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tolerated, and Government is duty bound to refute that suggestion. I believe too, Sir, that because we enjoy freedom of expression, and our friends in the press enjoy so much freedom, even to mis-interpret what Urban Councillors say at times (laughter)—that we must fight, and fight hard, to preserve that situation: to uphold our right to speak freely, and to uphold our right to act within the law according to what we deem to be in our interests to do. But I do not think I may be mistaken that a case has been made on just a few examples. One case is coming up on Friday, and for that reason I would be prepared to support this motion if the text were amended to represent my feelings in this matter, and I would like with your permission, Sir, to tell Mrs. ELLIOTT and her supporters to what extent I am able to support this motion. I would like to read what I think the text ought to be:-
“That this Council draws the attention of Government that some civil servants, especially in the lower echelons responsible for law and order in Hong Kong, are reported to use their position to express threats of deportation against law-abiding citizens.”
I think that is a most reasonable request, and that it achieves the purpose that Mrs. ELLIOTT has set out to do. If she is agreeable I would like to move that amendment. First, the substitution of the words “draws the attention of” for “express concern to”, and then insertion of the words “are reported to” after the words “in Hong Kong”.
MR. FUNG:-Mr. Chairman, I have pleasure in seconding the amendment made by Mr. SALES.
MRS. ELLIOTT:-If my seconder has no objection, I have none.
MR. HU:-Mr. Chairman, I think Mr. SALES' suggested wording “draws the attention of” and “reported to” is very good, but “express concern” would, I think, be better as Government is also concerned. If you read the Attorney General's speech, Government also shares our same feeling and our concern.
MR. SALES: May I just explain the position. We should not go on record to “express concern” over reports, we “draw attention” of Government to such reports, and when Government explains the position to us in Standing Committee of the Whole Council, then we can record our concern when the position has been clarified.
CHAIRMAN:-May I point out, Sir, your English is a little weak.
(Laughter).
MR. SALES:-Sir, I would like to hear my Scottish friend on the extent my English should be improved. I too am a foreigner, but not being north of the border. (Laughter).
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CHAIRMAN:---No, I would only point out that if your amendment goes in as proposed by you, it would read:
“that this Council draws the attention of Government that some civil servants”--
MR. SALES: No, no I said substitution for the words “express concern to” by the words “draws the attention of Government”.
MRS. ELLIOTT:-“To the fact.”
MR. SALES: “Draws the attention of Government that some civil servants” it seems to me to be quite alright. If it pleases you, Sir, I'm would always willing to please the Chairman, as you are well aware,
be prepared to accept the addition of the words “draws the attention of Government to the fact that some Civil servants.” I'm always pre-pared to abide by your wisdom, as you well know.
CHAIRMAN: May I inquire who your seconder was?
Mr. FUNG seconded.
Mr. BERNACCHI:-Mr. Chairman, various specific examples or allegations have been mentioned by Mrs. ELLIOTT in the course of her speech on the original motion, and I agree with Mr. Hu as to the generous nature and sincerity of Mrs. ELLIOTT. I also agree with Mr. SALES that in some instances the detention is for the benefit of the true citizens of Hong Kong. For myself, however, I am seconding this original motion, and am prepared to support Mr. SALES' slight amendment, mainly on the ground that the Reform Club and myself are concerned that members of the public have got the impression, rightly or wrongly, that the threat of deportation is hanging over them like the sword of Damocles. It does not apply merely to those members of the public whom fortune has not favoured with education. The Reform Club has reason to think that many voters, for instance, still think that their names are taken by the Police because they have voted from the records of the Polling Stations and that it would be held against them, should they have ever done anything wrong. In fact, of course, the Voting Laws are quite clear, the police are not given access to the names of people who have voted, and all papers are burnt or otherwise utterly destroyed some time after the Elections. In fact, far from the Govern-ment discouraging people from voting, I genuinely believe that Govern-ment would like to see members of the public taking an interest in exercising their rights to vote, and the Governor himself as we all know, has set up a Working Party to examine and advise on the revision and extension of the Electorate Roll. I hope sincerely that some announce-
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tolerated, and Government is duty bound to refute that suggestion. I believe too, Sir, that because we enjoy freedom of expression, and our friends in the press enjoy so much freedom, even to mis-interpret what Urban Councillors say at times (laughter)-that we must fight, and fight hard, to preserve that situation: to uphold our right to speak freely, and to uphold our right to act within the law according to what we deem to be in our interests to do. But I do not think I may be mistaken that a case has been made on just a few examples. One case is coming up on Friday, and for that reason I would be prepared to support this motion if the text were amended to represent my feelings in this matter, and I would like with your permission, Sir, to tell Mrs. ELLIOTT and her supporters to what extent I am able to support this motion. I would like to read what I think the text ought to be:-
"That this Council draws the attention of Government that some civil servants, especially in the lower echelons responsible for law and order in Hong Kong, are reported to use their position to express threats of deportation against law-abiding citizens."
I think that is a most reasonable request, and that it achieves the purpose that Mrs. ELLIOTT has set out to do. If she is agreeable I would like to move that amendment. First, the substitution of the words "draws the attention of" for "express concern to", and then inser- tion of the words "are reported to" after the words "in Hong Kong".
MR. FUNG:-Mr. Chairman, I have pleasure in seconding the amendment made by Mr. SALES.
MRS. ELLIOTT:-If my seconder has no objection, I have none.
MR. HU-Mr. Chairman, I think Mr. SALES' suggested wording "draws the attention of" and "reported to" is very good, but "express concern" would, I think, be better as Government is also concerned. If you read the Attorney General's speech, Government also shares our same feeling and our concern.
MR. SALES: May I just explain the position. We should not go on record to "express concern" over reports, we "draw attention" of Government to such reports, and when Government explains the posi tion to us in Standing Committee of the Whole Council, then we can record our concern when the position has been clarified.
CHAIRMAN:-May I point out, Sir, your English is a little weak.
(Laughter).
MR. SALES: -Sir, I would like to hear my Scottish friend on the extent my English should be improved. I too am a foreigner, but not being north of the border. (Laughter).
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CHAIRMAN: ---No, I would only point out that if your amendment goes in as proposed by you, it would read:
"that this Council draws the attention of Government that some civil servants"--
MR. SALES: No, no I said substitution for the words "express concern to" by the words "draws the attention of Government".
MRS. ELLIOTT:-"To the fact."
MR. SALES: "Draws the attention of Government that some civil servants" it seems to me to be quite alright. If it pleases you, Sir, I'm would always willing to please the Chairman, as you are well aware,
be prepared to accept the addition of the words "draws the attention of Government to the fact that some Civil servants." I'm always pre- pared to abide by your wisdom, as you well know.
CHAIRMAN: May I inquire who your seconder was?
Mr. FUNGI seconded.
Mr. BERNACCHI:-Mr. Chairman, various specific examples or allegations have been mentioned by Mrs. ELLIOTT in the course of her speech on the original motion, and I agree with Mr. Hu as to the generous nature and sincerity of Mrs. ELLIOTT. I also agree with Mr. SALES that in some instances the detention is for the benefit of the true citizens of Hong Kong. For myself, however, I am seconding this original motion, and am prepared to support Mr. SALES' slight amendment, mainly on the ground that the Reform Club and myself are concerned that members of the public have got the impression, rightly or wrongly, that the threat of deportation is hanging over them like the sword of Damocles. It does not apply merely to those members of the public whom fortune has not favoured with education. The Reform Club has reason to think that many voters, for instance, still think that their names are taken by the Police because they have voted from the records of the Polling Stations and that it would be held against them, should they have ever done anything wrong. In fact, of course, the Voting Laws are quite clear, the police are not given access to the names of people who have voted, and all papers are burnt or otherwise utterly destroyed some time after the Elections. In fact, far from the Govern- ment discouraging people from voting, I genuinely believe that Govern- ment would like to see members of the public taking an interest in exercising their rights to vote, and the Governor himself as we all know, has set up a Working Party to examine and advise on the revision and extension of the Electorate Roll. I hope sincerely that some announce-
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