1964 — Page 132

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Page 132 of 312

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CHAIRMAN:-With respect, and in view of my limited experience in this Council, Sir, which is not comparable to your own, I would wish to check the point and let you know later.

DR. LEE:-I can endorse Mr. BERNACCHI's remarks, because at that time I was a member of the original City Hall Public Committee, and I spoke against having the Urban Council in the present City Hall. That was because when I was a member of the Urban Council I was not consulted, but later on I was informed by my colleague and friend Mr. BERNACCHI that he was consulted a year before I joined the Council, so therefore, regarding those dates you were wrong, Mr. Chairman.

MR. BERNACCHI:-My second supplementary then is: did not Mr. RICHARDS, in informing this Council in Committee of the Whole that he proposed to go back upon the motion passed in open Council, say words to the effect that the Urban Council would sit in the Executive or Legislative Council Chamber until the main municipal building was erected?

CHAIRMAN:-I would ask your permission to check the point and let you know the answer later.

MR. BERNACCHI:-Again, as a supplementary, was it not only later that this Urban Council Chamber was established at the end of the floor in the new building given to the Urban Services Department and the floor in the new building was given to them only until the erection of a new municipal building? Perhaps your answer is the same?

CHAIRMAN:-Yes, Sir. (Laughter).

MR. BERNACCHI:-If indeed my detailing of the facts is correct, do you not consider, Mr. Chairman, and this is not asking for a state- ment of opinion, the erection of a main municipal building to be an entirely different issue to the accommodation of this Council in this building at the present time?

CHAIRMAN:-Assuming that what you have said is correct, Sir,

I agree.

MR. BERNACCHI:-I ask you, Sir, again: Assuming what I have said to be correct, was not the confidential intimation at the time (I do not think that I am breaking any confidence nearly 12 years afterwards) (Laughter) that Government intended to build a municipal building on the proposed new reclamation, an intimation that in the 1960's this Urban Council would be constituted as a municipal council? I ask you, Sir, whether or not you agree that was the only interpretation that could be put on the confidential intimation, that Government agreed to build a new municipal building on the proposed reclamation?

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CHAIRMAN: -Well, Sir, I must beg leave to form my own opinion on the basis of the facts which I now propose to check.

MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Mr. Chairman, would it be possible for a search to be made in our records and for a copy of whatever resolution that was passed in regard to this subject, together with the record of the debate, be circulated to Members?

CHAIRMAN: -I would be glad to do so.

MR. CHEONG-LEEN:-Thank you.

DR. LEE: —I do not think that there was a debate. It was a state- ment made in confidence by the then Chairman to Members of the Urban Council. Now I would like to ask a supplementary question. In view of the growing importance that this Council has assumed, does not the Chairman agree that now is the time to plan for a municipal building with its other ancillary facilities?

CHAIRMAN: ---Sir, I must regretfully inform you that you are seek- ing from me an expression of opinion which I cannot give in this matter.

DR. LEE: Mr. Chairman, have you received any complaints from Members of this Council that at one end of the table they cannot hear the Members at the other end talking? In other words, the acoustics of this room are inadequate for important discussions during Council meetings.

CHAIRMAN:-Sir, if it were merely a question of acoustics, I would be prepared to offer to shout. (Laughter). I think it is more im- portant than that, but I do apologise if the acoustics are not as good as they should be, and if there are any complaints on the subject of acoustics, I would be delighted to consider them.

DR. LEE:-Will you also draw Government's attention to the fact that if it contemplates erecting a municipal building, the incorporation of a museum should be seriously considered?

CHAIRMAN : —Yes, Sir.

MR. SALES: Is it suggested that the Urban Council is worthy to be put into a museum? (Laughter).

DR. LEE:-As land in Hong Kong is so precious nowadays, Mr. Chairman, do you not agree that a multi-purpose building serves the needs of Hong Kong better?