HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
CHAIRMAN: --We have worked it out, but I am afraid that off-hand I could not tell you. If you like, I can send you the details later.
MR. FORSGATE: -Well, it appears we are going to spend a great deal of money. Have the Hawker Select Committees given any consideration how some of this expenditure should be and could be recovered in part, possibly by an increase in the hawker licensing fees for this very desirable means of employment?
MR. CHEONG-LEEN: -Mr. Chairman, may I answer that indirectly through another supplementary which I shall be asking you? Mr. Chairman, can you give an assurance to the Hawker Policy and Hawker Management Select Committee members, that there will be no large scale recruitment to the Hawker Control Force without full consultation with the two Select Committees?
CHAIRMAN: -Recruitment cannot take place, as I have said, faster and larger than the amount the Hawker Control Force can take in at any one time. These particular courses are three months each. Each of them takes 24 or 28 men. I think you can rest assured that there will be no enormous, swamping, load of men being recruited without the two Select Committees being consulted first.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN: -Mr. Chairman, would you be good enough to supply to the members of the Hawker Policy and Hawker Management Select Committees, in your capacity as Director of Urban Services, copies of the draft establishment for a model division of Hawker Control Force, and also what is the Department's anticipated recruitment between now and the end of March next year?
CHAIRMAN: -The Department would certainly be glad to give you copies of the model establishment for one division, and also for the final shape of the Hawker Control Force, but I think there would be little point in producing it right away before the new Commandant has had a chance to look at it and comment. Otherwise, it may be somewhat misleading.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN: Mr. Chairman, that is fully appreciated. However, since you have stated in your reply to Mr. BLAKER that the Department has already prepared such a draft, at least for the information of Members would you be good enough to supply them with copies of that draft?
CHAIRMAN: -Yes, certainly.
MR. BLAKER: -Mr. Chairman, you refer to a request to take increased power to dispense with the services of unsuitable officers. Do I understand that this will put these powers on a par with those of the Police in future?
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CHAIRMAN: —Yes, it is proposed that these powers should be modelled on those of the Police.
MR. BLAKER: Mr. Chairman, you also referred to a wider provision of quarters. It is my understanding that, at the moment, barrack accommodation is provided only. Do I understand that Government might envisage the provision of married quarters for possibly senior grades of the Control Force?
CHAIRMAN: --Barrack quarters are provided for constables, single men of the Hawker Control Force, a very small proportion. No manning scale is laid down. It is simply a question of some years ago a particular set of premises being available and handed over for use by the Hawker Control Force, but that does not specify that, say, 10% or 20%, or something like that, of the Hawker Control Force will be provided with quarters. It is quite a fortuitous arrangement at the moment. Government has not agreed so far to any proposals for a manning scale, as it were a yardstick, for providing either barrack quarters or married quarters. We have asked for them, but so far, no agreement has been reached.
MR. BLAKER: -One final question, Mr. Chairman. Will Government consider at the appropriate time a step which would, with no cost to Government, create an influx of recruits into the Force and place it on a par with the most celebrated Force in the Colony, namely, to petition the Queen to designate the Control Force the Royal Hong Kong Hawker Control Force. (Laughter).
MR. SALES: You referred to the training scheme now going on. Do I understand that the content of the scheme has the approval of the Select Committee? Has the Committee considered the type of training that our men should undergo?
CHAIRMAN: -No, Sir, the Select Committee has not been consulted on the training. The Director of Urban Services is legally in charge of the Hawker Control Force, and although the Select Committees are kept informed from time to time, they are not normally consulted on the details of the training itself for the Force.
MR. SALES: Am I to understand that the Director of Urban Services conducts the training himself?
CHAIRMAN: -No, he has someone else to do it.
MR. SALES: --Mr. Chairman, has the Director of Urban Services ever considered inviting our top hawkers as guest lecturers? (Laughter).
CHAIRMAN: ---Can I just answer that one? No, he has not invited them as guest lecturers, but he has invited them to passing-out parades.
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CHAIRMAN: --We have worked it out, but I am afraid that off-hand I could not tell you. If you like, I can send you the details later.
MR. FORSGATE:-Well, it appears we are going to spend a great deal of money. Have the Hawker Select Committees given any con- sideration how some of this expenditure should be and could be recovered in part, possibly by an increase in the hawker licensing fees for this very desirable means of employment?
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Mr. Chairman, may I answer that indirectly through another supplementary which I shall be asking you? Mr. Chairman, can you give an assurance to the Hawker Policy and Hawker Management Select Committee members, that there will be no large scale recruitment to the Hawker Control Force without full consultation with the two Select Committees?
CHAIRMAN:-Recruitment cannot take place, as I have said, faster and larger than the amount the Hawker Control Force can take in at any one time. These particular courses are three months each. Each of them takes 24 or 28 men. I think you can rest assured that there will be no enormous, swamping, load of men being recruited without the two Select Committees being consulted first.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Mr. Chairman, would you be good enough to supply to the members of the Hawker Policy and Hawker Manage- ment Select Committees, in your capacity as Director of Urban Services, copies of the draft establishment for a model division of Hawker Control Force, and also what is the Department's anticipated recruit- ment between now and the end of March next year?
CHAIRMAN: -The Department would certainly be glad to give you copies of the model establishment for one division, and also for the final shape of the Hawker Control Force, but I think there would be little point in producing it rightaway before the new Commandant has had a chance to look at it and comment. Otherwise it may be some- what misleading.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN: Mr. Chairman, that is fully appreciated. However, since you have stated in your reply to Mr. BLAKER that the Department has already prepared such a draft, at least for the information of Members would you be good enough to supply them with copies of that draft?
CHAIRMAN: -Yes, certainly.
MR. BLAKER: -Mr. Chairman, you refer to a request to take increased power to dispense with the services of unsuitable officers. Do I understand that this will put these powers on a par with those of the Police in future?
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141
CHAIRMAN :—Yes, it is proposed that these powers should be modelled on those of the Police.
MR. BLAKER:Mr. Chairman, you also referred to a wider provi- sion of quarters. It is my understanding that, at the moment, barrack accommodation is provided only. Do I understand that Government might envisage the provision of married quarters for possibly senior grades of the Control Force?
CHAIRMAN: --Barrack quarters are provided for constables, single men of the Hawker Control Force, a very small proportion. No manning scale is laid down. It is simply a question of some years ago a particular set of premises being available and handed over for use by the Hawker Control Force, but that does not specify that, say, 10% or 20%, or something like that, of the Hawker Control Force will be provided with quarters. It is quite a fortuitous arrangement at the moment. Government has not agreed so far to any proposals for a manning scale, as it were a yardstick, for providing either barrack quarters or married quarters. We have asked for them, but so far no agreement has been reached.
MR. BLAKER:-One final question, Mr. Chairman. Will Govern- ment consider at the appropriate time a step which would, with no cost to Government, create an influx of recruits into the Force and place it on a par with the most celebrated Force in the Colony, namely, to petition the Queen to designate the Control Force the Royal Hong Kong Hawker Control Force. (Laughter).
MR. SALES: You referred to the training scheme now going on. Do I understand that the content of the scheme has the approval of the Select Committee? Has the Committee considered the type of training that our men should undergo?
CHAIRMAN: -No, Sir, the Select Committee has not been consulted on the training. The Director of Urban Services is legally in charge of the Hawker Control Force, and although the Select Committees are kept informed from time to time, they are not normally consulted on the details of the training itself for the Force.
MR. SALES: Am I to understand that the Director of Urban Services conducts the training himself?
CHAIRMAN:-No, he has someone else to do it.
MR. SALES: --Mr. Chairman, has the Director of Urban Services ever considered inviting our top hawkers as guest lecturers? (Laughter).
CHAIRMAN: ---Can I just answer that one? No, he has not invited them as guest lecturers, but he has invited them to passing-out parades.
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