659
Q.-Not letters ?
A.-No.
(4)
The Chairman.--What were the duties of the cashier?
A.--Among the cashier's duties were the opening of letters addressed officially to the Treasury, unless there was anything to show that it was intended to be a private communication to me; and it was his duty to separate the memorandum from the money and see that the former went to the accountant and the latter to the shroff.
Q.--Suppose a Chinaman went there to pay his Crown Rent, who would be the first person for him to go to?
A.-He ought to have gone to the shroff.
Q.-He would have paid the amount to the shroff?
A. Yes.
Q.-And who would have made out the receipt?
A.-Alves.
Q-Upon what--a slip from the shroff?
A.--The person paying the money would generally bring a memorandum with him or the last receipt, and the shroff would pass that on to Alves, and if there was any difficulty would go in and see him. Alves would understand from that memorandum, or old receipt, who it was who paid the money, and for what lot it was, and he would then, if he found it correct, make out a receipt and pass it to the shroff.
Mr. Bird.-Had Alves any right whatever to finger any money himself? A.-No.
Mr. Thurburn.--Did the shroff go out collecting?
A.-Not for Crown Rent.
Q-You have a list of the Crown Rents due. If the money is not paid who do you go to ?
A.-The Crown Solicitor.
The Chairman.-You have more than one shroff?
A.-We have three.
Q-Was there one shroff specially detailed to look after Crown Rents? A.-Yes.
Q-And there would be nothing to take that shroff out of the Office during Office hours?
A. He would go out of the Office to bank money, and in that case the money received would have to be taken by one of the other shroff's.
Mr. Thurburn-Suppose a man who owed his Crown Rent sent in a cheque for the amount due, it would go to the chief clerk ?
A.--If he sent in an envelope it might come to me or otherwise would go to the outer office and be opened by the cashier.
Q.-At all events the chief clerk would have to sign the receipt?
A.--He would send an ordinary receipt made out by Alves. He would not give a receipt to a coolie but would simply sign the chit book.
Q.--What would he do with the cheque? Would he pay it into the Bank?
A. He would hand it over to the shroff.
(5)
The Chairman. In the shroff's book would everything appear-the money paid in and cheques received ?
A. Yes.
It is a very rough book.
Mr. Bird.-In Chinese ?
A. Yes. It would simply state the amount.
The Chairman---Suppose a large cheque was received payable to your order, whom would that be endorsed by ?
A.---By me now. In Mr. Carvalho's time he used to be allowed to endorse for the Treasurer. He was secured.
Q-Whom were receipts signed by?
A.-By Mr. Alves.
Q-Anybody else?
A.-No.
Q-Is there no regulation about that?
A.-Not that I know of. It was the system I found when I got there and I did not alter it. I found that receipts had been signed for taxes by one clerk, for Crown Rent by another. For some time past I have signed the taxes receipts myself.
Q-I take it to be this. All the money was supposed to pass through the shroff's hands and his book was examined every day ?
A.--Yes.
Q-By the cashier ?
A. Yes.
Q.--And Alves was supposed to receive nothing at all?
A.--No. When you say the shroff's book was examined that means that he would read through his book what his calculations were for the day, and having compared them with the accountant, he would take the money to the Bank.
Mr. Thurburn.-Was there any check in the way of balances? After a certain period of time the Crown Rents of course would be supposed to be paid. After three or four months or some stated time, did you have a balance made out of what money had been paid and what was outstanding?
A.--The books ought to have been balanced, no doubt.
Q-If defalcations were going on, and if after, say three months, you had a balance taken out, you would have discovered anything of the kind?
A. ---The books I found were left to be balanced by Alves. In former years Alves was given a very long time, the balancing of the Crown Rent accounts being a very laborious business. I have just had them balanced and it took one man sitting at the work doing nothing else 10 hours a day for three weeks to balance them. It seems to have been in consequence of knowing it to be so laborious, and also because Alves was regarded as the hardest worked man in the Treasury, that he was allowed as long as eighteen months to do it.
The Chairman.--I suppose it was written every day?
A.-I can show you the book.
Q.-Before that I want to come to this. Was there any check on the daily work? suppose there was a copy of the Rent Roll sent you from the Land Office?
A. Yes. This is one of the books (witness indicates the Treasury Rent Roll). It year. It goes on to the begins with a column of arrears due and outstanding from last amount due for the year. These two have to be added to bring out the third. The date of payment of arrears is put in--the date of payment for the first half-year and