1971 — Page 63

Urban Council Proceedings 市政局議事錄 All AI Reviewed

Page 63 of 242

106

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

COMMISSIONER for Resettlement: They accounted for 2% and they are partially used for domestic, in fact they are all using it as a part of trading.

MR. NG:----Mr. Chairman, 2% of the figure in this question still comprises 240. Now this policy that the Commissioner has put down in the answer (b) here says "to demolish any new illegal structures discovered". Hasn't this been the policy ever since the inception of the department?

COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: It was not the policy at that time.

MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, just on a point of clarification, you mean the Resettlement Department never wanted to demolish any new illegal structure once discovered before they formed this policy?

COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: The policy was formed in 1964, Sir.

MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, so between 1964 and 1967 were there any illegal structures built in our estates?

COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: Not to my knowledge, Sir.

MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, can the Commissioner for Resettlement assure me that there were no illegal squatters huts built in our estates between 1964 and 1967?

COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: I cannot assure him, I was not in the Chair then.

(8) MR. PETER P. K. NG asked the following question:

Can the Chairman advise this Council if the Department has any plans to provide for a new Council Chamber or to make alterations to the existing Chamber to facilitate simultaneous translation for English and Cantonese in the near future?

If there is a plan can the visitors' gallery be enlarged? If the Department has no plan for such change what plan will the Department propose to meet the new situation?

Has the Department any plan or will the Department propose any plan to recruit suitable interpreters of acceptable quality to interpret English and Cantonese in the near future?

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

107

MR. HILTON CHEONG-LEEN, CHAIRMAN OF THE LOCAL ADMINISTRATION SELECT COMMITTEE, replied as follows:

There are, at present, no plans to build a new Chamber for this Council. The Report of the Chinese Language Committee recommended that both Urban Council and Legislative Council meetings should take place in the Legislative Council Chamber. However, this recommendation was not acceptable to the Members of this Council who thought that it would be preferable for the Urban Council to continue to meet in this Chamber and Government has now agreed to this. It is therefore proposed to insert a glass panel in the south wall of this Chamber and to convert one of the toilets on the other side of the wall into interpretation booths in accordance with the proposals made by Mr. PILLEY who was brought out from the United Kingdom to advise on simultaneous interpretation.

I am informed that it will not be possible to enlarge the public gallery as the wall at the back of the gallery is an external wall.

It is not intended that either the Council or the Urban Services Department should recruit its own interpreters. As and when suitable interpreters are recruited it is intended that a nucleus of interpreters should be available to serve both the Legislative and Urban Councils as well as Government-appointed Boards and Committees requiring simultaneous interpretation facilities.

MR. NG: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

MR. BERNACCHI: Mr. Chairman, the passage "I am informed that it will not be possible to enlarge the public gallery as the wall at the back of the gallery is an external wall". It seems to me an internal wall to my looking at it. Does Mr. CHEONG-LEEN mean a load-bearing wall perhaps?

CHAIRMAN: I am afraid not, Mr. BERNACCHI. If you go through that wall, you are outside. It is not even the Members room, which is to your left. So, that is an outside wall.

MR. SALES: Should not Mr. BERNACCHI put that to the test?

MR. BERNACCHI: Well then, Mr. Chairman, insofar as the wall is an external wall, it is not entirely an external wall. Could not nevertheless the Members' room be included in an enlarged public gallery even if the enlarged public gallery is in the shape of an "S", no an "L" not an "S"?

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Page 63 of 242 106 HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL COMMISSIONER for Resettlement: They accounted for 2% and they are partially used for domestic, in fact they are all using it as a part of trading. MR. NG:----Mr. Chairman, 2% of the figure in this question still comprises 240. Now this policy that the Commissioner has put down in the answer (b) here says "to demolish any new illegal structures discovered". Hasn't this been the policy ever since the inception of the department? COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: It was not the policy at that time. MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, just on a point of clarification, you mean the Resettlement Department never wanted to demolish any new illegal structure once discovered before they formed this policy? COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: The policy was formed in 1964, Sir. MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, so between 1964 and 1967 were there any illegal structures built in our estates? COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: Not to my knowledge, Sir. MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, can the Commissioner for Resettlement assure me that there were no illegal squatters huts built in our estates between 1964 and 1967? COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: I cannot assure him, I was not in the Chair then. (8) MR. PETER P. K. NG asked the following question: Can the Chairman advise this Council if the Department has any plans to provide for a new Council Chamber or to make alterations to the existing Chamber to facilitate simultaneous translation for English and Cantonese in the near future? If there is a plan can the visitors' gallery be enlarged? If the Department has no plan for such change what plan will the Department propose to meet the new situation? Has the Department any plan or will the Department propose any plan to recruit suitable interpreters of acceptable quality to interpret English and Cantonese in the near future? HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL 107 MR. HILTON CHEONG-LEEN, CHAIRMAN OF THE LOCAL ADMINISTRATION SELECT COMMITTEE, replied as follows: There are, at present, no plans to build a new Chamber for this Council. The Report of the Chinese Language Committee recommended that both Urban Council and Legislative Council meetings should take place in the Legislative Council Chamber. However, this recommendation was not acceptable to the Members of this Council who thought that it would be preferable for the Urban Council to continue to meet in this Chamber and Government has now agreed to this. It is therefore proposed to insert a glass panel in the south wall of this Chamber and to convert one of the toilets on the other side of the wall into interpretation booths in accordance with the proposals made by Mr. PILLEY who was brought out from the United Kingdom to advise on simultaneous interpretation. I am informed that it will not be possible to enlarge the public gallery as the wall at the back of the gallery is an external wall. It is not intended that either the Council or the Urban Services Department should recruit its own interpreters. As and when suitable interpreters are recruited it is intended that a nucleus of interpreters should be available to serve both the Legislative and Urban Councils as well as Government-appointed Boards and Committees requiring simultaneous interpretation facilities. MR. NG: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. MR. BERNACCHI: Mr. Chairman, the passage "I am informed that it will not be possible to enlarge the public gallery as the wall at the back of the gallery is an external wall". It seems to me an internal wall to my looking at it. Does Mr. CHEONG-LEEN mean a load-bearing wall perhaps? CHAIRMAN: I am afraid not, Mr. BERNACCHI. If you go through that wall, you are outside. It is not even the Members room, which is to your left. So, that is an outside wall. MR. SALES: Should not Mr. BERNACCHI put that to the test? MR. BERNACCHI: Well then, Mr. Chairman, insofar as the wall is an external wall, it is not entirely an external wall. Could not nevertheless the Members' room be included in an enlarged public gallery even if the enlarged public gallery is in the shape of an "S", no an "L" not an "S"? Page 63 of 242 106 ... 107

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リ Page 63 of 242 106 HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL COMMISSIONER for ResettlEMENT : They accounted for 2% and they are partially used for domestic, in fact they are all using it as a part of trading. MR. NG:----Mr. Chairman, 2% of the figure in this question still comprises 240. Now this policy that the Commissioner has put down in the answer (b) here says "to demolish any new illegal structures discovered". Hasn't this been the policy ever since the inception of the department? time. COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-It was not the policy at that MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, just on a point of clarification, you mean the Resettlement Department never wanted to demolish any new illegal structure once discovered before they formed this policy? COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-The policy was formed in 1964, Sir. MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, so between 1964 and 1967 were there any illegal structures built in our estates? COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-Not to my knowledge, Sir. MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, can the Commissioner for Resettlement assure me that there were no illegal squatters huts built in our estates between 1964 and 1967? COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-I cannot assure him, I was not in the Chair then. (8) MR. PETER P. K. NG asked the following question: Can the Chairman advise this Council if the Department has any plans to provide for a new Council Chamber or to make alterations to the existing Chamber to facilitate simultaneous translation for English and Cantonese in the near future? If there is a plan can the visitors' gallery be enlarged? If the Department has no plan for such change what plan will the Department propose to meet the new situation? Has the Department any plan or will the Department propose any plan to recruit suitable interpreters of acceptable quality to interpret English and Cantonese in the near future? HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL 107 MR. HILTON CHEONG-LEEN, CHAIRMAN OF THE LOCAL ADMINISTRA- TION SELECT COMMITTEE, replied as follows:- There are, at present, no plans to build a new Chamber for this Council. The Report of the Chinese Language Committee recommended that both Urban Council and Legislative Council meetings should take place in the Legislative Council Chamber. However, this recom- mendation was not acceptable to the Members of this Council who thought that it would be preferable for the Urban Council to continue to meet in this Chamber and Government has now agreed to this. It is therefore proposed to insert a glass panel in the south wall of this Chamber and to convert one of the toilets on the other side of the wall into interpretation booths in accordance with the proposals made by Mr. PILLEY who was brought out from the United Kingdom to advise on simultaneous interpretation. I am informed that it will not be possible to enlarge the public gallery as the wall at the back of the gallery is an external wall. It is not intended that either the Council or the Urban Services Department should recruit its own interpreters. As and when suitable interpreters are recruited it is intended that a nucleus of interpreters should be available to serve both the Legislative and Urban Councils as well as Govern- ment-appointed Boards and Committees requiring simul- taneous interpretation facilities. MR. NG: Thank you, Mr. Chairman. MR. BERNACCHI:-Mr. Chairman, the passage "I am informed that it will not be possible to enlarge the public gallery as the wall at the back of the gallery is an external wall". It seems to me an internal wall to my looking at it. Does Mr. CHEONG-LEEN mean a load-bearing wall perhaps? CHAIRMAN:-I am afraid not, Mr. BERNACCHI. If you go through that wall, you are outside. It is not even the Members room, which is to your left. So, that is an outside wall. MR. SALES: Should not Mr. BERNACCHI put that to the test? MR. BERNACCHI:-Well then, Mr. Chairman, insofar as the wall is an external wall, it is not entirely an external wall. Could not nevertheless the Members' room be included in an enlarged public gallery even if the enlarged public gallery is in the shape of an "S", no an "L" not an "S"?

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リ

Page 63 of 242

106

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

COMMISSIONER for ResettlEMENT : They accounted for 2% and they are partially used for domestic, in fact they are all using it as a part of trading.

time.

COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-It was not the policy at that

MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, just on a point of clarification, you mean the Resettlement Department never wanted to demolish any new illegal structure once discovered before they formed this policy?

COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-The policy was formed in 1964, Sir.

MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, so between 1964 and 1967 were there any illegal structures built in our estates?

COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-Not to my knowledge, Sir.

MR. NG: Mr. Chairman, can the Commissioner for Resettlement assure me that there were no illegal squatters huts built in our estates between 1964 and 1967?

COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-I cannot assure him, I was not in the Chair then.

(8) MR. PETER P. K. NG asked the following question:

If there is a plan can the visitors' gallery be enlarged? If the Department has no plan for such change what plan will the Department propose to meet the new situation?

Has the Department any plan or will the Department propose any plan to recruit suitable interpreters of acceptable quality to interpret English and Cantonese in the near future?

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

107

MR. HILTON CHEONG-LEEN, CHAIRMAN OF THE LOCAL ADMINISTRA- TION SELECT COMMITTEE, replied as follows:-

There are, at present, no plans to build a new Chamber for this Council. The Report of the Chinese Language Committee recommended that both Urban Council and Legislative Council meetings should take place in the Legislative Council Chamber. However, this recom- mendation was not acceptable to the Members of this Council who thought that it would be preferable for the Urban Council to continue to meet in this Chamber and Government has now agreed to this. It is therefore proposed to insert a glass panel in the south wall of this Chamber and to convert one of the toilets on the other side of the wall into interpretation booths in accordance with the proposals made by Mr. PILLEY who was brought out from the United Kingdom to advise on simultaneous interpretation.

I am informed that it will not be possible to enlarge the public gallery as the wall at the back of the gallery is an external wall.

It is not intended that either the Council or the Urban Services Department should recruit its own interpreters. As and when suitable interpreters are recruited it is intended that a nucleus of interpreters should be available to serve both the Legislative and Urban Councils as well as Govern- ment-appointed Boards and Committees requiring simul- taneous interpretation facilities.

MR. NG: Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

MR. BERNACCHI:-Mr. Chairman, the passage "I am informed that it will not be possible to enlarge the public gallery as the wall at the back of the gallery is an external wall". It seems to me an internal wall to my looking at it. Does Mr. CHEONG-LEEN mean a load-bearing wall perhaps?

CHAIRMAN:-I am afraid not, Mr. BERNACCHI. If you go through that wall, you are outside. It is not even the Members room, which is to your left. So, that is an outside wall.

MR. SALES:

Should not Mr. BERNACCHI put that to the test?

MR. BERNACCHI:-Well then, Mr. Chairman, insofar as the wall is an external wall, it is not entirely an external wall. Could not nevertheless the Members' room be included in an enlarged public gallery even if the enlarged public gallery is in the shape of an "S", no an "L" not an "S"?

1971 — Page 63

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