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be sited at Sha Tin, which I don't think was suggested at the Committee meeting. It might be quite nice for the family to play golf while the head of the family is betting on the horses. Could that suggestion please be made? (Laughter).
MR. SALES: Sir, the Urban Amenities Select Committee is aware of the fact that the present race course at Happy Valley used to contain a golf course in fact until after the last war and, when the Jockey Club moves out of there, the Urban Amenities Select Committee will stake a claim. Likewise the Urban Amenities Select Committee is likely to stake a claim for a golf course within the Race Course at Sha Tin, as Dr. BELL has so kindly suggested.
DR. BELL: In the second paragraph of Mr. SALES' answer, Mr. Chairman, he suggests—and I suspect it was also written in by him—perhaps not by the department, "it goes without saying there will be a reasonable charge for the sport." Well I would like to ask you, if I may point out, that in Scotland, I repeat, Scotland—a reasonable charge for this type of thing was threepence which I work out at being 20 cents, and that included hire of putter and a ball for children. For adults it was 6d. which I work out to be 40 cents, which included the hire of putter and a ball. I hope that when Mr. SALES is considering what reasonable charges should be at the Urban Amenities Select Committee, that he will realize that these are regarded as reasonable charges elsewhere, and keep in mind that there should not be an increase in charges for sporting facilities available in such small amounts as they are in Hong Kong to the members of the public.
MR. SALES: Sir, before I answer that supplementary, may I compliment the members of the Reform Club on their perspicacity: that they can pick out my style a mile away? (Laughter). On the question of charges in Hong Kong in its relation to those now levied in Scotland, Sir, may I suggest that rates in Caledonia need not apply to Hong Kong of necessity. In fact there is a wide variation even in Scotland as to what rates ought to be between Aberdeen and Edinburgh. In our present circumstances I suspect that our thinking on financial matters in Hong Kong is largely influenced by St. Andrews and not by Edinburgh, so we will have to take into account the fact the school of economic thought belonging to St. Andrews might not take too kindly to a charge of 3d. as levied in Edinburgh!
DR. BELL: Sir, on a point of clarification, may I assure Mr. SALES that I chose a spot well between Edinburgh and Aberdeen, exactly half way practically, for giving you these charges. I thought they might be pretty well average by that time.
MR. SALES: In the circumstances, Sir, knowing Scotland as well as I claim that I do, the charge must have been entirely calculated by Aberdonians. (Laughter).
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MR. WILFRED WONG: Sir, may I ask a supplementary question? With due diffidence to Dr. BELL, is not golf normally considered a rich man's or rich woman's game, especially in Hong Kong, where there are many thousands of children who do not even have a playground in their own ward?
DR. BELL: Mr. Chairman, please may I answer that? It certainly isn't Mr. WONG. It is not in any way a rich man's game. In other parts of the world, it is played by comparatively poor people. It is not an expensive sport to play.
MR. WONG: Mr. Chairman, on a matter of priorities as applied to Hong Kong, would not golf appear to be a little low on priority as far as other amenities are concerned?
MR. SALES: Sir, may I reply to that question? I am in fact most grateful to my colleague Mr. WONG for having put it. I think that members of this Council must weigh the claims of a golf course against those of a resettlement estate. Land that may be set aside for a golf course could well be used to house poor people. Therefore I suggest that in the matter of setting up a public golf course we might make haste slowly. We should first have a putting green, then a driving range somewhere conveniently located, and subsequently the public golf course. In fact this is a most important matter. We might even revive the question of having a golf course at certain hours in the Happy Valley race course where there was one not so long ago.
DR. BELL: Mr. Chairman, I haven't finished my supplementary question on the original one. Going back to the original answer Mr. SALES gave us, it is connected with this, I would like to ask how many acres it was that we were informed would be available for public recreation at King's Park.
MR. SALES: Sir, that is a most important political question and the Urban Council has been told to keep their hands off for the present. We have already drawn up plans to utilize the land that Dr. BELL has in mind, and the plans do not include a golf course because that land is very much needed, and in fact is being much used by the people of Hung Hom. I have kept that bit of land under observation as you know, and I am very glad to see it is used for recreation by the people living not so far away in Hung Hom. I don't think I can recommend to the Select Committee that it be used for a golf course.
DR. BELL: Mr. Chairman, that hasn't answered my question. I asked how many acres of land were given at King's Park? Mr. SALES hasn't perhaps been able to answer that question, but I rather think it was quite a considerable number, and this suggestion of 15 acres that is necessary for a small golf course might as well be fitted in there. Unless Mr. SALES has got this particular area under lock
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be sited at Sha Tin, which I don't think was suggested at the Committee meeting. It might be quite nice for the family to play golf while the head of the family is betting on the horses. Could that suggestion please be made? (Laughter).
MR. SALES: Sir, the Urban Amenities Select Committee is aware of the fact that the present race course at Happy Valley used to contain a golf course in fact until after the last war and, when the Jockey Club moves out of there, the Urban Amenities Select Committee will stake a claim. Likewise the Urban Amenities Select Committee is likely to stake a claim for a golf course within the Race Course at Sha Tin, as Dr. BELL has so kindly suggested.
DR. BELL:-In the second paragraph of Mr. SALES' answer, Mr. Chairman, he suggests--and I suspect it was also written in by him- perhaps not by the department, "it goes without saying there will be a reasonable charge for the sport." Well I would like to ask you, if I may point out, that in Scotland, I repeat, Scotland-a reasonable charge for this type of thing was threepence which I work out at being 20 cents, and that included hire of putter and a ball for children. For adults it was 6d. which I work out to be 40 cents, which included the hire of putter and a ball. I hope that when Mr. SALES is considering what reasonable charges should be at the Urban Amenities Select Com- mittee, that he will realize that these are regarded as reasonable charges elsewhere, and keep in mind that there should not be an increase in charges for sporting facilities available in such small amounts as they are in Hong Kong to the members of the public.
MR. SALES: Sir, before I answer that supplementary, may I compliment the members of the Reform Club on their perspicacity: that they can pick out my style a mile away? (Laughter). On the question of charges in Hong Kong in its relation to those now levied in Scotland, Sir, may I suggest that rates in Caledonia need not apply to Hong Kong of necessity. In fact there is a wide variation even in Scotland as to what rates ought to be between Aberdeen and Edinburgh. In our present circumstances I suspect that our thinking on financial matters in Hong Kong is largely influenced by St. Andrews and not by Edinburgh, so we will have to take into account the fact the school of economic thought belonging to St. Andrews might not take too kindly to a charge of 3d. as levied in Edinburgh!
DR. BELL:Sir, on a point of clarification, may I assure Mr. SALES that I chose a spot well between Edinburgh and Aberdeen, exactly half way practically, for giving you these charges. I thought they might be pretty well average by that time.
MR. SALES: In the circumstances, Sir, knowing Scotland as well as I claim that I do, the charge must have been entirely calculated by Aberdonians. (Laughter).
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MR. WILFRED WONG:-Sir, may I ask a supplementary question? With due diffidence to Dr. BELL, is not golf normally considered a rich man's or rich woman's game, especially in Hong Kong, where there are many thousands of children who do not even have a playground in their own ward?
DR. BELL:-Mr. Chairman, please may I answer that? It certain- ly isn't Mr. WONG. It is not in any way a rich man's game. In other parts of the world, it is played by comparatively poor people. It is not an expensive sport to play.
MR. WONG: Mr. Chairman, on a matter of priorities as applied to Hong Kong, would not golf appear to be a little low on priority as far as other amenities are concerned?
MR. SALES: -Sir, may I reply to that question? I am in fact most grateful to my colleague Mr. WONG for having put it. I think that members of this Council must weigh the claims of a golf course against those of a resettlement estate. Land that may be set aside for a golf course could well be used to house poor people. Therefore I suggest that in the matter of setting up a public golf course we might make haste slowly. We should first have a putting green, then a driv- ing range somewhere conveniently located, and subsequently the public golf course. In fact this is a most important matter. We might even revive the question of having a golf course at certain hours in the Happy Valley race course where there was one not so long ago.
DR. BELL: Mr. Chairman, I haven't finished my supplementary question on the original one. Going back to the original answer Mr. SALES gave us, it is connected with this, I would like to ask how many acres it was that we were informed would be available for public recreation at King's Park.
MR. SALES: Sir, that is a most important political question and the Urban Council has been told to keep their hands off for the present. We have already drawn up plans to utilize the land that Dr. BELL has in mind, and the plans do not include a golf course because that land is very much needed, and in fact is being much used by the people of Hung Hom. I have kept that bit of land under observation as you know, and I am very glad to see it is used for recreation by the people living not so far away in Hung Hom. I don't think I can recommend to the Select Committee that it be used for a golf course.
DR. BELL: Mr. Chairman, that hasn't answered my question. I asked how many acres of land were given at King's Park? Mr. SALES hasn't perhaps been able to answer that question, but I rather think it was quite a considerable number, and this suggestion of 15 acres that is necessary for a small golf course might as well be fitted in there. Unless Mr. SALES has got this particular area under lock
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