May 21, 1904.]
CHINA OVERLAND TRADE REPORT.
I say.
anyone to bring any authority to assure u8. a law to deprive certain persons of the right to Well, now, there has been another objection deal in certain articles 80 that another raised, and it was the one that had most weight person may get the benefit. Exclusion of this with me; and that was that the effect of the kind we must, as unofficial members of this proposed measure will be to prevent the Tung Council, and as guardians of the rights of the Wah Hospital from prescribing opium pills and public, strenuously oppose. The question is wine for its patients. Well, gentlemen, I have whether this trade in opium wine illicit or pointed out to you in the house that the opium not. The learned Attorney-General in the farmer is prepared to make concessions which reasons appended to the Ordinance and also in are reasonable. He is prepared to do more, be his speech to-day has stated that these dealings cause he is prepared, recognising as we all do in opium are illicit. Now, it seems to me that the good work the Tung Wah Hospital does in they are not illicit. The learned Attorney-General this country, to recognise the right of the hos first of all assumes that the trade is illicit, and, pital authorities to prescribe pills and wine to of course. his argument that we should do away its in-patients withont restriction of any kind with this trade appears unanswerable. except this, which cannot be called a restriction, first let us enquire whether the trade is really that the pills and wine are obtained from him. illicit or not. Now the existing Ordinance And also he is prepared to do more. He is pre. under which the opium farmer enjoys his rights pared, and I think it is reasonable, to supply does not give to him the exclusive right to these opium pills and wine free, and that, I think, deal in opium: but merely in prepared is generous, so we have the opium farmer here opium." He wants you now to alter the both reasonable in his demands and generous in whole aspect of the case. At present the farmer his intentions. But he cannot consent that the has no right to deal with an ounce of raw Tung Wah Hospital should supply all its out- opium without the knowledge and consent of patients in a similar manner. Surely, gentle the Government. At one time he had. and it men, that is not unreasonable because the reason was owing to his dealing with raw opium in this is obvious, that the opportunities which would Colony that a blockade of Hongkong by be afforded of abusing that privilege are too Chinese revenue cruisers existed, and it was great. I put it to you that that restriction, if it for that reason that two Commissioners. Sir can be called such, upon his generosity is right Robert Hart and Taotai Shiu. were sent and most reasonable in itself. Well, now, I do down from Peking to treat with the not want to hurt the feelings of anyon of Hongkong Government through Cominis. course, but Fam bound to say that the result of soner Russell. afterwards Chief Justice my enquiries into this opposition to the Opium Sir James Russell. The result was that Amendment Bill have led me to 'he conclusion the Opium Convention was signed, and then an that it is factitious rather than real. I am told Ordinance Was passed by the Honkong that the opposition is not really the consumer. Legislature forbidding the dealing in raw opium The real opposition comes from the illicit deal by anybody without the full knowledge and ers who will be losing their profit. I say that consent of the Government. The opium far- it does not come from the consumer, for so longmer's stock of opium was first of all limited to as he can get his pills and wine at a reasonable 3.000 chests or so, and afterwards reduced to. rate it matters not to him where he gets them. I think. 3,000 cliests. I have not the figures but The opposition here is not real but factitious I think that is about right. Then, also, he is and unreal. Now. I put it to you and this restricted by certain regulations as to the house that illicit dealers have no claim whatever number of chests he shall draw out of bond in a to any consideration from this house. Theyrtain time. These restrictions placed upon have no interests that they had obtained legally the dealings of the farmer in raw opium prey ut or morally entitling them to protection as him smuggling it into the interior of China. against the opium farmer to whom the but in the new Bill, the opium farmer's power law had given the exclusive privilege which is supreme, and not an ounce or grain of they had infringed. I more, sir. that the Bill prepared opium can be sold or dealt in in this be read a second time.
Colony without his consent.
The COLONIAL TREASURER seconded. Hon. Dr. Ho KAI-Sir, after having listened very carefully to the speech of the hon. and learned Attorney-General. I must say that a few of my objections to the second reading of this Bill have vanished. But one point only I still think he did not explain away, and it is that point which, so far as I am concerned, determines me to oppose the second reading of the Bill. It is quite true, sir, that we as members of this Council do all we can to protect the public revenue, but at the same time I submit, sir, that we should do so only without injuring private interests, without undue hardship upon those whom a measure of this kind would injure. Now, the learned Attorney-General has quoted, he says, from a private enquiry-which by the bye, might have been made a little bit more public on both sides and might have been read by them that there were 83 firms concerned in dealing with opium pills and wine. Well, of course, personally I have nothing to do with them-with these dealers in opium pills and wine; I know nothing. I take his word for it. And he said only five of them are really wholesale dealers or were principally dealing in wine and pills or exclusively deal, in them; and that the remainder only have these pills and wine as one article among their stock. Now sir, it does not matter, it seems to me, whether a man deals in opium pills and wine exclusively or whether he deals in them as part -of his business. You might just as well say you can pass a law affecting the interests of firm in cotton yarn and say you are not doing them any great amount of injury or inflicting hardship apon them because they are also deal- ing in flour, kerosene oil, and other articles, which they can still continue to trade in. The question is one of principle, and whether it affects 83 or 800 persons, or even one, the prin- ciple is the same; we are not justified in causing injury to a single firm in order that the re. venue of this Colony may be increased, or that the opium farmer's interests may be put into
■ better state of protection. It is like robbing Paul to pay Peter: you are making
The ATTORNEY GENERAL: Nor can anyone prepare a dram of opium in the Colony
:
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI: No one can prepare opium in this Colony except the farmer, or other person having his consent. Now let us con- sider the words prepared opium." Every hon. member of this Council knows that with the law before him the opium farmer knew that law when he tendered for a monopoly. What he paid for it does not matter; that is not the question we present considerin. The opium farmer having had his tender accepted, and having paid accor- dingly. found there were certain persons in this Colony selling opium wine
and opium pills which we will assume for the moment interfered with his business.
are at
He
the
summoned one of these persons before Magistrate who enquired into the caso and decided that he could not hold that opium which was contained in opium pills or wine, as the case might be. came within the Opium Ordinance.
words
to do so, and he is now appealing to us to pass an ordinance creating new rights for him.
The ATTORNEY GENERAL: No; merely to make the definition clear.
New rights are
14
Is
Hon. H. E. POLLOCK: provided.
Hon. Dr. Ho Kar: I will give you an example. Supposing I have let premises on lease, and in that lease I make use of certain terms giving the lessee certain rights of way and so on. That is settled. Presently, the tenant turns round on me and says: You gave me a right of way and such other rights; that means right of air, and light, also of support or anything else." way and no more. I say: "No I simply gave you certain rights of Such other rights means rights belonging to the same class as a right of way."
The lessee says:
"I will go to law about it. Suppose he loses his case. Well," he says, "I cannot get a decision against you in the ask them for an law court, so I will apply to the Government Ordinance under which a right of way and such other rights, shall be held to mean the rights I have mentioned." it just that the Legislature should assist persons of this kind to re-define the words of their con- tracts. making those words include certain things which were not contemplated by the use of the terms in the contract? It is on this particular principle that I found my opposition to the second reading of this Bill. The learned Attorney-General also mentioned that the Opium Farmer thinks it impossible for him to license these opium pill and wine dealers on account of the difficulty. I suppose, of pre- renting illicit dealing, as it would be if this Bill were passed. I am one of those who would propose a solution of the present difficulty by this means, and I regret that the opium farmer does not think it feasible for him to adopt a system of licencing and so obviate such an ordinance as the one before us, which means the extinction of a very large trade altogether. If he charged a certain fee for a license to sellers of opium pills and wine- which, by the way. I understand (from the Attorney-General) is only a very triling trade, though it is at the same time represented as going to interfere tremendously with the profits of the opium farmer-
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL:
A very small trade by the individual; but very large in the aggregate.
The ATTORNEY GENERAL: Because he could not prove that it had been subjected to heat.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI: Well, it was not prepared opium. and the Magistrate could not say that it was. I can understand that heat is required to make prepared opium. but the "prepared opium" in the ordinance mean opium prepared for smoking. When the farm was first created the attention of the Legislature was concentratedupon the creation of a monopoly in the sale of opium prepared for smoking. and opium cannot to be prepared for smoking without passing through some degree of heat; it might be boiling heat or merely slight heat. When the farmer failed in his case at the Magistracy, it seems to me that if he was dis- satisfied with the decision, he should have taken the case into the Supreme Court. If he is within his right in claiming what he does, he should get it, but why did he not go to the higher court and ask for the opinion of the judges on the point? He neglected or omitted
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI: You are affecting, then. a very large trade.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: It is infinite- simal individually.
Hon. Dr. Ho KAI: But the aggregate is considerable. By charging a licensing fee it seems to me that the justice of the case would be met. Refusal to grant such licenses means the total abolition of the trade of these dealers and the goodwill of their businesses, by one stroke of the pen, will be transferred to the opium farmer. There must be a goodwill in this as in every trade.
The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: But these men cannot have a goodwill. How can you employ that legal expression in connection with a per- son who sells illicitly. Under the ordinance I contend that the trade
is illicit. If you look up Sections 9 and 10 of the present Opium Ordinance you will find that no person can have prepared opium in his possession, nor prepare opium.
Hon Dr. Ho KAI: I contend that under that ordinance the sale of these things is not illicit. I contend that the word as applied to these dealers by the learned Attorney-General is a mistake, and my argument is that the Bill now before the Council will deprive them of their trade and good will. Of course, if the learned Attorney-General convinces me--I am certainly open to conviction~(hear, hear)—that dealing in these articles is illicit; if the opium farmer had taken a case to the higher court and the judges had held the trade to be illicit no one would have been a stronger supporter of this Bill than I. I do not hold a brief for either party, and I wish to protect the revenue of the Colony. There is just one other point that has struck me. I believe that unless it is perfectly clearly established that the sale of opium pills and wine is illicit the Secretary of State at home would not view a Bill of this kind with favour. I consider it my duty and main- it is the duty of all the unofficial Council. to look after
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members of the
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ཨཱ ཨཱིཧིཏྭཱ ཙ,
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