of poverty and he was thinking in terms of some- body who was, he thought, worse off than himself. That is the humane spirit of the worker but it does not affect the ruling classes. You would expect to use a man on the means test, driven out of his father's home, without an income, to defend your gold mines in South Africa. If he was an intelligent man he would say to you,
"Defend your own gold mines." That is my attitude. I welcome peace because it gives us a breathing space, but you are coming up against one of the most difficult problems that you ever imagined.
I can find nothing inconsistent in the Prime Minister saying, We will negotiate with Hitler but at the same time we are preparing for armament so that, if the hand with the glove on is not effec- tive, there is always the mailed fist in That is the policy of capitalism,
reserve.
""
and it is consistent. We shall not en- courage that struggle, but we hope it will present an opportunity to end the night- mare of war by ushering in a humane and civilised system. If we could muster in this country an anti-war working class who would refuse to subscribe to the
policy of war and who would be prepared to attack the Government hip and thigh, they could be driven out of office in six months. The strength is not the strength of their own position but the weakness of the opposition. They have manoeuvred the working-class movement into the position of being a war party. I welcome the peace, but you are drifting towards a more dangerous period when you will not be able to hand away the property of your friends but will be asked to stand and deliver some of the goods that you own, and then will come a terrific howl from the hon. Baronet the Member for Bournemouth (Sir H. Croft), the right hon. Gentleman the Member for Epping
(Mr. Churchill) and others. struggle we say to the German and Austrian workers and to the workers of the world, " Try to develop, even by illegal and underground methods, working-class movement, a discontent, an intelligence which will rise in revolt against the Hitlers and the Montagu Normans and overthrow their systems and collectively own and control the raw
In that
a
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I NOVEMBER 1938 International Situation 153 materials and the means of life and distri- Mr. Riley: The Munich proposals pro- bute them according to the service given vided for a plebiscite if the Commission by the workers in a community which will thought fit. communally produce and distribute the goods of life, and when you have rid the world of the economic causes of war you will have ushered in the foundations of
lasting peace and a decent order of
society.'
9.29 p.m.
Mr. W. Astor: I have listened to speeches on the other side of the House with considerable disagreement, but there was one remark by the hon. Member for South Shields (Mr. Ede) with which I should like to associate myself, and that was his criticism of the people of East- bourne and Mapledurham who did not like the possibility of working-class people being evacuated from London to their vicinity. That attitude causes as much in- dignation on this side as it does on his, but it would be unfair to assume that that in any way represents opinion in the areas to which these people were to be sent. One must, while deprecating the manifestations the hon. Member men- tioned, pay a tribute to the immense number of people all over the country who cheerfully and willingly prepared themselves for the reception of the children and women of London.
I intervene because I have just returned from a fortnight in the ceded territory in Czechoslovakia and the former Austria. It is impossible to go to the ceded terri- tory of Sudetenland without forming the conclusion that, while many Germans would have preferred autonomy within Czechoslovakia, they all preferred the Anschluss with Germany to remaining within Czechoslovakia in the state they were in before. One might almost com- pare the atmosphere in Sudetenland at the moment with that of the Jubilee here. There were flags and decorations and cheers for the German troops whenever they appeared even many days after- wards. We are asked what is the differ- ence between Godesberg and Munich, but it has been forgotten that the Godes- berg proposals not only contained a sug- gested boundary line for immediate occupation but also a further plebiscite area. By the work of the International Commission this plebiscite, which might have taken further areas out of Czecho- slovakia, was abandoned and the result is far more favourable than if you had the Godesberg line plus the plebiscite.
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Mr. Astor: I am quite aware of that, but the Czech and German Governments are pleased to have reached a line with- out having the inevitable disturbance that this plebiscite would have involved. Both Czech and German armies have behaved with the most admirable restraint and moderation. One must pay a tribute to both for the manner in which this cession has taken place. There is immense relief in the Sudeten areas. The Germans had real fear of what might happen at any moment. They were disarmed and many of the Czechs--not only the regular forces -were armed.
as
Many Sudeten Germans, not only Henleinists, were seized and imprisoned in horrible conditions hostages. You had on the German side the nefarious activities of the Freikorps. You had about 30 per cent. of the Germans who ought to have mobilised taken to the hills and being hunted there and apprehended wherever possible by the Czech military and gendarmerie. There was a complete censorship of newspapers, letters and communications into the area. It was a period of the most acute anxiety.
There is no doubt about the relief that is felt in the Sudeten areas. The German troops have behaved not only with
tact
moderation but with
for local feeling. To give one instance, there was a place, Teplitz, where the flag of a former Austrian regiment had had to be kept hidden for 20 years. When it was officers the local German produced, arranged that it should be carried at a church parade of the German troops in front of the church and that Mass should be celebrated. On another occasion I was in the crowd when a visiting German Minister was speaking. Before he came on the German band played, not a German march but the old Austrian Radetsky march, and the whole crowd broke into spontaneous applause. Much more important than those tactful gestures to local sentiment has been the fact that General von Reichenau put up proclama- tions all over the Sudeten area to the effect that denunciations by private persons were forbidden, that they re- flected more on the person who made them than on the person denounced, and that people making them would be the German summarily punished by Army, and that anyone who took private
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