418
Mr. Franois-I must hear it first in order that I may take any objection should it be ne-
cessary.
The President-I am very sorry if you can- not hear every word.
!
Mr. Francis Then I must call upon you to ask Major Mills to speak sufficiently loud to be heard all over the room.
Witness-Colonel Gordon left last Tuesday
week.
Mr. Francis-After his departure you became commanding officer?
Witness-Yes,
Did you continue as canteen president after you became commanding officer P-Yes,
Did you go to Messrs. Holliday, Wise and Co. after Colonel Gordon left I went there at 11.30 in the morning and Colonel Gordon left at 12 o'clock.
Had you any idea in your own mind when you went there that day that payments had been made by the Castle Bellingham Brewery, or was it quite a new discovery to you P-It was quite a new discovery to me that the canteen sergeant was receiving money,
Was it quite a new discovery that any one else besides the canteen sergeant was receiving money from the Brewery P-I was aware that the Castle Bellingham Brewery allowed £2 a month discount, which was shown in the accounts.
For how many months was it shown ?-Since the new regulations came out; it has been shown for two months. The new rules came into force in February.
When were these regulations received in the Regiment ? They were received in Gibraltar. Since I became commanding officer I have drawn attention to some of the re- gulations.
Had attention been called to these new rules and regulations before you did it on the 10th May P-I am only a subordinate--
You are an officer who has been in the Re-
giment since July last and you must know what is in orders and what is not. As an officer in the Regiment, has your attention been called to the existence of these amended rules and regulations by any regimental orders, as far as you remember P-I believe so.
Were these orders put into force as soon as the circular was received concerning them P- They were not.
Do you know where the contract with the Castle Bellingham Brewery was made ?—No.
Do you know that, contrary to the orders, the contract was not made here? Is there not & precise regulation that contracts for malt liquor shall be made after the arrival at the station P-Yes.
Have you not, as canteen president, made yourself acquainted with the contract —I re- member there was one contract made, but it was for a continuation of the supply.
Where P-At Gibraltar. They were asked how much they would supply it for at Hong- kong.
Have you, according to the regulations, gone direct to Holliday, Wise and Co. and given the order in person ?
The President-That means that the officer shall sign the order.
4
Mr. Franois-It is very funny English, then. The regulation says Every order shall be given direct."
Witness-It is the custom for the officer to
write out the order on a counterfoil, sign it,
and then dispatch it.
;
Is there a paragraph which states that all contracts shall contain a stipulation that no direct advantage shall be given to any person or institution, and has that clause been included in the contracts ?-There is a para- graph, but I cannot say whether it has been
observed.
Is it not a fact that the canteen manager has been allowed to give orders himself verbally and direct without a written order from an officer -I do not know. I am under the impression that I gave all orders in writing as President or as a member of the Canteen Committee.
Have Rules 16 and 17 with reference to the method by which money is to be received been observed P-Nö.
Did you write out a cheque for $150 payable
order? Yes.
THE HONGKONG WEEKLY PRESS AND
Was that while Sergeant Fretter was still manager of the canteen and before he was threatened with arrest ?--I think it was. bizi Did you not draw that cheque on the 10th May and post-date to the 11th, and give it to Sergeant Fretter on the 10th ?I do not re- member what the day of the month was.
Did you not take a cheque out one day and date it the next day ?-I may have mistaken *the day of the month.
You received the money in three different sums-$70, $25, and another small amount. On what day did you receive the first sum?, Three or four days before I gave him the cheque. I gave him a receipt each time.
You knew when you received it that it was canteen money?
The President-Mr. Francis, is it any use asking these questions? I'cannot see what it has to do with the case.
Mr. Francis-Did Sergeant Fretter, when you gave him the receipt, ask you to endorse it?
Witness-No.
Was this cheque on your own private account or on the canteen fund ?-Private account.
Did you want the money for your private use or for canteen purposes For my private use, The President Mr. Francis, you are again taking up the time of the Court; the question is quite immaterial.
Mr. Francis-It simply shows that he dis- obeyed the regulations. It is not for you to decide whether the questions are immaterial. I think it necessary to ask these questions.
The President-I do not think it does the prisoner any good.
Mr. Francis-That is in my discretion and not yours. (To Witness). Had you, at the time you gave that cheque, sufficient money in your private account to meet it?
Witness-I believe so.
Is that all you can say.?
The President-I think that is sufficient, Mr. Francis.
..
4
Mr. Francis-Did you tell Sergeant Fretter when you asked him to endorse it that you had not enough money in the bank to meet it?
Witness--No.
Anything like it P-No.
Can you tell me what became of the £2 monthly paid by the Castle Bellingham Brew- ery before March and April-before the arrival of the new accounts ?--I think it was paid over to the commanding officer.
Do you
know how it was dealt with and what became of it? Was it carried into the canteen account P-I think it was spent for the benefit of the men in the Regiment-entirely for the Regiment.
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EMay 28, 1887
The President-It is not customary for an officer temporarily in command to put new regulations into force.
Mr. Francis When did you first read these rules and regulations ?
Witness--I saw these rules before they were framed.
They were not rules before they were framed. When did you first read them after they were is sued authoritatively PI read them at Gibraltar.
Can you say positively whether there was or was not a copy of these rules among the canteen papers ?-I saw a copy in the drawer when I took over Major Dalton's office.
The canteen books and accounts were kept, when Major Dalton transacted the canteen business, in the quartermaster's office in Murray Barracks, and you have transacted business in that same office and not in the canteen itself? -I have been in the canteen.
You have not transacted the business in the canteen, but in the quartermaster's office ?—Yes, May I ask why you thought it necessary to issue orders calling attention to these particular rules and regulations P-It is customary to publish the orders for information.
Was it not because you knew they had not been called attention to before P-I published them as a reminder.
Was it not because you knew they had not been published in orders before ?-No.
Was it not on the same day that Colonel Gordon left that you went to Holliday, Wise & Co. P-I had been there previously.
Yes, but the day on which you saw this parti- cular letter P-Yes.
Did you go simply for the purpose of asking for the brewer's bill or for what purpose P
The President He has already stated that he went there because the brewer did not send in his bill.
Mr. Francis-Did you not go for the special purpose of making enquiry into this matter to find out whether any payments were or were not being made?
Witness-No, I went to pay the bill.
Did you go there to enquire into this parti cular matter and to see whether payments were or were not made P-No, certainly not I do not exactly remember why I went.
Is it not correct, as you said in the first instance, that you went there because the bills had not been sent inf
The President-I do not think it is any use asking further questions about that,
Mr. Francis Whom did you see when you went there P-I saw Mr. Rogs.
Was not the first question you asked Mr. Ross whether the Castle Bellingham Brewery were or were not in the habit of making pay- ments in connection with the malt liquor sup- The President-Major Mills was not in complied P-I am not aware that that was the first mand then.
Was not the receipt of it in direct violation of these rules ?
Witness-I think it would come under the heading of "exceptional circumstances" men- tioned in the rules.
Mr. Francis-Can you state the exceptional circumstances which justified the receipt of £2. The witness was not heard to answer this question.
You have been adjutant of a Regiment? Yes. Do you not know of your own personal know- ledge that it has been the custom for the com- manding officer, the canteen president, and other persons in the Regiment to receive certain funds, or bonuses, or allowances, or discounts, or whatever you liketo call them, from the persons supplying the Regiment with malt liquor P-I can only say no. received anything as canteen president and I know Major Dalton has not.
I have never
Do you know it has been the custom to make similar payments ?-What payments?
Payments, cumshaws, discounts, such pay. ments as are forbidden by these regulations. Do you not know that it has been the custom and that these regulations were framed to meet it?-I was never aware that the
president, or canteen
the commanding officer, or the president ever received sums of money from the persons supplying malt liquor beyond the £2 received from the Castle Bellingham Brewery.
You were canteen president for a short time in December last P-For a few days.
Did you take any steps then to enforce these new regulations ?
question.
you
Did not while you were there ask some question to that effect ?—I may have done.
And was it not entirely in consequence, of a question to that effect that this letter and the receipt and the books were shown to you P-I asked about the discount.
other
Did you ask about payments to any people, or was your question solely confined to the commanding officer's discount P-Solely confined to the commanding officer's discount.
How came Mr. Ross to show this alleged confidential letter ?—He took up the authority for this discount.
Has any discount been paid for the month of April Yes,
Did you ask for this discount to be paid to you then P--Yes,
Will you state the special circumstances which justified you in asking for and receiving it under clause 7 of the regulations ?--It was recorded in the previous month's account and I imagined I was carrying out what had been the custom before.
If you imagined it was correct you could not have read these rules P-I had to carry out what my predecessor had done before me.
Mr. Francis-In spite of Her Majesty's regulations ?....
7
The PresidentHe had only been there a day. Mr. Francis He went down to Holliday Wise and Co. before the Colonel was out of the colony and got the money. (To witness.), Had you any reason for looking so closely into this matter at that time ?
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