December 20, 1909.]
HONGKONG LEGISLATIVE
COUNCIL.
CHINA OVERLAND TRADE REPORT.
The COLONIAL TREASURER-In seconding, sir, I
may state that in my opinion the amount should be treated as debit to revenue instead of an item in expenditure. This will make all the A meeting of the Hongkong Legislative difference as to the payment of 20 per cent. for Council was held on Dec. 16th in the Council
the military contribution. Chamber.
The following were present: HIS EXCELLENCY THE GOVERNOR, SIR FREDERICK JOHN DEALTRY LUGARD, K.C.M.G., C.B., D.S.O.
HIS EXCELLENCY MAJOR GENERAL R. G. BREADWOOD, C B.
Hon. Sir F. H. MAY, K.C.M.G. (Colonial Secretary).
Hon. Mr. F. A. HAZELAND (Attorney- General).
Hon. Mr. A. M. THOMSON (Colonial Trea- surer).
Hon. Mr. P. N. H. JONES (Director of Public Works).
Hon. Mr. A. W. BREWIN (Registrar-General). Hon. Mr. F. J. BADELEY (Capt. Superinten- dent of Police).
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI, M.B., C.M.G.
Hon, Mr. E. OSBORNE.
Hon. Mr. E. A. HEWETT.
Hon. Mr. MURRAY STEWART.
Hon. Mr. WEL. YUK, C.M.G.
Mr. C. CLEMENTI (Clerk of Councils).
MINUTES.
The minutes of the last meeting were read and confirmed.
FINANCIAL MINUTES..
The COLONIAL SECRETARY, by command of His Excellency the Governor, laid on the table -Financial Minutes (Nos 57 to 59), and moved that they be referred to the Finance Com- mittee.
FINANCIAL.
The COLONIAL SECRETARY, by command of His Excellency the Governor, laid on the table the report of the Finance Committee (No. 20) and moved its adoption,
The COLONIAL TREASURER seconded, and the motion was agreed to.
LIQUOR DUTIES REBATE TO THE SERVICES.
The COLONIAL SECRETARY-I beg to move she resolution standing in my name under tection 2 of the Liquors Ordinance Amendment Ordinance, No. 30 of 1909.
Resolved that the sum of $2,189 as an Import Allowance up to and including the 31st Decem- ber, 1909, be paid out of the Public Revenue of the Colony as a rebate in part of the duties paid on intoxicating liquors to the Naval Authorities in respect of the duties paid on irtoxicating liquors (not being Naval Stores the property of His Majesty) consumed at the Royal Naval Canteen.
Further resolved that the sum of $10,268 as an Import Allowance up to and including the 31st December,,909, be paid out of the Public Revenue of the Colony as a rebate in part of the duties paid on intoxicating liquors to the Military Authorities in respect of the duties paid on intoxicating liquors (not being Military Stores the property of His Majesty) consumed at Head Quarter House and the Military Messes and Canteens in the Colony or purchased by married officers or men borne on the strength of the Garrison for their own consumption.
Further resolved that the sum of $8,400 as an Import Allowance for the year 1910 be paid out of the Public Revenue of the Colony as a rebate in part of the duties paid on intoxicating liquors to the Naval Authorities in respect of the duties paid on intoxicating liquors (not being Naval Stores the property of His Majesty) consumed at the Royal Naval Canteen.
Further resolved that the sum of $47,600 as * Import Allowance for the year 1910 be paid out of the Public Revenue of the Colony as a rebate in part of the duties paid on intoxicating liquors to the Military Authorities in respect of the duties paid on intoxicating liquors (not being Military Stores the property of His Majesty) consumed at Head Quarter House and the Mili- tary Messes and Canteens in the Colony or pur- chased by married officers or men borne on the strength of the Garrison for their own con- sumption.
The COLONIAL SECRETARY, in moving the resolution, said-Copies of the resolution have been circulated to members. The figures contained in the resolution are based on the return of consumption furnished by the naval and military authorities.
HIS EXCELLENCY-The point raised by the Hon. Colonial Treasurer will be referred to
the Secretary of State, on whose ruling depends the ultimate result. I shall be glad to recommend the point to his favourable cop. sideration.
WIRELESS STATION ON PRATAS ISLAND.
HIS EXCELLENCY-Gentlemen, I have, to tion which I made some time ago with regard announce to the Council that the recommenda-
to the establishment of a wireless station on the Pratas atoll to the Minister at Peking has been considered by the Waiwupu, to whom he referred the recommendation, and he in- forms me now that the Waiwupu referred the matter to the consideration of the Board of Posts and Communications, and the latter now reply that the Viceroy of the Liang Kwang has been instructed to at once make the necessary arrangements. Applause.)
46
Fa
THE STAMP ORDINANCE. The ATTORNEY-GENERAL moved the third reading of the Bill entitled, An Ordinance to amend the Stamp Ordinance, 1901."
The COLONIAL SECRETARY seconded. Hon. Dr. Ho KAI-Sir, before the third reading is taken and the Bill passed into law, I have a few remarks to make. In the second reading I, together with the other hon. members, gave my support to the Bill, inasmuch as it would give people a tendency to take out letters of administration and probate within a reason- able time. Since then, however, it has been pointed out to me that the delay in taking out administration or probate is due to ignorance of the law or to not knowing that the deceased had property in this Colony. This especi- ally is the case with the relatives of a deceased person who reside in Canton and the interior of China, Ignorance as to the property of the deceased in the Colony is remedied by section sub-section 20 (a), which contains a provision making it necessary to satisfy judge of the Supreme Court that due and reasonable diligence has been exercised in ascertaining the existence of property in this Colony but without success, then the judge will not impose a penalty. As to ignorance of the law, I think we will have to devise some special means of making provisions of this Ordinance as widely known among the Chinese as possible. All the Ordinances are not translated beforehand and it will take some little time to translate and circulate this one. What I recommend the Government to do is to postpone the enforcement of this Ordinance until a translation has been made and copies dis- tributed among the Chinese houses and shops in this Colony. It is well known that very few hinese read the Gazette and very few read the European newspapers, and in order to bring the provisions of this Ordinance to the notice of Chinese in Canton and other parts of China as well as in Hongkong I think translat ons should be distributed, as it will encourage the Chinese to come forward to take out administration and probate and will also prevent hardships to the relatives of the deceased person who may not be aware of the law and will have as a consequence to pay three times the amount he would have had to at first.
Hon. Mr. WEI YUK supported.
HIS EXCELLENCY-I take it that the motion which the hon. member who has just spoken desires to make is that the Bill should be recom mitted for consideration of the last clause, which bears the date on which this Bill comes into operation.
Hon, Dr. Ho KAI-I propose that the Bill be recommitted with a view to considering the [ast clause.
Hon. Mr. WEI. YUK seconded.
Council then went into Committee to consider the clause.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI moved that the clause should read that the Ordinance should come into operation on July 1st, so as to allow six months for translation of the Ordinance and distribution of copies among the Chinese community. He thought this would facilitate the enforcement of the Ordinance and that the time would not be lost,
|
525
The COLONIAL TREASURER was of opinion that six months was a very long time to allow for translation. It could be done in a fortnight.
The COLONIAL SECRETARY agreed, and said that the trouble was not ignorance as advised, but the trouble which has been found by the officers who had to administer probate was that full disclosure was not made. It was not that a man did not make disclosure, but he did not
make full disclosure.
1
Hon. D... Ho KAI replied that that was provided for in another section.
The COLONIAL SECRETARY said concealment would have to be proved, and that was a difficult
before the Magistrate and get him imprisoned. thing to do in connection with Chinese shops. If it could be proved, they could prosecute a man This clause was another way of remedying the evil
The COLONIAL TREASURER stated that the hon. member might not know that in the present Ordinance the principle of penalising for ignorance and carelessness is enforced to the extent of ten times the duty not paid. No one had ever objected to that on account of people not being aware of it.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI said he was only speaking on behalf of people residing out of the Colony who did not know the law.
The COLONIAL TREASURER said they could not recognise people outside the Colony.
HIS EXCELLENCY remarked that in such a case the person would have the "opportunity of showing to the satisfaction of the Supreme Court.'
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL pointed out that the Ordinance did not take effect until after the interval of a year.
►
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI asked what would be the result if a person did not know he had property here.
The CAPTAIN-SUPERINTENDENT OF POLICE said they could not teach Hongkong law to all in the Kwangtung province.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI replied that if the Chinese here were given a little time they would be able to let people in the country know how matters stood.
The COLONIAL SECRETARY pointed out that they knew it already.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI said he had been informed by a big firm of solicitors that, they had several cases in which people did not know they had property in the Colony. One occurred within the past week in which a widow came here to take out probate six years after the death of her husband.
The COLONIAL TREASURER pointed out that whatever they did there were bound to be cases like that.
Hon. Mr. STEWART remarked that all the hon. member asked for was that step should be taken to render these cases as few as possible,
Hon. Mr. HEWETT observed that if they agreed to this proposal they were opening a wide door, and equal time might be demanded so that all laws could be translated into Chinese and circulated not only in the Colony but among the neighbouring provinces.
Hon, Dr. Ho KAI said he was not opposing the law. He simply wanted to make it known so that many hardships might be prevented.
HIS EXCELLENCY remarked that the Or- dinance was very short, and he thought postpone- ment until February 1st would give ample time for translation and distribution.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI asked if His Excellency would consent to March 1st,
HIS EXCELLENCY said this was only for the purpose of translation.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI added that he wanted due knowledge to be given to the Chinese.
The COLONIAL TREASURER said they might object to any criminal law on the same ground.
Hon. Mr. ÖSBORNE stated that it would be twelve months before any penalty would be inflicted.
Hon. Mr. STEWART thought the object would be served if a translation were made and widely circulated.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI amended his motion to read March 1st.
This was accepted by the Committee. On Council resuming,
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL moved the third reading of the Bill.
The COLONIAL SECRETARY seconded, and, the Bill was read a third time and passed.