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CHAIRMAN: ---Mr. BERNACCHI, it has not been brought to my attention.
MR. BERNACCHI: -Certainly it has not been brought to my attention, although Mr. RAFEEK is a member of the Hawkers' Select Committee.
CHAIRMAN: -Mr. RAFEEK, perhaps I should say that the petition was addressed to yourself alone?
MR. RAFEEK: -No Sir, actually it was not a written complaint. We visited the Tai Hang Kaifong Association on the 24th of last month, that was a Saturday, and we were told by the hawkers of this complaint.
MR. BERNACCHI: -Perhaps on a point of clarification then, it was not an actual petition in writing, it was information that you obtained from the hawkers when you visited them?
MR. RAFEEK: —Yes.
MR. BERNACCHI: -Thank you.
(11) MR. H. CHEONG-LEEN asked the following question:-
Squatter residents on the hill above Tin Hau Temple Road have complained that there are insufficient toilets in this squatter area for the several tens of thousands of residents living there; can the Chairman please advise how many public toilets have been provided by the Urban Services Department for this particular squatter area, and what improvements are required?
THE COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT replied as follows:-
The two squatter areas on the hill-slope above Tin Hau Temple Road are known as "Tin Hau Temple Hill Squatter Area" which is immediately above the road, and "Ngar Choi Hang Squatter Area" which is higher up the slope. Records show that the population of these two areas is 6,097. There are also 3 other squatter areas nearby which are above the Tai Hang Area and are accessible from Causeway Road and Lin Fa Kung Street. These are:
(a) Lin Fa Kung Squatter Area population 3,308 (b) Wun Sha Hill Squatter Area population 3,800 (c) Ma Shan Squatter Area population 4,142
72 latrine compartments are provided at various points in these 5 adjoining squatter areas with a total population of about 17,300. The ratio of latrines to population is roughly 1 to 240 persons. In addition, there is also a 34-seat flushed public latrine with bath facilities near the entrance to the three areas above Tai Hang.
Regular observations made by Urban Services Department Staff responsible for the servicing of these latrines reveal that the numbers are adequate, as the receptacles are generally far from being full when emptied each night. The staff are required to report cases where there is evidence of shortage of latrines and to provide additional ones, if necessary.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN: -May I ask, Mr. Chairman, on whose advice is this ratio of 1-240 established? Is it the Urban Services Department?
COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: -Mr. Chairman, there is no ratio established for squatter areas. Most squatter areas have developed haphazardly, and have been in existence for many years. As they grew, temporary latrine accommodation was provided as required. The need varies from one area to another, for instance by such factors as the proximity of public latrines or existing private latrines, the nature of the hillsides and availability of sites and so on. Consequently, the scale of provision varies.
DR. BELL: -Mr. Chairman, I notice throughout the Commissioner's reply he has made no direct reference to health standards with regard to the numbers that are provided. Are health standards not taken into consideration, and do health inspectors not go there to see whether there are sufficient latrines provided? Am I wrong in remembering that at one stage the Deputy Director said the correct number should be one to every 100 persons in these areas?
COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: -As regards the first part of that supplementary question Mr. Chairman, MR. CHEONG-LEEN asked the number, and I gave him a reply to his question. On the second part, the ratio of one to 100 applies to re-site areas where population statistics are accurate, and where generally there are no public latrines already available.
DR. BELL: -I am sorry, Mr. Chairman, I didn't get an answer to the first part of my question at all, which was, are the health inspectors in any way concerned in taking health aspects into consideration for the numbers provided?
COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT: -I am sorry, Mr. Chairman, I understood Dr. BELL's question to be: "Why didn't the Commissioner..."
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CHAIRMAN: ---Mr. BERNACCHI, it has not been brought to my
attention.
MR. BERNACCHI:-Certainly it has not been brought to my atten- tion, although Mr. RAFEEK is a member of the Hawkers' Select Committee.
CHAIRMAN:--Mr. RAFEEK, perhaps I should say that the petition was addressed to yourself alone?
MR. RAFEEK: -No Sir, actually it was not a written complaint. We visited the Tai Hang Kaifong Association on the 24th of last month, that was a Saturday, and we were told by the hawkers of this complaint.
MR. BERNACCHI:-Perhaps on a point of clarification then, it was not an actual petition in writing, it was information that you obtained from the hawkers when you visited them?
MR. RAFEEK: —Yes.
MR. BERNACCHI:-Thank you.
(11) MR. H. CHEONG-LEEN asked the following question:-
Squatter residents on the hill above Tin Hau Temple Road have complained that there are insufficient toilets in this squatter area for the several tens of thousands of residents living there; can the Chairman please advise how many public toilets have been provided by the Urban Services Department for this particular squatter area, and what improvements are required?
THE COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT replied as follows:-
The two squatter areas on the hill-slope above Tin Hau Temple Road are known as "Tin Hau Temple Hill Squatter Area" which is immediately above the road, and "Ngar Choi Hang Squatter Area" which is higher up the slope. Records show that the population of these two area is 6,097. There are also 3 other squatter areas nearby which are above the Tai Hang Area and are accessible from Causeway Road and Lin Fa Kung Street. These are:
(a) Lin Fa Kung Squatter Area population 3,308 (b) Wun Sha Hill Squatter Arear population 3,800 (c) Ma Shan Squatter Area population
4,142
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2.
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72 latrine compartments are provided at various points in these 5 adjoining squatter areas with a total popula- tion of about 17,300. The ratio of latrines to popula- tion is roughly 1 to 240 persons. In addition there is also a 34-seat flushed public latrine with bath facilities near the entrance to the three areas above Tai Hang. 3. Regular observations made by Urban Services Depart- ment Staff responsible for the servicing of these latrines reveal that the numbers are adequate, as the receptacles are generally far from being full when emptied each night. The staff are required to report cases where there is evidence of shortage of latrines and to provide additional ones, if necessary.
MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-May I ask, Mr. Chairman, on whose advice is this ratio of 1-240 established? Is it the Urban Services Depart- ment?
COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-Mr. Chairman, there is no ratio established for squatter areas. Most squatter areas have develop- ed haphazardly, and have been in existence for many years. As they grew, temporary latrine accommodation was provided as required. The need varies from one area to another, for instance by such factors as the proximity of public latrines or existing private latrines, the nature of the hillsides and availability of sites and so on. Consequently the scale of provision varies.
DR. BELL:Mr. Chairman, I notice throughout the Commissioner's reply he has made no direct reference to health standards with regard to the numbers that are provided. Are health standards not taken into consideration, and do health inspectors not go there to see whether there are sufficient latrines provided? Am I wrong in remembering that at one stage the Deputy Director said the correct number should be one to every 100 persons in these areas?
COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-As regards the first part of that supplementary question Mr. Chairman, Mr. CHEONG-LEEN asked the number, and I gave him a reply to his question. On the second part the ratio of one to 100 applies to re-site areas where population statistics are accurate, and where generally there are no public latrines already available.
DR. BELL:-I am sorry, Mr. Chairman, I didn't get an answer to the first part of my question at all, which was, are the health inspectors in any way concerned in taking health aspects into consideration for the numbers provided?
COMMISSIONER FOR RESETTLEMENT:-I am sorry, Mr. Chairman, I understood Dr. BELL's question to be: "Why didn't the Commis-
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