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determine whether or not the stall is used for trading or storage purposes. This is one of the technical difficulties we have encountered.

However, I can guarantee that we will ask the Department to follow up on the situation in order to prevent the problem from getting out of control.

THE HON. LI WAH-MING (in Cantonese):—It is obvious that some of our markets are a bit old and not so viable. I think they face both intrinsic and external problems. As regards the intrinsic problem, Mr. Ip has already said that these markets can be refurbished and improved. For external problems such as the accessibility of the markets, shortgage of parking facilities, etc, will we be prepared to review these markets in order to find an ultimate solution and relocate them altogether rather than spend money on refurbishment?

MR. IP KWOK-CHUNG (in Cantonese):―Thank you Mr. Li for his suggestions. Regarding external factors or intrinsic factors such as the viablity of the market or the suitability of its location, in fact both the Council and the Department are very concerned. Of course I agree that if we have land to resite the market to a more appropriate location, the Council will certainly be prepared to consider that. If Members can identify good sites, they can certainly make suggestions to our relevant Sub-Committees in order that the Department can conduct feasibility studies. I am sure we can do that.

MR. MA Lee-wo (in Cantonese):—Regarding the low occupancy in some of our markets, Mr. Ip's answer I think is far from adequate. He says that we had an occupancy rate of 85%. This is by far not a low figure but is unfortunately a legacy of history.

A recent survey on UC markets has criticised us in this aspect and other problems, including the vacancy rate. Is the criticism on low occupancy rate substantiated? Secondly, what did the relevant Select Committee do to tackle this problem in the past? Have we overlooked this problem now? If this is a legacy of history, apparently there is something wrong with our policy. Has the Department not been doing a good job in terms of enforcement? Should the Department or Select Committee be held responsible?

MR. IP KWOK-CHUNG (in Cantonese):-Thank you, Mr. MA. Regarding his first question, ie some organisations have made criticisms against this Council. As the Council becomes more and more transparent in its operation, all well intentioned and sincere criticisms should receive our careful consideration. As Chairman of the Select Committee myself, I think such criticisms have given us more insight and I believe it will help us in our future work.

As regards whether the low occupancy rate is attributable to the policy itself and whether such policies should be reviewed, I would like to report to Members that there is a reason attributable to the low occupancy rate in some of our markets. It is because our existing policy is not to openly lease out some vacant stalls at the moment. We have to reserve some stalls to the affected

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hawkers after the implementation of the deletion of Itinerary Hawker Licences Scheme in April 1996 on a priority basis. So the 15% vacancy rate is used for that purpose. We have ceased leasing the vacant stalls unless it is a new market and unless there are other plans approved by the Select Committee, otherwise we will not allow new operators to move into our markets.

Regarding whether we will follow up on the occupancy rate, I can assure Mr. MA that after we have had exchange of views we will closely monitor the occupancy rate of our market stalls. We will also pay particular attention to ways of improving the viability of these markets. This will include what Mr. LI has mentioned just now, about location. I believe we need to carry out a review before any conclusion can be drawn. I will certainly refer the comments made by Members to my Select Committee for further discussion.

MISS CECILIA L. Y. YEUNG (in Cantonese):—Mr. Chairman, regarding the low occupancy rate of some of our markets, I believe a few Members have already touched on the various reasons. However, I think that perhaps our facilities are not adequate, especially in terms of security. Even though people still wish to continue to operate in these stalls, they may find that the profit they make cannot be offset by the losses they have suffered because of theft. So, are we prepared to improve the facilities of these markets, especially security?

MR. IP KWOK-CHUNG (in Cantonese):---Thank you, Miss YEUNG. So far, I have not received any complaints about theft especially serious cases of theft taking place in markets. I have not learnt about this from the Department or the press.

Of course, Miss YEUNG may have received such complaints. Can Miss YEUNG after our meeting today, give me specific information as to which market had such cases of theft. I believe these are isolated incidents. Overall speaking, we do not have serious security problems in the operation of our markets.

MISS CECILIA L. Y. YEUNG (in Cantonese):-I would like to supplement and tell Mr. Ip that in Kowloon City Market, there have been numerous complaints about theft and perhaps the Department should undertake an investigation.

MR. IP KWOK-CHUNG (in Cantonese):—I will certainly relay that comment to my Select Committee and will also follow up personally on this.

MR. LEUNG KAM-TAO (in Cantonese):—Mr. Chairman, since we now have 62 markets, have we conducted any study to find out the reasons for those stalls which have been left vacant for a long time so that we can work out a solution to ensure that these stalls can be put to proper use and resources will not be wasted? If the answer is in the negative, will we consider doing that in the future?

MR. IP KWOK-CHUNG (in Cantonese):-Thank you, Mr. LEUNG. In fact, I have already responded to that question in my answer.

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