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members of the public as well who could come up with bright ideas how we could keep confidential matters confidential.
THE HON. FREDERICK FUNG KIN-KEE (in Cantonese):--A situation has actually happened before. Some Chairmen felt that a certain topic should be discussed in private session in view of its sensitivity. However, some other members felt that this was not necessary and there was a debate in private as all members of the press had left. I would like to ask that if the Chairman considers that a topic should be discussed in private, but other members feel that it should be discussed in public, who should make the final decision?
MRS. ELEANOR LING CHING-MAN (in English):-As I said earlier, this practice of opening of our meetings to public is a relatively new one. I would believe in marginal cases, the Chairman if he or she has sufficient prior notice, can consult the members on his or her Select Committees and be guided by the views of the member before making a final decision. However, I believe in a particular incident that you have quoted, the timing was not sufficient to allow for sufficient consultation. But perhaps if members want to raise a particular point to the attention of the public, they certainly have the opportunity of this open meeting to ask a question to that particular chairman. He or she would be forced to stand up in public to answer that.
CHAIRMAN (in English):-Then we can pass on to the next question. Since question No. 6 and No. 9 are of a similar nature, I will propose that these questions be asked together before Mr. Albert POON answers. First question No. 6, Anna TANG.
6. MS. ANNA TANG KING-YUNG asked the following question (in Cantonese): On 4 October, a stone slab measuring about 1 m x 1 m x 1.8 cm of weight around 35 kg fell down from the ceiling of the Wan Chai Temporary Market hitting a vegetable stall. It is only 6 months since the market opened in April this year, and the incident has aroused much concern among the public.
I would like to know:
(1) Has the Architectural Services Department conducted any review after the
incident and reported to the Council?
(2) Who should be held responsible for the compensation in this case?
9. MR. SAN STEPHEN WONG HON-CHING asked the following question (in Cantonese): Regarding the collapse of a portion of the concrete false ceiling at the Wan Chai Temporary Market, I would like to ask the Chairman of the Select Committee concerned the following questions:
(a) How could the concrete ceiling fall down while the construction of the Wan Chai Temporary Market was completed just more than half a year ago? Was it caused by any faulty designs, building and supervisory mistakes, or substandard materials?
(b) Have the same designs or materials been used in the construction of the other existing UC temporary or permanent markets? If this is the case, how can it be rectified?
(c) If the incident did result in casualties, how should the Council compensate the
victims?
(d) How and when will the false ceiling of the Wan Chai Temporary Market be
repaired?
MR. WONG HON-CHING (in Cantonese):- Mr. Chairman, permit me to circulate this slab, so that members will know the seriousness of the problem.
CHAIRMAN (in English):-Thank you, Mr. WONG. I have taken the extraordinary step by allowing this to be exhibited. This is a very exceptional step to have such an exhibition for viewing by the councillors and I then call upon Mr. Albert POON to answer these two questions collectively.
MR. ALBERT POON SHUN-KWOK, CHAIRMAN OF THE CAPITAL WORKS SELECT COMMITTEE, replied as follows (in Cantonese):-Mr. Chairman I would like to give an answer to Ms. TANG's question first and then I will give an answer to the questions raised by Mr. WONG.
The Architectural Services Department is conducting an investigation into the cause of the collapse of an insulation board from the ceiling of the Wan Chai Temporary Market that occurred on 4 October 1991. A report will be submitted to Council when the findings are available.
Based on information available at this stage, the insulation board which fell had become saturated with moisture as a result of high humidity at the time of heavy rain. The sheet apparently deformed at its mid-point as a result of its increased weight until it could not be properly supported at its edges. There is also an indication that the Architect's instructions for fixing the sheets at their two supporting edges had not been properly followed by the contractor and enquiries on this aspect are continuing.
There was some minor damage to stallholders' property as a result of the collapse, and some further damage when all the remaining boards were removed by the Maintenance Contractor as a safety precaution.
On the question of compensation in both cases of damages, legal advice is that the Council is not liable for any claims. In the opinion of the Principal Legal Officer of the Department, the Council has acted with proper due care in the matter, having entrusted the construction and maintenance of the market to the Architectural Services Department which is the Council's work agent. As to which, if any, party should be liable to pay compensation, this is a matter for ASD, its contractors and their insurers.
The question of Mr. WONG concerning the Wan Chai Temporary Market, is in four parts. I have already dealt with the points regarding the material used and compensation in my reply to Mrs. Anna TANG's questions and do not propose to repeat this.
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(b) Have the same designs or materials been used in the construction of the other existing UC temporary or permanent markets? If this is the case, how can it be rectified?
(c) If the incident did result in casualties, how should the Council compensate the
victims?
(d) How and when will the false ceiling of the Wan Chai Temporary Market be
repaired?
MR. WONG HON-CHING (in Cantonese):- Mr. Chairman, permit me to circulate this slab, so that members will know the seriousness of the problem.
CHAIRMAN (in English):-Thank you, Mr. WONG. I have taken the extraordinary step by allowing this to be exhibited. This is a very exceptional step to have such an exhibition for viewing by the councillors and I then call upon Mr. Albert POON to answer these two questions collectively.
MR. ALBERT POON SHUN-KWOK, CHAIRMAN OF THE CAPITAL WORKS SELECT COMMITTEE, replied as follows (in Cantonese):-Mr. Chairman I would like to give an answer to Ms. TANG's question first and then I will give an answer to the questions raised by Mr. WONG.
The Architectural Services Department is conducting an investigation into the cause of the collapse of an insulation board from the ceiling of the Wan Chai Temporary Market that occurred on 4 October 1991. A report will be submitted to Council when the findings are available.
Based on information available at this stage, the insulation board which fell had become saturated with moisture as a result of high humidity at the time of heavy rain. The sheet apparently deformed at its mid-point as a result of its increased weight until it could not be properly supported at its edges. There is also an indication that the Architect's instructions for fixing the sheets at their two supporting edges had not been properly followed by the contractor and enquiries on this aspect are continuing.
There was some minor damage to stallholders' property as a result of the collapse, and some further damage when all the remaining boards were removed by the Maintenance Contractor as a safety precaution.
On the question of compensation in both cases of damages, legal advice is that the Council is not liable for any claims. In the opinion of the Principal Legal Officer of the Department, the Council has acted with proper due care in the matter, having entrusted the construction and maintenance of the market to the Architectural Services Department which is the Council's work agent. As to which, if any, party should be liable to pay compensation, this is a matter for ASD, its contractors and their insurers.
The question of Mr. WONG concerning the Wan Chai Temporary Market, is in four parts. I have already dealt with the points regarding the material used and compensation in my reply to Mrs. Anna TANG's questions and do not propose to repeat this.
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members of the public as well who could come up with bright ideas how we could keep confidential matters confidential.
THE HON. FREDERICK FUNG KIN-KEE (in Cantonese):--A situation has actually happened before. Some Chairmen felt that a certain topic should be discussed in private session in view of its sensitivity. However, some other members felt that this was not necessary and there was a debate in private as all members of the press had left. I would like to ask that if the Chairman considers that a topic should be discussed in private, but other members feel that it should be discussed in public, who should make the final decision?
MRS. ELEANOR LING CHING-MAN (in English):-As I said carlier, this practice of opening of our meetings to public is a relatively new one. I would believe in marginal cases, the Chairman if he or she has sufficient prior notice, can consult the members on his or her Select Committees and be guided by the views of the member before making a final decision. However, I believe in a particular incident that you have quoted, the timing was not sufficient to allow for sufficient consultation. But perhaps if members want to raise a particular point to the attention of the public, they certainly have the opportunity of this open meeting to ask a question to that particular chairman. He or she would be forced to stand up in public to answer that.
CHAIRMAN (in English):-Then we can pass on to the next question. Since question No. 6 and No. 9 are of a similar nature, I will propose that these questions be asked together before Mr. Albert PooN answers. First question No. 6, Anna TANG.
6. MS. ANNA TANG KING-YUNG asked the following question (in Cantonese): On 4 October, a stone slab measuring about 1 mx 1 mx 1.8 cm of weight around 35 kg fell down from the ceiling of the Wan Chai Temporary Market hitting a vegetable stall. It is only 6 months since the market opened in April this year, and the incident has aroused much concern among the public.
I would like to know:
(1) Has the Architectural Services Department conducted any review after the
incident and reported to the Council?
(2) Who should be held responsible for the compensation in this case?
9. MR. SAN STEPHEN WONG HON-CHING asked the following question (in Cantonese): Regarding the collapse of a portion of the concrete false ceiling at the Wan Chai Temporary Market, I would like to ask the Chairman of the Select Committee concerned the following questions:
(a) How could the concrete ceiling fall down while the construction of the Wan Chai Temporary Market was completed just more than half a year ago? Was it caused by any faulty designs, building and supervisory mistakes, or substandard materials?
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(b) Have the same designs or materials been sued in the construction of the other existing UC temporary or permanent markets? If this is the case, how can it be rectified?
(c) If the incident did result in casualties, how should the Council compensate the
victims?
(d) How and when will the false ceiling of the Wan Chai Temporary Market be
repaired?
MR. WONG HON-CHING (in Cantonese):- Mr. Chairman, permit me to circulate this slab, so that members will know the seriousness of the problem.
CHAIRMAN (in English):-Thank you, Mr. WONG. I have taken the extraordinary step by allowing this to be exhibited. This is a very exceptional step to have such an exhibition for viewing by the councillors and I then call upon Mr. Albert POON to answer these two questions collectively.
MR. ALBERT POON SHUN-KWOK, CHAIRMAN OF THE CAPITAL WORKS SELECT COMMITTE, replied as follows (in Cantonese):-Mr. Chairman I would like to give an answer to Ms. TANG's question first and then I will give an answer to the questions raised by Mr. WONG.
The Architectural Services Department is conducting an investigation into the cause of the collapse of an insulation board from the ceiling of the Wan Chai Temporary Market that occurred on 4 October 1991. A report will be submitted to Council when the findings are available.
Based on information available at this stage, the insulation board which fell had become saturated with moisture as a result of high humidity at the time of heavy rain. The sheet apparently deformed at its mid-point as a result of its increased weight until it could not be properly supported as its edges. There is also an indication that the Architect's instructions for fixing the sheets at their two supporting edges had not been property followed by the contractor and enquiries on this aspect are continuing.
There was some minor damage to stallholders' property as a result of the collapse, and some further damage when all the remaining boards were removed by the Maintenance Contractor as a safety precaution.
On the question of compensation in both cases of damages, legal advice is that the Council is not liable for any claims. In the opinion of the Principal Legal Officer of the Department, the Council has acted with proper due care in the matter, having entrusted the construction and maintenance of the market to the Architectural Services Department which is the Council's work agent. As to which, if any, party should be liable to pay compensation, this is a matter for ASD, its contractors and their insurers.
The question of Mr. WONG concerning the Wan Chai Temporary Market, is in four parts. I have already dealt with the points regarding the material used and compensation in my reply to Mrs. Anna TANG's questions and do not propose to repeat this.
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