392
H. E. admitted that the principle was increased in importance as the amounts were larger; but the Secretary of State's sanction had been obtained; and no doubt, they would in future try and keep their requirements before them as nearly as possible in subsequent estimates.
Mr Keswick observed that he could understand small sums being thus disbursed; but when they were very considerable amounts, the Council ought to be consulted.
H. E. observed that the sums were expended in their several departments.
The Colonial Secretary said that the ordinance simply placed a certain sum at the disposal of the Governor and Executive.
Mr Rowett here rose. He said that he observed a sum of $38,000 had been saved on the Reservoir at Pokfolum, and that $11,000 had been spent on repairs to Government House. Could the last item not have been foreseen?
H. E. replied that the white ants had had a good deal to say in that respect; the repairs had been very extensive, and the roof, which leaked before, was now almost water-tight, having been nearly re-made.
Mr Rowett continued. There was a sum of $32,500, voted for the site of the New Civil Hospital, which had not been applied; and a sum of $1,500 had been expended for a Farm Lot at Pokfolum. Would it not be more in form to ask for a special vote, rather than have placed it under the head of excess?
H. E. drew Mr Rowett's attention to the fact that the estimates had been reformed this year. But the item alluded to was under "Lands and Houses."
Mr Rowett observed that no saving was actually effected.
Mr Taylor next rose. He said that it was extremely desirable that all sums should be voted. In small matters he believed that this might be impossible as a rule, but still large sums appeared on the present estimates of $7,000 and $8,000.
The supplementary estimates were exceedingly favorable, a large saving being shown, which, however, had been used in payment of arrears of Military Contribution. This had not been contemplated when the estimates were passed; and though he thought it a good thing that they should pay their debts, this had been done out of savings from works and buildings.
The saving in one department had been used to defray expenses of police, and sums amounting to $96,000 had come from the special fund, for police, school, the Victoria, &c. He objected to this principle, though he knew that H. E. had the authority of the Home Government so to do.
Suppose orders were to arrive from the Home Government to close the gambling houses, then they would not be able to pay their way, as they could not curtail any more for the present.
The hon. member said he would go further. H. E. had kindly reminded members of their duty in the scrutiny of the finances of the Colony, and asked them to exercise their right and make suggestions.
He would not bring up old matter; but he could not but say that his opinion as to Gambling Licenses remained unchanged, and he thought it would be much better to fall back upon the Police Force.
With the large sum of money now at their disposal, they could raise the morals of the Police by importing men who understood Chinese well and were well paid, and thus give a tone to the whole Force which would prevent others from taking bribes.
The original object of the Gambling Licenses was, it ought to be remembered, its suppression; but as yet he saw no step towards it.
H. E. replied. He began by saying that he did not suppose that Mr Taylor seriously meant to draw him out into a discussion on matters which had been gone over so often.
He fully believed that the hon. member would give H. M.'s government and himself credit for making a good use of the fund created; but he was of a different opinion as to the mode adopted.
No other means, however, could be adopted which would so successfully keep down the corruption and crime which were the result of gambling; and he would only refer to the valuable return which he had laid on the table in proof of this position, viz., that crime was very materially diminished.
They would also admit that at present great advantages were derived from this source of expenditure of the money, if usefully laid out.
He agreed with the hon. member that it would not be pleasant to find this source of revenue stopped; and in the event of this supply from the Special Fund ceasing, they would be deprived of the means of doing much which they at present purposed doing: such, for instance, as the Chinese Hospital, the telegraph, and police stations round the island.
Yet, if the whole Fund ceased to-morrow, they would be quite able to go on under their taxation, and by aid of the Stamp Act they would be able to maintain as efficient a police as before; and though they might not extend the Central School as proposed, he would ask them to show him any one duty of Government which would not be provided for independently of any help from the Special Fund.
They would simply do as they had done before. If he saw his way to put a stop to corruption and crime in any other way than was now adopted, he would be happy to do it; but he could not do it.
The Colony was able to improve the Police without the Special Fund; but the fund was thrust on them, and as he had adopted that policy, all he could say was that its only justification was that it was unavoidable.
The Colony had the Fund in hand; if it were withdrawn, the Colony could very easily replace it.
The Colonial Secretary remarked that the Military Contribution was voted in 1867, and the Governor was thus authorized to take it out of the chest.
Mr Keswick repeated his objection that money voted for the Hospital and for works had been expended on other purposes.
The Colonial Secretary remarked that, although voted for special purposes, any funds could be used by the Executive to maintain the public credit, if such sums had been covered by votes.
The hon. members had claimed the right to vote all sums from the Special Fund; and practically that right had been conceded.
The difference between the voted Police expenditure of '67 and '68 and that of '66 was about $90,000; the sum of $13,000 was shown as paid out of the Special Fund (as explained by the Governor); and the balance at the credit of the Special Fund at the end of 1868, was therefore $160,000, which was carried to the account of 1869-70.
H. E. observed that it was very useful to have such discussions. They would remember, though he now governed a Crown Colony, he had also been Governor in responsible governments, where the forms were different: he would be the last to be...
1