1969 — Page 108

Urban Council Proceedings 市政局議事錄 All AI Reviewed

Page 108 of 237

194

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

CHAIRMAN: ---Do you want the matter investigated by competent people who are trained for the particular subject, or are you to load this on to the Inspectorate?

MR. HU: Mr. Chairman, with respect, unless the law is changed by the Legislative Council, I cannot accept this answer.

CHAIRMAN: We will look into this, Mr. Hu.

MR. SALES: Mr. Chairman, excuse me, surely the Urban Council is still the competent authority as Mr. Henry Hu has pointed out, even though a Select Committee of the Urban Council might have delegated the administrative competency of the matter to another Government Department. Could you confirm that the Urban Council is still the competent authority?

CHAIRMAN: We are one of the four competent authorities.

MR. SALES: But we have not yet abdicated that fourth share of the competency, have we?

CHAIRMAN: No.

MR. SALES: That is what I wanted to know.

MR. HU: Of course we do not want to delegate any of our responsibility to the Labour Department, because the Labour Department should look to their proper affairs to settle labour disputes.

CHAIRMAN: Generally speaking, the Labour Department has a lot to do with industry, and that is where the combustion processes usually take place.

MR. SALES: Mr. Chairman, is the Commissioner for Transport also a competent authority in this matter?

CHAIRMAN: I do not think so, Mr. SALES. He is a newcomer on this, and this Ordinance was introduced long before he was there.

MR. SALES: Mr. Chairman, in the circumstances, would you oblige the Council by exercising your authority as the competent authority in this matter, to bring to the attention of the Commissioner for Transport that it is widely held, in this day of twin exhausts, that car exhausts account for 50% of urban air pollution, and I would like to table this paper for you to read at your convenience and bring it to the attention of the Commissioner for Transport.

CHAIRMAN: The question is out of order, but I shall certainly bring it to his attention.

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

195

MR. SALES: No, it is not out of order, Mr. Chairman. The question as worded by Mr. Henry Hu is quite clear. What is the Council's policy regarding air pollution with particular reference to the Hung Hom and To Kwa Wan areas?

CHAIRMAN: Shall I restrict the Commissioner for Transport's views to Hung Hom and To Kwa Wan?

MR. SALES: Sure, by all means, Sir.

MR. Wu: Mr. Chairman, as a member of the Government Air Pollution Committee, may I offer some additional information to supplement the answer by Dr. HUANG?

CHAIRMAN: I hope it will not be too long, Mr. Wu.

MR. WU: The first thing is that the Commissioner of Police has the job of attending the Air Pollution Committee, it is normally the Senior Superintendent of Traffic, Mr. SHAVE, who has been attending the meetings, and his interest, of course, is on the exhaust system, on the exhaust gas belching out of the exhaust pipe. Secondly, I presume that Mr. Hu would like to know more about what is being done about Hung Hom air pollution, and this concerns mainly China Light and Power. The situation now is that since it is impossible to shut down the China Light plant, because then the supply of power would be affected and industry would suffer, so therefore the idea is to build up the Tsing Yi generating plant as quickly as possible and to gradually transfer the generating capacity from Hung Hom to Tsing Yi.

The cause of the objectionable air pollution is the very high sulphur dioxide content because of the sulphur present in the fuel oil used, very often 3.24% sulphur fuel oil, and whilst there is fuel oil with a less sulphur content available, the cost is very, very high and the public would be expected to pay an additional cost which could be tremendous. However, it seems that a compromise has been made whereby during the months from September to March, when the effect of sulphur dioxide would be most felt, the Power Company will use a fuel oil with 1.1% sulphur, thereby reducing the emission of sulphur dioxide. I know that this is the present situation, and that the Air Pollution Committee have recently submitted another report to the Secretary of the Department for consideration.

MR. HU: Mr. Chairman, may I ask one supplementary? When does this transfer start and when will it be completed?

MR. WU: I do not know the exact time-table, I cannot remember it, but understand that the Tsing Yi Power Station has already started operation and that part of the load could possibly have been transferred

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Page 108 of 237 194 HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL CHAIRMAN: ---Do you want the matter investigated by competent people who are trained for the particular subject, or are you to load this on to the Inspectorate? MR. HU: Mr. Chairman, with respect, unless the law is changed by the Legislative Council, I cannot accept this answer. CHAIRMAN: We will look into this, Mr. Hu. MR. SALES: Mr. Chairman, excuse me, surely the Urban Council is still the competent authority as Mr. Henry Hu has pointed out, even though a Select Committee of the Urban Council might have delegated the administrative competency of the matter to another Government Department. Could you confirm that the Urban Council is still the competent authority? CHAIRMAN: We are one of the four competent authorities. MR. SALES: But we have not yet abdicated that fourth share of the competency, have we? CHAIRMAN: No. MR. SALES: That is what I wanted to know. MR. HU: Of course we do not want to delegate any of our responsibility to the Labour Department, because the Labour Department should look to their proper affairs to settle labour disputes. CHAIRMAN: Generally speaking, the Labour Department has a lot to do with industry, and that is where the combustion processes usually take place. MR. SALES: Mr. Chairman, is the Commissioner for Transport also a competent authority in this matter? CHAIRMAN: I do not think so, Mr. SALES. He is a newcomer on this, and this Ordinance was introduced long before he was there. MR. SALES: Mr. Chairman, in the circumstances, would you oblige the Council by exercising your authority as the competent authority in this matter, to bring to the attention of the Commissioner for Transport that it is widely held, in this day of twin exhausts, that car exhausts account for 50% of urban air pollution, and I would like to table this paper for you to read at your convenience and bring it to the attention of the Commissioner for Transport. CHAIRMAN: The question is out of order, but I shall certainly bring it to his attention. HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL 195 MR. SALES: No, it is not out of order, Mr. Chairman. The question as worded by Mr. Henry Hu is quite clear. What is the Council's policy regarding air pollution with particular reference to the Hung Hom and To Kwa Wan areas? CHAIRMAN: Shall I restrict the Commissioner for Transport's views to Hung Hom and To Kwa Wan? MR. SALES: Sure, by all means, Sir. MR. Wu: Mr. Chairman, as a member of the Government Air Pollution Committee, may I offer some additional information to supplement the answer by Dr. HUANG? CHAIRMAN: I hope it will not be too long, Mr. Wu. MR. WU: The first thing is that the Commissioner of Police has the job of attending the Air Pollution Committee, it is normally the Senior Superintendent of Traffic, Mr. SHAVE, who has been attending the meetings, and his interest, of course, is on the exhaust system, on the exhaust gas belching out of the exhaust pipe. Secondly, I presume that Mr. Hu would like to know more about what is being done about Hung Hom air pollution, and this concerns mainly China Light and Power. The situation now is that since it is impossible to shut down the China Light plant, because then the supply of power would be affected and industry would suffer, so therefore the idea is to build up the Tsing Yi generating plant as quickly as possible and to gradually transfer the generating capacity from Hung Hom to Tsing Yi. The cause of the objectionable air pollution is the very high sulphur dioxide content because of the sulphur present in the fuel oil used, very often 3.24% sulphur fuel oil, and whilst there is fuel oil with a less sulphur content available, the cost is very, very high and the public would be expected to pay an additional cost which could be tremendous. However, it seems that a compromise has been made whereby during the months from September to March, when the effect of sulphur dioxide would be most felt, the Power Company will use a fuel oil with 1.1% sulphur, thereby reducing the emission of sulphur dioxide. I know that this is the present situation, and that the Air Pollution Committee have recently submitted another report to the Secretary of the Department for consideration. MR. HU: Mr. Chairman, may I ask one supplementary? When does this transfer start and when will it be completed? MR. WU: I do not know the exact time-table, I cannot remember it, but understand that the Tsing Yi Power Station has already started operation and that part of the load could possibly have been transferred 37 Page 109 of 237

Baseline (Original)

37 Page 108 of 237 194 HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL CHAIRMAN: ---Do you want the matter investigated by competent people who are trained for the particular subject, or are you to load this on to the Inspectorate? MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, with respect, unless the law is changed by the Legislative Council, I cannot accept this answer. CHAIRMAN:We will look into this, Mr. Hu. MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, excuse me, surely the Urban Council is still the competent authority as Mr. Henry Hu has pointed out, even though a Select Committee of the Urban Council might have delegated the administrative competency of the matter to another Government Department. Could you confirm that the Urban Council is still the competent authority? CHAIRMAN:-We are one of the four competent authorities. MR. SALES:-But we have not yet abdicated that fourth share of the competency, have we? CHAIRMAN:-No. MR. SALES:-That is what I wanted to know. MR. HU: Of course we do not want to delegate any of our re- sponsibility to the Labour Department, because the Labour Department should look to their proper affairs to settle labour disputes. CHAIRMAN:-Generally speaking, the Labour Department has a lot to do with industry, and that is where the combustion processes usually take place. MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, is the Commissioner for Transport also a competent authority in this matter? CHAIRMAN: I do not think so, Mr. SALES. He is a newcomer on this, and this Ordinance was introduced long before he was there. MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, in the circumstances, would you oblige the Council by exercising your authority as the competent au- thority in this matter, to bring to the attention of the Commissioner for Transport that it is widely held, in this day of twin exhausts, that car exhausts account for 50% of urban air pollution, and I would like to table this paper for you to read at your convenience and bring it to the attention of the Commissioner for Transport. CHAIRMAN:-The question is out of order, but I shall certainly bring it to his attention. HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL 195 MR. SALES: No, it is not out of order, Mr. Chairman. The What is the question as worded by Mr. Henry Hu is quite clear. Council's policy regarding air pollution with particular reference to the Hung Hom and To Kwa Wan areas? CHAIRMAN:-Shall I restrict the Commissioner for Transport's views to Hung Hom and To Kwa Wan? MR. SALES: -Sure, by all means, Sir. MR. Wu: Mr. Chairman, as a member of the Government Air Pollution Committee, may I offer some additional information to sup- plement the answer by Dr. HUANG? CHAIRMAN:-I hope it will not be too long, Mr. Wu. MR. WU:-The first thing is that the Commissioner of Police has the job of attending the Air Pollution Committee, it is normally the Senior Superintendent of Traffic, Mr. SHAVE, who has been attending the meetings, and his interest, of course, is on the exhaust system, on the exhaust gas belching out of the exhaust pipe. Secondly, I presume that Mr. Hu would like to know more about what is being done about Hung Hom air pollution, and this concerns mainly China Light and Power. The situation now is that since it is impossible to shut down the China Light plant, because then the supply of power would be affected and industry would suffer, so therefore the idea is to build up the Tsing Yi generating plant as quickly as possible and to gradually transfer the generating capacity from Hung Hom to Tsing Yi. The cause of the objectionable air pollution is the very high sul- phur dioxide content because of the sulphur present in the fuel oil used, very often 324% sulphur fuel oil, and whilst there is fuel oil with a less sulphur content available, the cost is very, very high and the public would be expected to pay an additional cost which could be tremendous. However, it seems that a compromise has been made whereby during the months from September to March, when the effect of sulphur dioxide would be most felt, the Power Company will use a fuel oil with 11% sulphur, thereby reducing the emission of sulphur dioxide. I know that this is the present situation, and that the Air Pollution Committee have recently submitted another report to the Secretary of the Department for consideration. MR. HU: Mr. Chairman, may I ask one supplementary? When does this transfer start and when will it be completed? MR. WU: I do not know the exact time-table, I cannot remember it, but understand that the Tsing Yi Power Station has already started operation and that part of the load could possibly have been transferred

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Page 108 of 237

194

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

CHAIRMAN: ---Do you want the matter investigated by competent people who are trained for the particular subject, or are you to load this on to the Inspectorate?

MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, with respect, unless the law is changed by the Legislative Council, I cannot accept this answer.

CHAIRMAN:We will look into this, Mr. Hu.

MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, excuse me, surely the Urban Council is still the competent authority as Mr. Henry Hu has pointed out, even though a Select Committee of the Urban Council might have delegated the administrative competency of the matter to another Government Department. Could you confirm that the Urban Council is still the competent authority?

CHAIRMAN:-We are one of the four competent authorities.

MR. SALES:-But we have not yet abdicated that fourth share of the competency, have we?

CHAIRMAN:-No.

MR. SALES:-That is what I wanted to know.

MR. HU: Of course we do not want to delegate any of our re- sponsibility to the Labour Department, because the Labour Department should look to their proper affairs to settle labour disputes.

CHAIRMAN:-Generally speaking, the Labour Department has a lot to do with industry, and that is where the combustion processes usually take place.

MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, is the Commissioner for Transport also a competent authority in this matter?

CHAIRMAN: I do not think so, Mr. SALES. He is a newcomer on this, and this Ordinance was introduced long before he was there.

MR. SALES: -Mr. Chairman, in the circumstances, would you oblige the Council by exercising your authority as the competent au- thority in this matter, to bring to the attention of the Commissioner for Transport that it is widely held, in this day of twin exhausts, that car exhausts account for 50% of urban air pollution, and I would like to table this paper for you to read at your convenience and bring it to the attention of the Commissioner for Transport.

CHAIRMAN:-The question is out of order, but I shall certainly bring it to his attention.

HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL

195

MR. SALES: No, it is not out of order, Mr. Chairman. The What is the question as worded by Mr. Henry Hu is quite clear. Council's policy regarding air pollution with particular reference to the Hung Hom and To Kwa Wan areas?

CHAIRMAN:-Shall I restrict the Commissioner for Transport's views to Hung Hom and To Kwa Wan?

MR. SALES: -Sure, by all means, Sir.

MR. Wu: Mr. Chairman, as a member of the Government Air Pollution Committee, may I offer some additional information to sup- plement the answer by Dr. HUANG?

CHAIRMAN:-I hope it will not be too long, Mr. Wu.

MR. WU:-The first thing is that the Commissioner of Police has the job of attending the Air Pollution Committee, it is normally the Senior Superintendent of Traffic, Mr. SHAVE, who has been attending the meetings, and his interest, of course, is on the exhaust system, on the exhaust gas belching out of the exhaust pipe. Secondly, I presume that Mr. Hu would like to know more about what is being done about Hung Hom air pollution, and this concerns mainly China Light and Power. The situation now is that since it is impossible to shut down the China Light plant, because then the supply of power would be affected and industry would suffer, so therefore the idea is to build up the Tsing Yi generating plant as quickly as possible and to gradually transfer the generating capacity from Hung Hom to Tsing Yi.

The cause of the objectionable air pollution is the very high sul- phur dioxide content because of the sulphur present in the fuel oil used, very often 324% sulphur fuel oil, and whilst there is fuel oil with a less sulphur content available, the cost is very, very high and the public would be expected to pay an additional cost which could be tremendous. However, it seems that a compromise has been made whereby during the months from September to March, when the effect of sulphur dioxide would be most felt, the Power Company will use a fuel oil with 11% sulphur, thereby reducing the emission of sulphur dioxide. I know that this is the present situation, and that the Air Pollution Committee have recently submitted another report to the Secretary of the Department for consideration.

MR. HU: Mr. Chairman, may I ask one supplementary? When does this transfer start and when will it be completed?

1969 — Page 108

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