THE HONGKONG WEEKLY PRESS AND
[June 13, 1908.
public and consequently the full reasons for accepting recommendations by the Sanitary Board
The have not been made public. Governor-in-Council had no desire for secrsoy and as the sums which will be required for resumption would appear in the estimates for the year and would have to be voted by the Council thenthe matter would be discussed as publicly 88 the Council wished. If the unofficial should members think this is not sufficient be quite willing to accept, the amendment by the member for the Chamber of Commercs. But I would wish you to consider the point and mature your viewa as to whether sufficient publicity is not already ensured by the fact that any money required for the resumption of pro- party must appear on the estimates for the
That year and be voted upon by this Council, at any rate will dispense with the charge that the Government had any desire for secrecy.
The Hon. Mr. STEWART-May I say I did not suggest that was the intention of the new clause, to ensure secrecy, but that it had the effect of concealing what was going on from the public, and I saw no reason for that.
His EXCELLENCY-As you point out it would not be rushed through The formal recom. mendation would come to the Government from the Head of the Sanitary Department and the matter would be discussid at some length.
The Hou, Mr. STEWART—I see an advantage in giving the representatives of the public who sit on the Sanitary Board whose special pro- viaca it is to deal with these matters au oppor- tunity of expressing their views and letting the public know what is proposed to be done.
can be done gradually, block by block, maining objection is not serious enough to 24 may be found necessary in any par- warrant continued opposition to the proposal. ticular locality. It was urged by the hon. In these circumstances, I do not feel justified member who represents the Chamber of Com-in pressing my individual objection to the merce that the roof of the third house might clause on this ground, I object in principle become the receptacle for rubbish thrown from to the imposition of vague and indefinite on the windows of the adjoining houses. I tingent liabilities upon any property of any kind think it should not be beyond the resources of unless it can be shown to be an absolute neces the police and of the Police Carts to deal with sity of the public welfare. I am not persuaded this matter by the inflio ion of fines or other that this necessity has been made out. But I panishment, nor, I am told, has it occurred in am not prepared to ride my owaida to the these blocks in the Colony which have already death. This view of the matter is now,
I aa- been built on this principle. It has been said derstand, shared by my unofficial colleagues. that the roof would be certain to leak. That But though we are agreed about this we are question is for the engineers and I am not also agreed in viewing with a certain amount of aware they have raised it as an object on. uneasiness the nature and extent of the power Personally I think a roof with a very low pitch which the clause as it stands puts into the which would not obstruct the light and air from hands of the medical officer of health. the lateral windows would best meet the diffi- However well assured we
may feel that the oulty. The third point I ask you to look at present occupants of the offices upon which this clause from, is: Will this scheme involve the responsibility rests are worthy of our un the Government in # heavy expenditure questioned confidence, we cannot commit the beyond the resourceS of the Colony ? I community to indefinite trust in the fature have already pointed out it is much less costly and I for one think, and I hops others will than the present alternative of resumption and support me in saying, that the public would it can be applied piecemeal. I invite your prefer to have the practical working of the attention to the fact that the olause reserves to clause made subject to public discussion. the Government in Conncil the right to put the Pablici y can be obtained for discussion upa scheme into operation or not. It cannot be it by reverting to the original wording of the forced upon the Government either by an owner clause as it stood in thi draft of the bill anxious to secure the improvement of his pro- dated 5th May and which placed the initiative perty on the one hand or on the other by the with the Medical Officer of Health It was Sanitary Board anxious to improve the general for him to represent to the Sanitary Board sanitation of the Colony to an extent which the and for the
Sanitary Board, if they revenue cannot bear. I think therefore that the approved of his proposals, to pass on B scheme has much to recommend it from every recommendation in writing to the Governor point of view and I trust that members of Council in-Council.
There seems to ba Ino good will adopt it unanimously in principle, though reason why the Government should seek in detail suggestions could be made, more to throw a veil of secrecy over the reasons especially with regard to the recovery of the advanced by the Medical Officer of Health cost which falls upon the owner.
for the demolition of insanitary property. I am very ready to recognise the necessity that exists for many kinds of State business being conducted with the secrecy that case alone ensure despatch, bat business of this sort does not seem to create any necessity for either secrecy or despatch. Of course if the Governor. in-Council had to confess his inability to carry out the recommendation of the Sanitary Board owing to the state of the local exchequer he might conceivably prefer the Exepative Council with its closed doors as a confessional bor, but I think the community have a right to be Itoonsalted in such a 0156. In such a case the Governor-in Council would be able to throw the responsibility back upon the community. He would merely have to state his reasons and to put the problem thus for the consideration of the taxpayers of the Colony: "If you think the work of demolition sufficiently urgent to justify me in imposing fresh taxation I willing to 'impose fresh taxes. It is a matter for; the colony to decide." This would be a public benefit inasmuch as it would saddle public criticism with the weight of the proposed increase in the burden of taxation and would be a useful means of testing the sincerity of any outcry made for drastic measures. Publicity in such matters should be encouraged. Discussion in such matters should be encouraged. And both publicity and dis- cussion should be welcomed by the Government in all matters in which their actions are anham- pered by inconvenient orders from Home. If the Governmentare prepared to accept the suggested amendment in the spirit in which the suggestion in the event of the building being subject
Hon. Mr. STEWART-Speaking as the mover of the rejection of this clause I desire to make certain admissions. I admit that I did not fully appreciate the extent of the concession made by the alteration introduced into it. For that I sub- mit the Unofficial Members are not to blame. It was not until the meeting had actually opened that the new draft of the clause was passed along to where I sit and a lack of com- prehension in understanding of its contents was entirely excusable under the circums tances. The terminology is not of so simple an order that he who runs may read.
is true that the concession made in no
repa-
way affects either the structural difficulties on which I dwelt, or the objection which I put forward on sanitary grounds. As regards the structural difficulties I am willing to withdraw my objections in view of the frank acceptation of the Government's responsibility in the matter of providing against the attendant riskaa matter in which the Colonial Secretary has practically staked the tation of the Director of Public Works. And as regards the prospect of the wells formed by the demolished upper stories being treated as convenient receptacles for shot rub. bish by the occupants of the flanking houses it has been represented to me that this aspect of the question will naturally engage the attention of the Sanitary Department for which, under its new executive head, the Government will be equally responsible. But the concession made does affect that aspect of the question upon which I laid most stress. It does minimise the objection which raised to the introduction of a new and undesirable element of uncertainty into the conditions of the ownership of pro- perty. I say it minimises the objection. The element of uncertainty remains, but it is obvious that a contingent liability to contribute towards the cost of improvements is less of an objection
than a similar liability to contribute towards the cost of improvements and compensation as well. The degree of objection originally raised од the score of the prospective financial effect upon property, to the scheme as previously outlined, was held to warrant the deletion of the clause, not only in my opinion, but in the opinion of many who are recognised
as the accredited unofficial authorities on questions relating to property in this Colony. I understand that the opinion of these recognised authorities on property has under- gone considerable modification as a result of
the concessions made in the matter of com-
pensation and that in their opinion the re-
&m
is made, it will be an earnest that the unofficial members have not been unduly confiding in agreeing to with draw the motion for the deletion of the clause Before withdrawing it we should like to have a statement on this point. I desire to make an advance which will honourably cover a retreat, but before moving off the ground I wish to be assured of the amicable intentions of the Government. (Applause.)
HIS EXCELLENCY-In reply to the speech which the member for the Chamber of Commerce has just made I would say that I had proposed to alter the words Medical Officer of Health to the
"head of the Sanitary Department" I most strongly say that the the object of inserting the words Medical Officer of Health" instead of "Sanitary Board" was not from any desire for secrecy; the desire was to avoid the possibility of friction. When representations have been made in the past by the Sanitary Board to the Governor in Council the meetings of the Executive Council are not
HIS EXCELLENCY-I fully see the force of your argument, but it was desired to eliminats from this Bill all possibility of friction. That was the real motive in patting in the words "the Medical Officer of Health" to make the formal recommendation to the Governor-in- Council in the first instance. If it is the unanimous wish of members that the Sanitary Board should be inserted in place of the Medical Officer of Health the Government is willing to do so.
The Hon. Mr. STEWART-Pardon me. Not instead of, but in addition to the Medical Officer of Health. We desire the initiative to come from the Medical Officer of Health. We also desire that it should be clear that the last word in the matter should be with the Governor-in
Council.
Hon. Mr. SLADE: It is quite clear.
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HIS EXCELLENCY read the proposed altera- tion Whenever the Board on the representa- tion of the Medical Officer of Health is satisfied etc., the Governor-in-Council may direct the demolition,"
The amendment was agreed to.
The Hon. Mr. STAWART-It leaves out the provision for the statement in writing to the Governor-in-Council.
His EXCELLENCY-Yes.
The statement in
writing to the Governor-in Council who may direct the demolition.
DJ
The Hon, Da. Ho KAI suggested that the words and secure be added after the word
health."
The Hon. M&. POLLOCK-There is an amend- ment I want to move on the first section. It is stated that the compensation shall be the owner
paid by the Government to
to a charge or mortgage to the persons having such charge or mortgage. I would like the rights of mortgagees and others should ba protected.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL—The compensa. tion shall be paid to "such persons", leaving it to the owner and those persons to arrange.
The Hon. Mr. POLLOCK: We wish to put it to whom the money should be paid.
Hon Sir HEnby BERKELEY: it would be rather difficult for the Governmert to ascer- tain the various owners and mortgagees.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL pointed out that owner had a definition in the the word “ Ordinance which had a very general character indeed and added that the suggestion of Mr. Pollock might be met by leaving out the word The arbitrators would owuer altogether. see that the compensation went to the persons legally entitled.
desirable
"
The Hon. Mr. POLLOCK said it was that soms proviso should be inserted.
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