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HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
CHAIRMAN:-I have replied to the question to the best of my ability, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN, and as I see the problem at present.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-And it is for this reason, Sir, that I am asking you this question, since judging from the reply you have made, perhaps you are not sufficiently aware of the fact that there is a body of opinion who consider that this suggestion has merit.
Now, may I ask a supplementary, Mr. Chairman? In the penultimate paragraph of your reply you have stated that if the name is changed to "Hawker Service Corps", it could be misinterpreted. Would you agree, Mr. Chairman, that this could be avoided if the Force could be called the "Urban Council Hawker Service Corps?" In this case, it would not give the impression that this is a private body.
CHAIRMAN: ---This would not be possible, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN, because the Hawker Control Force in respect of discipline, training and other matters comes under the Urban Services Department, not the Urban Council.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Well, may I amend that and say that if it were named "Urban Services Department Hawker Service Corps", would that still create the misapprehension to which you have referred?
CHAIRMAN:-Probably not, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN. This can be considered when the time comes.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Now, may I ask a final supplementary? Is there any objection under Standing Orders for any Member of the Hawkers Select Committee, either the Policy Committee or the Management Committee, to put forward this suggestion for consideration by either of the Select Committees?
CHAIRMAN:-Would you repeat that question, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN?
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-In other words, Mr. Chairman, in your last paragraph you have stated that "it is not appropriate for you to invite the Policy Select Committee to consider any change in the name of the Force". Would you have any objection, Mr. Chairman, if any Member of the Committee put forward this suggestion for consideration, since you yourself have stated that you do not consider it appropriate for you to put forward this suggestion?
CHAIRMAN:-I think the crux of the matter, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN, is that I have said it is not appropriate "at present" for me to seek the views of the Committee.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Then, you do agree that it could be appropriate in future.
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
CHAIRMAN:-If I thought the moment appropriate, yes.
239
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-You have not answered my supplementary, Mr. Chairman. Is it in order then for a Member of the Hawker Policy Committee to raise this at the next meeting of the Hawker Select Committee?
CHAIRMAN:--They may raise it if they wish, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN. MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Thank you for clarifying Standing Orders.
MR. BERNACCHI:-You may raise it with the permission of the Chairman. (Laughter).
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Now, on a point of clarification, Mr. Chairman. Does Standing Orders state that the permission of the Chairman is necessary to have any point such as this raised under “Any other business" at any meeting of the Hawker Policy Select Committee?
MR. SALES: --Mr. Chairman, may I suggest that an end be put to this matter, because we have a very long Agenda to-day, particularly the Motion on Hawkers, by pointing out a fact that perhaps Mr. CHEONG-LEEN has overlooked? That is, he has since asked to be put on the Hawkers Policy Select Committee, and he could raise this matter himself on that Committee with the permission of Mr. BERNACCHI, who no doubt knows Standing Orders perhaps a shade better than Mr. CHEONG-LEEN. (Laughter).
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Mr. Chairman, I quite appreciate the views expressed by Mr. SALES, but may I point out that the reason why I framed my question in the manner that I did, was I wished to find out whether it was your intention to discourage any Members of the Hawkers Select Committee from raising this question at any meeting of that Committee. This seems to be somewhat implicit in the last paragraph of your reply.
(4) MR. H. M. G. FORSGATE asked the following question:
Will the Chairman advise this Council-
(i) What plans have been made to safeguard the beaches
in the urban area from oil pollution?
(ii) Has a report been made on the "Columbia Trader” and the efficacy of the measures adopted to clear the oil which leaked from the ship.
THE CHAIRMAN, URBAN COUNCIL, replied as follows:
This question concerns plans made to safeguard urban beaches
from oil pollution.
Page 131 of 243
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HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
CHAIRMAN:-I have replied to the question to the best of my ability, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN, and as I see the problem at present.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-And it is for this reason, Sir, that I am asking you this question, since judging from the reply you have made, perhaps you are not sufficiently aware of the fact that there is a body of opinion who consider that this suggestion has merit.
Now, may I ask a supplementary, Mr. Chairman? In the penul- timate paragraph of your reply you have stated that if the name is changed to "Hawker Service Corps", it could be misinterpreted. Would you agree, Mr. Chairman, that this could be avoided if the Force could be called the "Urban Council Hawker Service Corps?" In this case, it would not give the impression that this is a private body.
CHAIRMAN: ---This would not be possible, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN, because the Hawker Control Force in respect of discipline, training and other matters comes under the Urban Services Department, not the Urban Council.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Well, may I amend that and say that if it were named "Urban Services Department Hawker Service Corps", would that still create the misapprehension to which you have referred?
CHAIRMAN:-Probably not, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN. This can be con- sidered when the time comes.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Now, may I ask a final supplementary? Is there any objection under Standing Orders for any Member of the Hawkers Select Committee, either the Policy Committee or the Manage- ment Committee, to put forward this suggestion for consideration by either of the Select Committees?
CHAIRMAN:-Would you repeat that question, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN?
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-In other words, Mr. Chairman, in your last paragraph you have stated that "it is not appropriate for you to invite the Policy Select Committee to consider any change in the name of the Force". Would you have any objection, Mr. Chairman, if any Member of the Committee put forward this suggestion for consideration, since you yourself have stated that you do not consider it appropriate for you to put forward this suggestion?
CHAIRMAN:-I think the crux of the matter, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN, is that I have said it is not appropriate "at present" for me to seek the views of the Committee.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Then, you do agree that it could be appro- priate in future.
HONG KONG URBAN COUNCIL
CHAIRMAN:-If I thought the moment appropriate, yes.
239
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-You have not answered my supplementary, Mr. Chairman. Is it in order then for a Member of the Hawker Policy Committee to raise this at the next meeting of the Hawker Select Committee?
CHAIRMAN:--They may raise it if they wish, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN. MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Thank you for clarifying Standing Orders.
MR. BERNACCHI:-You may raise it with the permission of the Chairman. (Laughter).
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Now, on a point of clarification, Mr. Chair- man. Does Standing Orders state that the permission of the Chairman is necessary to have any point such as this raised under “Any other business" at any meeting of the Hawker Policy Select Committee?
MR. SALES: --Mr. Chairman, may I suggest that an end be put to this matter, because we have a very long Agenda to-day, particularly the Motion on Hawkers, by pointing out a fact that perhaps Mr. CHEONG-LEEN has overlooked? That is, he has since asked to be put on the Hawkers Policy Select Committee, and he could raise this matter himself on that Committee with the permission of Mr. BERNACCHI, who no doubt knows Standing Orders perhaps a shade better than Mr. CHEONG-LEEN. (Laughter).
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Mr. Chairman, I quite appreciate the views expressed by Mr. SALES, but may I point out that the reason why I framed my question in the manner that I did, was I wished to find out whether it was your intention to discourage any Members of the Hawkers Select Committee from raising this question at any meeting of that Committee. This seems to be somewhat implicit in the last para- graph of your reply.
(4) MR. H. M. G. FORSGATE asked the following question:
Will the Chairman advise this Council-
(i) What plans have been made to safeguard the beaches
in the urban area from oil pollution?
(ii) Has a report been made on the "Columbia Trader” and the efficacy of the measures adopted to clear the oil which leaked from the ship.
THE CHAIRMAN, URBAN COUNCIL, replied as follows:
This question concerns plans made to safeguard urban beaches
from oil pollution.
Page 131 of 243
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