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HONGKONG LEGISLATIVE
COUNCIL.
THE HONGKONG DAILY PRESS, THURSDAY, MAY 19TH, 1904.
is obvious, that the opportunities which would he afforded of abusing that privilege are too great. I put it to you that that restriction, if it can be called such, upon his generosity is right and most reasonable in itself. Well, now, I do not want to hurt the feelings of anyone, of course, but I am bound to say that the result of my enquiries into this opposition to the Opium Amendment Bill have leif me to 'lo conclusion that it is factitious rather than real. I am told that the opposition is not really the consumer. The real opposition comes from the illicit deel ers who will be losing their profit. I say that it does not come from the consumer, for so long as he can got his pills and wine at a reasonable him where he gets them. rate it mattera not The opposition here is not real but factitious and unreal. Now. I put it to you and this house that illicit dealers have no claim whatever to any consideration from this house.
They have no interests that they had obtained legally or morally entitling them to protection as ngainst the opium farmer to whom the law had given the exclusive privilege which they had infringed. I more, sir, that the Bill be read a second time.
judges on the point? He neglooted or emitted to do so, and lie is now appealing to us to pass at ordinance creating new rights for him.
The ATTORNEY GENERAL: No; merely to make the definition olar.
New righta an
Hon. H. E. POLLOCK:
provided.
the lessen cartain
Hon. Mr. POLLOCK-Your Excellancy, as I say, I do not know that these petitions have been circulated to hon. znenihers.
Ů0 yours.
What does illicit means unlawful or contrary
for a great number of years. I think, analysing that potition, it would be seen that 16 of these firms out of the 83 have been dealing in this HIS EXCELLENCY-They have boor circulated. Colony unmolested in opium pills or wine for Hon. Mr. POLLOCK-Then from the learned 30 years or over; 24 out of the 83 have bean Attorney-General's speech I gathered that they dealing, in this Colony, inter alia in pills or ll not reached him or been sufficiently con wine, for 20 years or over; and 40 rms- those Hon. Dr HO KAI: I will give you an example, sidered by him because we have been told with roughly half-have been dealing in
wine in this Colony for tan Supposing I have let premises on loase, and in a great flourish of trumpets in this Colony by pills or that lease I make use of certain terms giving the learned Attorney-General of some wonder Years or over. Soms have been going on tonant turns round on Government; that is to say, it is supposed to Therefore, as will ba saan, it is a long-establink- is Bottled. Proin rights of way and so on. That ful discovery or alleged discovery made by the actually for 50 years, and one me and says Yon, gave me a right of way have been made by the Government on its owned business, and yet these people who have bem and such other rights" that means right of initiative namely that of the people who signed carrying on this business without lat or air, and light, also of support or anything else. this petition some only were exclusively hinirance for so many years are chased by the I say: No, I simply gave you certain rights of employed in the business of opium pills or wins. Law Offlear of the Crown as smugglers. They Such other rights menns Why, sir, that question is dealt with specifically are put in the some category as the people who way and no moro.
What is the are running a blockado, acting in breach of the rights belonging to the same class as a right of in paragraph 1 of the petition, way." The lesses says: I will go to law about wording Your petitioners have during the law, and the expression is used constantly by it." Suppose he loses his case. "Well," he periods of years which are set opposite to their him of "illinit sales," says, "I cannot get a decision against you in the respective signatures bean carrying on business mean? "Illioit law court, so I will apply to the Government in this Colony in (inter alia) either opium pills to law; and it is not unlawful or contrary to law ask them for an Ordinance under which a or opinn wine or in both these articles." 1 to sell opium in any way which does not infringe should have thought, sir, that the words "inter the opium farmer's privilege or this Ordinance right of way and such other rights, shall be
Is alia" were sufficiently explicit, though in Latin which was passed to back him up unless the held to mean the rights I have mentional." it just that the Legislature should assist persons and not in English, to convey that these gentle.cpium comes within the definition of s'prepara- of this kind to re-define the words of their con- men who brought in this petition in bringing tion subjected to any degree of artificial heat tracts, making those words luolude certain it in were not and did not purport to be solely for any purpose whatever. And preparation,
or exclusively employed or engaged in the sole I may iuntion, to make things which were not contemplated by the use
my. menning of the terms in the contract? It is on this business of opium pills or wine and nothing elsa. alsolutely clear, in the foüinition is express
as to be understood by the ox- particular principle that I found my opposition The position they had taken up from the very ly stated to the second reading of this Bill. The learned outset was that it was not their sole business, pression "preparing of opinm." Preparation Attorney-General also mentioned that the but, air, although it is not their solo in the subjecting of opiua of any kind to any
business it is a business; and as my hon. art degree of artificial heat and for that purpos Opinn farmer thinks it impossible for him to license these opium pill and wine dealers on learned friend the senior member for the shall be taken to be the preparing of such account of the difficulty. I suppose, of pre- Chinese has pointed out it is a question of prin opium. Therefore it is quite clear what prepared venting illicit dealing as it would be ifciple upon which a stand must be taken. A opium means. It is quite clear what preparation I am one of those party has a perfect right to be protected in umeans and what propuring means. The opimu this Bill were passed. who would propose a solution of the present legitimate business, and I shall show that this farmer stands or falls by this Ordinance. is a legitimate business. With regard to the What has happened! Certain prosecutions--I difcally by this means, and I regret that the opium farmer does not think it feasible learned Attorney-General, there is another do not know whether one or merebat at any for him to adopt a system of licencing and so point he tried to make, I think, and that was rate a prosecution was instituted at the instanco in these pills or wine of the opium farmer at the Magistracy. The obviate such an ordinance as the one before us, that the trade
Magistrate decided that he could not possibly which means the extinction of a very large trade was after all a comparatively small matter. altogether. If he charged a certain fee for a But the hon, senior member for the Chin-way it was prepared opium and dismissed the
drove him from that petition vory
That so far as this Council is concerred license to sellers of opium pills and wine-se which, by the way, I understand (from the effectively because he had afterwards to admit disposos of the matter until it is brought Attorney-General) is only a vary trifling trade, that you may call it small with regard to bofore some higher tribunal for an absolute though it is at the maine time represented individual frins but in aggregate it is large. fading on the question of law. The opium going to interfere tremendously will the profits Why should a trade or business which is in farmer of course has his own legal advisors, of the oplum farmor-
the aggregate largo and which is, I shall show, and it is a matter which I think is well lawful, be interfered with by the Legislature known that he lus behind him some very clever of this Colony I submit, sir, there can be and learned legal advisors, gentlemen who are only one answer, and that is, because the ophum perfectly able to protect his interests, and i farmer pays a very large sum yearly to the hoy had considered that the decision of the Government of this Colony. That is to say. Magistrate was wrong or in the smallest degree that the Government have some fear, some upon to question of course they would have apprehension, that unless some measure of this advised him to take the matter at once up to Therefore to call those sort is passed to give the opium farmer rights the Supreme Court
un sagglers was an entire misnomer. They wditional to those which he already possesses the revenue may suffer some loss, and because were not smugglers at all. They were carry- business which so far as the of that feer, thuit apprehension, they propose to ing override these people who have been dealing decision of the Court was courerned had wine, to take away been decided be legal. It has been in opium pills or their business from them, business whish decided at the Magistracy and the decision has hitherto been lawful and legitimate. Now, of the Magistrats must be takon by this apon the point of this businoes hitdierto carried Council; and I say without the slightest on by dealers in these pills or wine being lawful hesitation that the decision of the Magistrato and legitimate, it is only necessary to refer to was right. There has been no attempt to take the Ordinance, No. 21 of 1891. That, sir. in the matter up before the higher tribunal; there s order to show what the rights of the opinn had been no attempt to institute proceedings farmer are, we must look at the law. It is in any case but one, and the very able legal tedious rathor, but it an important matter in this advisers at the back of the opium farmer felt question. The hon. and learned spier member that they could not do anything that the case for the Chinese stated the mattor in a very clear was hopeless. That was this only possible and lucid fashion, but lest perhaps some of his explanation of ani not having taken the arguments might not have gone homo I think it matter up to the Supreme Court. is very important that we should look at the The ATTORNEY-GENERAL-Probably the Prepared Opium Ordinance and see from it Supreme Court would have said the Magistrate what is the actual protection that has been was right. accorded to the opium farmor. Of course in
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: A very uall trade by the individual; but very large in the aggregate.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI: You are affecting, then, a very large trade.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: It is infinito- simal individually.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI:
But the aggregate is considerable. By charging a licensing feo it seems to me that the fustics of the case would be met. Refusal to grant such licenses means the total abolition of the trade of these dealers and the goodwill of their businesses, by one stroke of the pen, will be transferred to the opium farmer. There must be a goodwill in this as in every trade,
The ATTORNET-GENERAL: But these mai cannot have a goodwill. How can you employ that legal expression in connection with a per- son who sells licitly. Under the ordinance I is illicit. If you contend that the trade look up Sections 9 and 10 of the present Opium Ordinance yen will find that no person can have propated opium in his possession, or prepare opium.
I
Gade.
Ifon. Mr. POLLOCK-To speak of these men
farmer has proposed to increase his prices from the opium farmer showing that this asser- his speech to-day has stated that these dealings before the Council will deprive them of their the grant which was made him he was given as snugglers is preposterous when the Magis-
not execod $100 a month. I only dealt with that argument because it put a wrong aspect on this matter. It is an ad cupitasdum argument and has no force otherwise. The question is DEBATE ON THE OPIUM BILL.
not whether it is a hardship or not to prevent At the meeting of the Legislative Council on man who has been for a long course of time in Tuesday, the Attorney-General, Hoa. Sir illicit business from any longer engaging in it, but Henry S. Berkeley, in moving the second road whather or not the opium farmer, when he comes to this Council to be protected from the illicit fog of the Opium Bill said Your Excelloney, theaters, is entitled to that protection. From the - amandraents to the Opium Ordinance aro neessary to offect that protection to the Opium moral point of view, the question of hardship Parast from illicit sales of opin to which he ought not to outer for a single moment. It was
the case of a smuggler who for a long cours is rightfully ontitled. The necessity for amend ing the Ordinance, sir, arises from the difficulty of time had been in the habit of smuggling, and of putting such a construction upon the present the authorities had either been curdless or had and looked the other way. The illicit opium seller definition of the words "prepared opium "preparation of opium" that exist in the pro- has absolutely no claim to the consideration of sunt Ordinance. The definition of "prepared this Council for one single moment. The man opium" in the Ordinate as it stauls is as who is entitled to consularation and protection is the honest opium farmer who pays $2,000,000 follows" Prepared opium shall so far as re- lates to infringement of the Opium Farmer's a year towards the revenue of this country to privilege of preparing opium for the Colony be accedot the privilege of oxclusively dealing in opium How can he be said to get the pri mean opium which has been subjected to any degree of artificial heat for any purpose what viloge if A. B. C. and D. are illicitly competing and the definition of preparation is with him in the same business P. Bat at the "subjecting of opium of any kind to any degree same time, though unnecessary for me to have
to deal with the question of hardship, it is The COLONIAL TREASURER seconded. of artißoint heat for any purpose whatsoever."
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI-Sir, after having listened Now, persons have been importing into this gratifying to know that in any particular pro
pot inflicting a hardship, very carefully to the speech of the hon, and Colony opium and using it in the preparation coeding ons is of so-called anti-opium-whatever that may and I put it to you that. I have shown learned Attorney-General, I must say that menn--pills and wine; and on appearing before you that, even if hardship were any argu- few of my objections to the second reading of the Magistrate the prosecution has failed. went, which it is not, there is no ques this Bill have vanished. But me point only I beenuse though it was easy enough to provis tion of hardship in dealing with this case still think he did not explain away, and it is that that these wine and pills were each a propuration today. Now, the opium farmer has considered point which, so far as I am concerned, determines of opium, still in neither case could the learned this question, and whether he can continue to
me to oppose the second reading of the Bill. It Magistrate be satisfied that any degree of license & cortain number of persons to sell opium is quite true, sir, that we as members of this artificial beat hand been used in the preparation provided they ny it from him, and the Council Council do all we aan te pretect the public thereof. Still, of course, air, it is obvious at will see at once that is not question for buy revenue, but at the same time I submit, sir, that we should do so only without injuring private once that it was a technical objection which was body but the opiuta farmer is entitled to settle. fatal to the operation of the Ordinance which is Surely a man is entitled to suttle that himself, interests, without undue hardship upon those intended for the protection of the Opium having paid for the exclusive right of dealing whom a measure of this kind would injura Farmer-il is obvious that it is quito impossible,to settle the question for himself whether he Now, the learned Attorney-General has quoted, say, for any witness to say whether any opium will license another to deal also. Well, he has he says, from a private enquiry-which by the considered that question, and I um informed bye, might have been made a little bit more brought from Canton and shipped bare for pre- paration of pills and wine had been at any time that he cannot see his way to any longer pormit pubite on both sides and might have been read by either by licence or otherwise the sale of opium them-that there were 83 firrus concerned in subjected to any degree of artificial heat. (iven the principle therefore of the proper by any person but himself; and the principal dealing with opium pillsand wine. Well, of course, protection of the farmor in the monopoly which reason why he has brou forced to take that personally I have nothing to do with them with this Government from the authority vested in course in the impossibility of controlling the these dealers in opium pills and wine: I know it has granted to him-acceding that principle, illicit dealers either to make then keep a true nothing. I take his word for it. And he said only it is obvious that it is the clear duty of record of their sales or to compel them to pur. five of them are really wholesale dealers or word the Government and of this Council to pass chase their stocks from the opian farmor. It is principally dealing in wine and pills or exclusively such a measure as will give the farmer that one thing to way the opium farmer may con- deal, in them; and that the remainder only have one article among their protection to which he is entitled. Well, sir. tinue to license those persons-five or six or 83 those pilis and wine
Now sir, it does not matter, it seems to it is not necessary, but at the same time it is who have been hitherto selling, but how are stock just as well for us to remember that the amount wa to reply to the opium farmer whom he says, rus, whether a man deals in opium pills and wine paid by the opium farmer for farming the Have you considered the great temptation that exclusively or whether he deals in them as part a rise in the price of opium holds out to persons of his business. You might just as well say monopoly for the exclusive privilege--and wo just remember it is an exclusive privilege that who deal in this trade? What guarantee have yeti can pass a law affecting the interests of he las-of dealing in opium is in itself extreme. I got that the man who is my licences will keep a firm in cotton yarn and say you are not doing ly large and is greatly in excess of that which proper returns of his sales, and what guarantee them any great amount of injury or inflicting has been paid by any farmer in previous years; finve I got that he will not under cover of the hardship apon them because they are also deal and though I have heard it put forward as a licence which he holits from me import a Kttleing in flour, kerosene oil, and other articles. reason why nothing should be done in the frame and a great deal from Canton indo- which they can still continue to trade in. The present circumstances that these illicit sales pendently of me " Any prostical mannan the question is one of principle, and whether it have been going on for a long varied in the house is full of practical men-will see at once affects 83 or 800 persons, or oven one, the prin past-though that may be perfectly true, still that such an answer as that is unanswerable, ciple is the same; we are not justifled in cansing in view of the fact that the farmer to-day is and it would be in the highest degree wrong to injury to a single firm in order that the re- paying more than three times what his prede. force the opium farmer to take any such step to venus of this Colony may be increased, that sessors paid, it may equally be train fast it is obvious undoing or refuse to ufford him pro- the opium farmer's interests may be put into a befter state of protection. It le ke sestus to me it is obviously are true that he tection against one who persists in dealing in a a prudent man of business cue longer be opian without his knowledgeor consout. Well, robbing Panl to pay Peter; you are making catens to overlook that which did not matter now, the second assertion is to the effect that the a law to deprive certain persons of the right to so much to his predecessors who were paying so sale of opium-pills and wine is principally made deal in certain articles so that another anch less for the exclusive right they had, to those who want to brank themselves of the person may get the benefit. Exclusion of this kind we must, as unofficial members of this Now, sir, from enquiries that have been opium habit. I do not know whether such a
Hon Dr. Ho KAI: I contend that under that be medle made xince the necessity for
here today. Council, and guardians of the rights of the these suggestion will
The question is ordinance the sale of these things is not illicit amendments was brought to the notice of but I have heard it suggested that it public, strenuously oppose.
to this Government,
contend that the word as applied to these it appears
that this is the interests of the opiume farm whether this trade in opium wine is illicit or illicit competition has increased since the that the habit should be indulged in rather act. The learned Attorney General in the dealers by the learned Attorney-General is
than ured. Now, onquiries ba been mado reasons appended to the Ordinance and also in mistake, ad my argament is that the Bill now somewhat. It will be seen at once that when a
trade and goodwill. Of course, if the learned tho prisilege of dealing in prepared opiumtrate has decided thint their business is legal. man gives three times as much as his prede- tion and this objection are also groundless, in opium cre illicit. Now, it seems to me that
The "Prepared opium Attorney-General, convinces me--I am certainly as defined by law.
did not ses or was paying for the article he is entitled because the opium farmer is prepared to supply they are not illicit. Thelearned Attorney-General
first of all assumes that the trade is illicit, and, open to couriction-hear, hear)-that dealing of course in an expression which may mean a to Hell, it is only to be supposed that some pilla and wine to anyone who desires to eat or
in these articles is illicit: if the opinm farmer groat many different things. If a man came to increase in the price to the public will follow. to drink thou, whether to oure himself from of course, his argument that we should do away
a lawyer about a tender for prepared opium, the It is to be admitted that the farmer. exercising opium smoking or to indulge himself. The with this trade appears unauswerable. I say, had takon a case to the higher court and the in that rospect the right which he has, has opium farmer is prepared to sell them. There first let us enquire whether the trade is really judges had held the trade to be illicit no one first question the lawyer would ask would be, somewhat increased his prices, but it must also fore it will not lie in the mouth of any person illicit or not. Now the existing Ordinance would have been a stronger supporter of this What do you mean by prepared epium be admitted that that increase has been tritling. who opposes this Bill to say that the pills and under which the opium farmer enjoys his rights Bill than I. I do not hold a brinf for either But here of course we know what is meant be I challenge that statement to be contradicted. wine are no longer to be sold. They will be does not give to him the exclusive right to party, and I wish to protect the revenue of the cause we passed a special Ordinance to deal with The increase in the selling price of opium by sold by the epiuni farmer, and he is prepared to deal in opium; but merely in prepared Colony. There is just one other point that has it. It was passed 13 years ago, and therefore opon branches where all facilities will be given to opium." He wants you noT to alter the struck me. I believe that unless it is perfectly one would think that by the process of have shown that the price has increased by one-
wine; and he has stated that he is prepared to has no right to deal with an ounce of raw
and wine is illicit the Secretary of State at orents have some lon of what was meant by was found that they could not be proceeded fifth only, and one-fifth is I say trifling. That, I put it to the house, can anybody consider an sell these opium pills and wise at a price which opinn without the knowledge and consent of home would not view a Bill of this kind with "prepared opium." What did the Ordinance against and therefore it was entirely a misnomer the Government. At one tiras he had, and it favoar. I consider it my duty and main- say about "prepared opium"? It was in Section to speak of them as illicit dealers or sellers, undas increase in view of the fact that the will be 25 per cent. less than the ordinary sell.
pina farmer now pays $2,000,000 per annum. ing price of ordinary prepared opium. This was owing to his dealing with raw opium in this tain it is the duty of all the official 2 of the Ordinance in which prepared opium This trade has been carried on in this Colony
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI-More than that!
offer on the part of the opinn farmer I cannot Colony that a blockade of Hongkong by members of the Council, to look after was defined and, sir, you will see it isnot merely not merely for ten but 50 and 60 years past.
the rights of the public and The ATTORNEY-GENERAL And more. the but feel, will commend itself and himself to the Chinese revenue eruisors existed, and it was
of defined bat is defined in such a way that shows It is just as lawful and legitimate a business s hon. and learned member remarks Therefors Council at once. for the man is not bound to for that reason that two Commissioners, Siran individual case in which rights are jeopar. clearly that it is defined for the express and selling sagar. Now, what is the position of the if it is more it makes the increase all the make these concessious. He is entitled to come Robert Hart and Taetai Shiu, were
of considering how the opium fermer? Itis suggested or rathor implied sent dired-for after all, the public life is simply the specific purpose more trifling. One-fifth only, however, is here and say, "I stand upon my legal rights down from Peking to treat with the aggregate individual life-and that we should privilego which is granted to the opium farmer that he is being subjected to some hardship. You have put Hongkong Government through Commis consider well before passing an ordinance of this to prepare opiumn shall so far as relates to the I say to that emphatically, No. He has got charged for the opinm and more than thres and demand but justice,
the opium farmer's pri- exactly what he contracted for, what he tender. times is paid to the revenue itself. Meantime ap a tender for the exclusive right of sell-sioner Hussell, afterwards Chief Justico kind which will include now rights in the infringement of the sales of the opium farmer have fallen unoring opium. I give you $2,000,000 for the Sir James Russell. The result. was that concession or monopoly to the opinn farmer and vilege of preparing opium within this to get. Everybody is presumed to know
I have a right to demand the Opium Convention was signed, and then un mously. The falling off too has not been dato contract and
impose very great hardships to the extent of Colcay mean what shall it mean mean the law, and it is unthinkable that in this par to any less consumption. It cannot in fairness justice at your hands and protection from Ordinance was passed by the Hongkong depriving many people of the right to continue opium which has been subjected to any degree of ticular case before the former tendered for this all be attributed to the small ingreuse of one anyone who infringes it. When a man with Legislature forbidding the dealing in raw opin their trade in this Colony. I do not think I artificial heat for any purpose whatever and privilege he did not know that prepare opium ifth. What it is due to is the excessive illicit these rights is propared to make concessions by anybody without the full knowledge and
ean usefully go on to discuss other points shall include dress opium whenever such as defined by law; indeed the case is made intraduction, proparation, and sale in thisColony we are bound to say he cannot be the altogether consent of the Government. The opium far because, as I say, I have endeavoared to place construction is consistent with the contents. stronger because the present farmer was also of opium, which, I say, unless it is checked will undesirable person that he possibly may homer's stock of opium was first of all limited to Before the Council my one objection to the Well, sir, what could be clearer than that the previous farmer. He was not new to the
considered by some. What more does that 5,000 chests or so, and afterwards reduced to, Bill and if that one objection is reloved I
Thoro is not merely a definition of prepared business: he went into it with his eyes open. render it impossible probably at any rate ex
opium there, but it is a definition of prepared He has tendered for this privilege of prepared tremely difficult for the opitu farmer to fulfil bona-fide consumer require than to have a place I think, 3,000 chests. I have not the figures but would be very glad to give the Bill my support. the conditions of the tender which he has entered at which he can buy his pills and wine at a
I think that is about right. Then, also, he is
opium which is expressly stated to relate to the opiam as defined by isw, and had got it. It into in this Colony. Now, I propose to deal reasonable price? Do you suppose it matters restricted by certain regulations as to the
infringement of the opium farmer's privilege. might be an unfortunate thing for them, as the shortly with one or two suggestions which one cash to the consumer from whom he buys number of chests he shall draw out of bond in a
it is a provision of the law so that not Attorney-General hinted in his speech, that baliers will be urged by my hon. and learned the opium so long as he can get it at a certain time. These restrictions placed upon
merely the opium farmer bat anybody else this trade in pills was friend opposite [Mr. Pollock to the progress reasonable price, and if he can get it at a price the dealings of the farmer la raw opium provat
who deals in any way with any mixtura of This only showed there was a demand for this reasure. The first, as I understand it, 25 per cont. lees than the price of prepared him muggling it into the interior of China,
a chemical material in which opium occurs may them in this Colony, and as D.. Ho Kai is that it is a great hardship to prevent the sale opio and at a branch establishment of the but in the new Bill, the opium farmer's power
know perfectly clearly what is meant by the had pointed out it would be very unfair ounes or grain of
words" prepared opian." And that, sir, was to interfere with these people who were carry. of opium-pilla and wine by persons who farmor, he is no long or say complaint so far is expreme, and not an hare hitherto been licenced or permitted by as he is concerned. He gets all he wants, the prepared opium can be sold er dealt in in this
passed by the Legislature, that provision is ing on this increasing business, the good will of Colony without his consent. former opium farmers to sell them, and also probable conclusion in, cheaper from the farmer
enacted by the Legislature not merely for the which would also be increasing. The hou. At purpose of informing the opium former but also torney-General had stated that the opposition secondly, to prevent the malo of these opium wine than he could and doos from the illicit seller. and pills would be to force the opium habit upon Now, I will not dotain you very much longer, anyone prepare a dram of opium in the the Charaber of Commerce. I shall be very
glad to be informed whether the hou, member for the purpose of informing other people. It was fictitious because it came from parties who persons who are struggling to free themselves but I will just say that that assertion that the Colony.
in the exoreiss of his profession has drawn these should know the extent to which he is protected this proposed measure the dealers. That was in not merely necessary that the opium farmer were directly overridden and borne down by from it. Now, sir, neither of those assertions pills and wine are taken by a person to cure the Hon. Dr. Ho KAI: No one can prepare opium petitions, has been paid for drawing them, and stand for a moment when examined. Take the opium habit has nothing in it, because it is in this Colony except the firmer, or other is to be remunerated for advocating the prayer but it is also necessary that other people should a most extraordinary argument to use. Sup first-the hardship upon those who have hither- impossible for anyone who advances such a person having his constat. Now let us con-
or may not do vis a vis the opium farmer. particular finns or porrons but one should deal to engaged either in selling opium wine and pilla, suggestion to produce such an authority of wider the words "prepared opium." Every contained in these petitions before this Council have it clearly defined what they may do posing a law were passed to-morrow that no by permission or by overlooking or by licence any value if any at all which will hold the hon. member of this Conncil knows that with reply to the questions which have been just put Therefore this express provision was passed in stationery, would it be called fictitions be- from the opium farmer. Now we also have made habit will be mured in that way. It is cured by the law before him the opium farmer to me, I did prepare these petitions profession defining what prepared opium is to bo, cause the other businesses dealing in stationery enquiries into that assertion because the last what is called strength of will and not by sipping knew that law when he tendered for ally for the parties on behalf of the parties for and it is expressly limited, as your Ex said this must be stopped; it is unfair as a por thing this Government desires is to inflict hard-and ripping opium wine or taking reduced puffs monopoly. What he paid for it does not whom they are prepared. There is no secret cellency will see, to opiurn which has been sub- tion of our business is being taken away. ship upon anybody; and from the report made of opium pipes or swallowing pills. For the matter; that is not the question we are at about it. And I forwarded the petitions to thejected to any degree of artificial heat for any Sarely such an opposition could not be described by the hon. Registrar-General it appears that purpose of catching the unwary, these wine and
present considering. The opium farmer having Government, With regard to the other ques- purpose whatever, and I think it extremely as dictitious? Surely the people dealing in this there are some 83 firms who deal in opium-pillspills are called by the name of anti-opium. had his tender accepted, and having paid accor- tion which has been put, I think, your Exeal probable, as the learned senior member for the legitimate business proposed to be interfered
fortand What does it mean? It has no meaning at all, † dingly, und wine, and of these 83 only five of them deal
there were certain persons tancy, that it was hardly necessary and hardly
Chinese has suggested, that the reason why that with by this Bill have a better right than anybody in this Colony selling opium wine And in these articles exclusively. But the other They are not anti-opium pills and wine but
definition was adopted was that the Legislature else to say this legislationisanjustand unfair; itis 75 were general dealers who turned-I cannot opium; they are pills and wine which contain a opium pills which we will assume for the proper that suck a question should be put intended to legislate for and had in their doing away with a portion of our business; it is
beed hardly say I think these who have followed moment interfered with his business. He call it an honest penny, by the additional sales certain amount of spiuta in them, and that they
But I say as to will offert a cure I say again it is impossible for summoned of opium-pills and wine.
one of these persons before the my public careur in this Colony know that I do wind the preparation for the purpose of making our business which was previously car- not accept pay and that I have no intention of smoking, and that is probably the reason why ried on as legal and legitimate, unfair and quantum, of these 83 there were only five, anyone to bring any authority to assure us. Magistrate who enquired inte the case accepting pay for appearing in this Council and these words are inserted there. Then, sir, as if unlawful, it is putting us entirely in the bands must deal with tive and seo Well, now, there has been another objection and decided that he could not hold that for any views which I may express in this to make the matter doubly clear, as it to make of the opium fariner; it is wiping out our busi- what hardship would be to them. But even raised, and it was the one that lind most weight opium which was contained in opium pills or
Council. I think it would be obviously improper sure that there could be no possibility of misness. Surely it is improper to describe the
take, farther down in the same section of opposition of such people us suppose there were 88. The largest of these with ma; and that was that the effect of the wine, as the case might be, came within the for me as a member of this Council to accept Ordinance 31 of 1891 there is a definition of When the hon. Attorney-General referred dealers did a business which he admitted to proposed measure will be to prevent the Tung Opium Ordinance,
any fee, reward, or gratuity whatsoever in respect amount to--what do you think P-$100 a month Wah Hospital from prescribing opien pills and
The ATTORNEY GENERAL: Because he could of any views which I may lay before this preparation. Preparation, the subjecting of to the opposition of the dealers he sooms total sales, and not net but gross sales; and he wine for its patients. Well, geatfemen, I have not prove that it had been subjected to heat. admitted to the Registrar-General, and we have pointed out to you in the house that the opium Hon. Dr. Ho KAI: Well, it was not prepared Council. As I have stated I was asked to opia of any kind to any degree of artificial to have forgotten that there was in addition it in the report, that after deducting out of farmer is prepared to make concessions which spinm, and the Magistrate could not say that prepare and did prepare in a professional heat for any purpose whatever, shal he taken to a petition from the general Chinese community sir, the test there in that definition of prepara-signed--there being 48 signatures of individual rocket expenses his profit-the largest profit are reasonable. He is prepared to do more, be it was. I can understand that hout is required capacity-und I think it will be found that I be the preparing of such opiam. Therefore of this Colony, which was very numerously
was perfectly right in so doing-these petitions amounted to about $35 a month. Now, where cause he is preparod, recognising as we all do to make prepared opium, but the words which have boss forwarded to this Connell. tion, as in the test of propared opium, is persons and 2178 of firms carrying on business is the hardship? Ever suppose the opium the good work the Tung Walt Hospital does in "prepared opium" in the ordinance mean opium These petitions were addressed to the hon. the test whether or not the opium has been sub here, against this proposed measure; farmer had been allowing those persone or in- this country, to recognise the right of the hos-prepared for smoking. Whon the farm was
members of this Council, I do not know jected to any kind or dogres of artificial best. petition, although I can wall understand there ducing them to sell these opium wine and pills, pital authorities to prescribe pills and wine to first created the attention of the Legislature whether they were circulated. It rather seems within that, then no person in this Colony, ne dentors
If it has not been subjected, if it does not fall may have boon divergent opinions among petitioners pulat, these I say there is no hardship there. It is clear its in-patients without restriction of any kind was concentratedupon the creation of a monopoly to me they were not. At any rate I do therefore, I put it to you, tint while a great loss
in the sale of opium prepared for smoking, not see them on the table. My position is Magistrate, no Judge, no member of the execu mention that in their belief the taking of is inflicted upon the opium farmer by the infringement of his privilage the loss to the individual dealers is comparatively small.
HIS EXCELLENCY-I think you will recollect that the report of the Registrar-General stated that this $100 a month was taken by the largest
ATTORNEY-GENERAL-He decide
ihat. He decided that in A certain esse brought before him he would not say that the opium which had been sold had been subjected to any dogres of heat. Now we propose to put in a clear definition in order to protect the opium farmer
Hon. Mr. POLLOCK-If these people were atle to be proceeded against at law they would have hoon proceeded against; the matter would
the opium farmer has been triding. Enquiries those who desire to purchase these pills and whole aspect of the case. At present the farmer clearly established that the sale of opium pills filtration in people's minds people would at all lace been carried up to the higier Court. It
HO
we
retail dealer.
The ATTORNEY GENERAL-I understood I did say a retail dealer. He has tho largest re- tail business, and he admitted that his sales did
The ATTORNEY GENERAL: Nor can
aven
Hon. Mr. Potock next rose to speak.
Hie EXCELLENCY-I should be very much obliged if you will inform me what the position is exactly of these petitions. This Council has received two patitions; one purports to emanate from certain members of the general community and the other from the shopy dealing in these pills. Both of these petitions bare been for warded to us through a somewhat unusual channel – the channel of the hon. member for
Hon. Mr. POLLOCK-Your Excellency, in
except this, which cannot be called a restriction, that the pills and wine ure obtained from him.
and opiam cannot to be prepared for smoking. And also he is prepared to do more. He is pre- without passing through some degree of heat perfectly clear, and I should have thought it was absolutely unnecessary that I should or parad, and I think it is reasonable, to supply it might be boiling heat or aerely slight heat. those opium pills and wine free, and that, I think, When the farmer failed in his case at the plain to this Council that I have not been paid is generous, so we have the opium farmer here Magistracy, it seems to me that if he was dis- y fee or reward and that I do not intend to both reasonable in his demands and generons in satisfied with the decision, he should have taken accept any fee or reward for coming here to-day
and stating my views to the Council. his intentions. But he cannot consent that the the case into the Supreme Court. If he is
within his right in claiming what he does, he tions were simply made to find out the, hoa. H18 EXCELLENCE thank you. My ques Tang Wah Hospital should supply all its out. patients in a similar manner. Surely, gentle-should get it, but why did he not go to the men, that is not unreasonable because the reason higher court and ask for the opinion of the member's position.
tive can possibly say that that opinn has been prepared.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL Thst Ordinance is a dead letter,
the on
он the increase.
fictitious
und in that
the opian habit. Of course, some doctora opium pills or wine does help to break may think one way and some the other, but these petitioners set their signatures to it. Excellency may possibly have omitted to note that in paragraph 4 of the petition these dealers
Your
Hon. Mr. POLLOCK-That definition of pre- pured opium is expressly made with reference to
submit, and can call witnesses in support of the opium farmer's privilege. Now, in this matter, as has been shown by the petition from the the submission, that the trade which they are dealers in opium pills or wine, they have been carrying on in opium pille or opium wine is dealing in these pilis and wine in this Colony I actually beneficial to the Chinese inhabitants of
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