Sessional_Paper_1893 — Page 615

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Q. He made out the estimates?

A. Yes.

Q. Did you ever check those estimates?

`A.—I used to go over them with him. He used to consult me.

Q.--He practically made them out?

A. He submitted them to me.

Mr. Bird. And if he was defrauding the Treasury he would naturally make the estimates less? -

A.-Quite so.

Mr. Thurburn. In making our recommendations for the future working of the Office we would naturally say that all these lists, as well as crown rent, could be regularly balanced ?

A. Of course,

Q-Bring out a balance of the lists to see whether any defalcations had occurred?

A. Yes.

Q.--Would that be incompatible with the staff you have?

Q.-The staff has been cut down. At the end of last year, only a few months ago, I got rid of three of the oldest hands in the Treasury. While this extra work is on I have had to engage two extra men. I have shown a good saving in the Treasury--a saving of $5,000 at present.

Q.-To carry out these checks, this balancing of the different lists, would it be necessary to have an increased staff?

A.--I should like to think over that, and see what the amount of work really was. The Chairman.-This is what we propose. That the Rent Roll should be very much simplified. All you want is a column with the name and the Lut, another for the amount to be received, a column for the date of payment and another for the amount received. You would not want anything for arrears or anything of that kind. At the end of the third month after the amount became due a notice might be inserted in the Gazette calling upon debtors to pay up their Crown rent. At the end of the fourth month another notice stating that if the Crown rent in arrear is not paid up within one month the bills will be handed over to the Crown Solicitor. At the end of the fifth month you would be able to say very nearly what the total amount of arrears was and at the end of the sixth month the book ought to be closed. You would say

"We ought to have received so much, we have received so much, the difference is accounted for by so-and-so not having paid." The list of arrears would be sent to the Crown Solicitor, the book would be closed and a new one opened. Then there would be no complications of arrears at all. It would not take a clerk very long to do that. are a great many columns that he ought to add up every day.

There

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A.-There is no intention that with the new staff there shall be any delay. books can be balanced within reasonable time.

The

Q. In the same way with the licences, a book should be kept of all licences issued with the date of payment and balanced.

*

A.--Yes.

Q.-Did Mr. Carvalho ever say anything to you about Mr. Lister's order directing that receipts should be signed by the clerks in charge instead of being signed by Mr. Carvalho or the Treasurer?

A.—Mr. Lister's instructions were submitted to me within three or four days of my entering the Treasury and I directed that no change should be made, at any rate for the present.

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