CAB7-4 — Page 621

Page 621

591

19TH MAY, 1882.

The EARL of CARNARVON.

Present:

The EARL of CAMPERDOWN.

Sir HENRY T. HOLLAND, Bart., M.P., K.C.M.G.

Admiral of the Fleet Sir ALEXANDER MILNE, Bart., G.C.B. General Sir LINTORN SIMMONS, G.C.B.

Sir HENRY BARKLY, G.C.M.G., K.C.B. SAMUEL WHITBREAD, Esq., M.P.

Captain HERBERT JEKYLL, R.E., Secretary.

Sir HENRY PARKES, K.O.M.G., examined :

5689. The Earl of Carnarvon.-You have been good enough, at my request, to attend here to-day to speak to us on the subject of our inquiry?—If I can make any statement that will be of value to the Commission, I shall be very glad to do so.

5690. The first point on which I will ask your opinion is, whether, so far as it is possible to provide uniformity as regards land defences, it is desirable to do so?—Yes, I may distinctly say that I think it is desirable that the whole of the defences of the Colonies should be as much as possible on one uniform principle, and that, as far as possible, the Colonies should agree to act together.

5691. There should be, if possible, uniformity of arms and equipments, and all that would enable the forces of the different Australian Colonies on an emergency to act together?-I do not think there could be a doubt about that. I cannot see any advantage to be derived from a difference, and I can see much good that would follow from uniformity.

5692. We are quite aware of how many local difficulties there may be, and how necessary it is to allow these things to develop themselves; but would you see any insurmountable difficulties in the near future in combining occasionally the forces of some of the Colonies, like those of New South Wales and Queensland, or New South Wales and Victoria, for a given number of days of the year for military manœuvres or drill?—I do not think that there would be much difficulty. I do not think that the jealousies of the Colonies are so great as they are supposed to be in England.

5693. The completion of the railway communication between the Colonies would facilitate anything of that kind ?--Certainly.

5694. There can be no doubt, I suppose, that the feeling of the Colonies in time of war would be to accept a combination of forces for the common good? -It must be understood that what I say on such a point as that is simply my own individual opinion. I cannot undertake to represent any one except myself. My own opinion is, that if unfortunately England were engaged in a war, such a war as I suppose she would only be likely to be engaged in when no other course would be open to her, and she would be justified on grounds of justice, and would be so con- sidered between nation and nation; if she was engaged in a war of that kind, I think the spirit of the Colonies would rally very strongly to her side. I do not for a moment anticipate that the Colonies would have any desire to free themselves from the consequences of a war in which the Empire should be engaged, if it were such as commended itself to the patriotism of Englishmen generally; and in that case it would follow, as a matter of course, that the Colonies would seek then to do anything that would render their resources most effective for the purposes of defence; and as that would be by intimate union, I have no

doubt it would precipitate the intimate union at once. That is my impression.

5695. I believe in New South Wales you have never made the question of military defence a party question ? -We have in New South Wales, as I suspect you have in England, persons who think that it is a great waste to expend money on military defence, and the estimates for military defences have always been more or less opposed, and Ministers have been always asked to reduce or reconsider them, or something of that kind; but still they are generally voted--in fact, almost always.

5696. My impression is that the general spirit of the New South Wales Parliament has always been to give, in a free and ungrudging manner, what was considered to be reasonably required for purposes of defence?--I think so. There are some differences in the Colonies still as to the best mode of preparing for defence, as to the system of organization, and so on. That question is not settled, I believe, and we have not yet got into the best possible system of defence; but as far as the broad principle of being prepared to defend ourselves in time of danger is concerned, I do not think there is a doubt about it being the general opinion of the country that we should be so prepared.

5697. And the strong desire is to arrive at the best organization that can be devised?—Yes; but on that point I think I ought to explain that this view is enter- tained very generally, and I entertain it myself very strongly, that in a new country we ought to subtract as little as possible of the productive element of the country -the labour-for defence purposes, and that nothing can be more useless and injurious than to have men in a state of compulsory idleness. We are very much of that opinion, and I am strongly of opinion myself that it is far better to have men properly taught the military profession without being continuously in service, trusting to their being converted rapidly into soldiers when the time of danger comes, rather than keeping men in barracks. I am not in favour of keeping a large number of men in barracks in the Colony. Again, in connection with this there is a strong disposition on the part of the flower of our young men to give their services to the country for military organizations, and the sons of respectable families like it. Indeed, they would enrol themselves much more numerously than we permit, if we encouraged them.

5698. On the other hand you would also quite admit the necessity for a small permanent artillery force of skilled men ?—Yes.

5699. And even more, the partial payment of volun- teers, I suppose?—Yes; I think that question must be left to a large extent open; there are many men with us who would rather serve without pay than be per- mitted to do so for pay.

5700. I was rather speaking of a limited number who would act as a skilled nucleus ?--I am quite in favour of a small permanent force of artillery. The

Sir Henry Parkes, K.C.M.G.

19 May, 1882.

Page 621

313

Page 621

Page 621