HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2865 OFFICIAL RECORD OF PROCEEDINGS
Wednesday, 21 April 1993
The Council met at half-past Two o'clock
PRESENT
THE PRESIDENT
THE HONOURABLE JOHN JOSEPH SWAINE, C.B.E., LL.D., Q.C., J.P.
THE CHIEF SECRETARY
THE HONOURABLE SIR DAVID ROBERT FORD, K.B.E., L.V.O., J.P.
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY
THE HONOURABLE YEUNG KAI-YIN, C.B.E., J.P.
THE ATTORNEY GENERAL
THE HONOURABLE JEREMY FELL MATHEWS, C.M.G., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE ALLEN LEE PENG-FEI, C.B.E., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE STEPHEN CHEONG KAM-CHUEN, C.B.E., J.P. THE HONOURABLE MRS SELINA CHOW LIANG SHUK-YEE, O.B.E., J.P. THE HONOURABLE HUI YIN-FAT, O.B.E., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE MARTIN LEE CHU-MING, Q.C., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE NGAI SHIU-KIT, O.B.E., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE PANG CHUN-HOI, M.B.E.
THE HONOURABLE SZETO WAH
THE HONOURABLE TAM YIU-CHUNG
THE HONOURABLE ANDREW WONG WANG-FAT, O.B.E., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE EDWARD HO SING-TIN, O.B.E., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE RONALD JOSEPH ARCULLI, J.P.
THE HONOURABLE MARTIN GILBERT BARROW, O.B.E., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE MRS PEGGY LAM, O.B.E., J.P.
2866 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 THE HONOURABLE MRS MIRIAM LAU KIN-YEE, O.B.E., J.P. THE HONOURABLE LAU WAH-SUM, O.B.E., J.P.
DR THE HONOURABLE LEONG CHE-HUNG, O.B.E. THE HONOURABLE JAMES DAVID McGREGOR, O.B.E., I.S.O., J.P. THE HONOURABLE MRS ELSIE TU, C.B.E.
THE HONOURABLE PETER WONG HONG-YUEN, O.B.E., J.P. THE HONOURABLE ALBERT CHAN WAI-YIP
THE HONOURABLE VINCENT CHENG HOI-CHUEN THE HONOURABLE MOSES CHENG MO-CHI
THE HONOURABLE MARVIN CHEUNG KIN-TUNG, J.P. THE HONOURABLE CHEUNG MAN-KWONG
THE HONOURABLE CHIM PUI-CHUNG
REV THE HONOURABLE FUNG CHI-WOOD
THE HONOURABLE FREDERICK FUNG KIN-KEE
THE HONOURABLE TIMOTHY HA WING-HO, M.B.E., J.P. THE HONOURABLE MICHAEL HO MUN-KA
DR THE HONOURABLE HUANG CHEN-YA
THE HONOURABLE SIMON IP SIK-ON, J.P.
DR THE HONOURABLE LAM KUI-CHUN
DR THE HONOURABLE CONRAD LAM KUI-SHING THE HONOURABLE LAU CHIN-SHEK
THE HONOURABLE EMILY LAU WAI-HING
THE HONOURABLE LEE WING-TAT
THE HONOURABLE GILBERT LEUNG KAM-HO
THE HONOURABLE ERIC LI KA-CHEUNG, J.P.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2867 THE HONOURABLE FRED LI WAH-MING
THE HONOURABLE MAN SAI-CHEONG
THE HONOURABLE STEVEN POON KWOK-LIM
THE HONOURABLE HENRY TANG YING-YEN, J.P.
THE HONOURABLE TIK CHI-YUEN
THE HONOURABLE JAMES TO KUN-SUN
DR THE HONOURABLE SAMUEL WONG PING-WAI, M.B.E., J.P. DR THE HONOURABLE PHILIP WONG YU-HONG
DR THE HONOURABLE YEUNG SUM
THE HONOURABLE ZACHARY WONG WAI-YIN
DR THE HONOURABLE TANG SIU-TONG, J.P.
THE HONOURABLE ROGER LUK KOON-HOO
THE HONOURABLE ANNA WU HUNG-YUK
ABSENT
THE HONOURABLE DAVID LI KWOK-PO, O.B.E., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE LAU WONG-FAT, O.B.E., J.P.
THE HONOURABLE HOWARD YOUNG, J.P.
THE HONOURABLE CHRISTINE LOH KUNG-WAI
IN ATTENDANCE
MR MICHAEL LEUNG MAN-KIN, C.B.E., J.P.
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT
THE HONOURABLE JOHN CHAN CHO-CHAK, L.V.O., O.B.E., J.P. SECRETARY FOR EDUCATION AND MANPOWER
MR ALISTAIR PETER ASPREY, O.B.E., A.E., J.P.
SECRETARY FOR SECURITY
2868 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
MRS ELIZABETH WONG CHIEN CHI-LIEN, I.S.O., J.P. SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE
MR ANTHONY GORDON EASON, J.P.
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS
MR MICHAEL DAVID CARTLAND, J.P.
SECRETARY FOR FINANCIAL SERVICES
MRS ELIZABETH MARGARET BOSHER, J.P.
SECRETARY FOR ECONOMIC SERVICES
MR LEUNG CHIN-MAN, J.P.
SECRETARY FOR CONSTITUTIONAL AFFAIRS
THE CLERK TO THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL
MR CLETUS LAU KWOK-HONG
THE DEPUTY CLERK TO THE LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL MR PATRICK CHAN NIM-TAK
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2869 Papers
The following papers were laid on the table pursuant to Standing Order 14(2): Subject
Subsidiary Legislation L.N. No.
Public Health and Municipal Services (Public
Pleasure Grounds) (Amendment of Fourth
Schedule) (No. 2) Order 1993 .............................................................. 98/93 Rules of the Supreme Court (Amendment) Rules 1993............................... 99/93
Food Business (Regional Council) Bylaws
(Exemption From Bylaw 31 (1)) Notice 1993...................................... 100/93
Food Business (Urban Council) Bylaws (Exemption
From Bylaw 32(1)) Notice 1993 .......................................................... 101/93
Television (Amendment) Ordinance 1993 (22 of
1993) (Commencement) Notice 1993................................................... 102/93
Building (Administration) (Amendment)
Regulation 1993 ................................................................................... 103/93
Building (Oil Storage Installations) (Amendment)
(No. 2) Regulation 1993....................................................................... 104/93
Antiquities and Monuments (Declaration of
Monument) Notice 1993....................................................................... 105/93
Employees Retraining Ordinance (Amendment of
Schedule 2) (No. 2) Notice 1993.......................................................... 106/93 Travel Agents (Amendment of Schedule) Notice 1993 ............................... 107/93
Commissioner for Administrative Complaints
Ordinance (Amendment of Schedule 1) Order
1993 (L.N. 97 of 1993) Corrigendum................................................... 108/93
Public Health and Municipal Services (Public
Markets) (Designation and Amendment of Tenth
Schedule) (No. 2) Order 1993 .............................................................. 109/93
2870 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
Declaration of Markets in the Regional Council Area
(Amendment) Declaration 1993 ........................................................... 110/93
Sessional Papers 1992-93
No. 69 — Mass Transit Railway Corporation
Annual Report 1992
No. 70 — Kowloon-Canton Railway Corporation
Annual Report 1992
No. 71 — Hospital Authority Annual Report 1991-1992
No. 72 — Report on the Samaritan Fund and Statements of
Accounts of the Samaritan Fund 1991-1992
with Certificate of the Director of Audit
Affirmation
Mr YEUNG Kai-yin made the Legislative Council Affirmation.
Addresses
Mass Transit Railway Corporation Annual Report 1992
FINANCIAL SECRETARY: Mr President, in accordance with section 16(4) of the Mass Transit Railway Corporation (MTRC) Ordinance, I table the Annual Report and Accounts of the Mass Transit Railway Corporation for the year ending 31 December 1992.
In 1992, the MTRC carried about 751 million passengers, 3.4% higher than 1991. Total revenue amounted to $3.99 billion, 12% higher than 1991. Total operating costs increased by 15% to $1.69 billion, mainly due to rising wages and railway maintenance costs. Interest and finance charges amounted to $1.31 billion, 10% less than 1991.
For the second consecutive year, the MTRC registered a net profit even without any contribution from property developments. The total net profit for the year was $403 million, compared with $67 million in 1991. This firmly places the Corporation on its way to eliminate accumulated losses, now reduced to $3.06 billion.
At the end of 1992, the Corporation's loans and finance liabilities stood at $18.4 billion. The year-end debt to equity ratio was 2.3 to 1. The MTRC is widely respected in the international financial community. The high credit
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2871
ratings enjoyed by the Corporation demonstrate confidence in the financial strength of the Corporation and its future plans.
The Corporation's results in 1992 are consistent with its long-term financial targets. Without an extension of the existing system, the Corporation expects to be able to retire all debts on existing loans by around the turn of the century.
Over the next five years, the MTRC has budgeted to spend $5 billion on major capital projects to upgrade the existing system through the provision of new facilities and application of modern technology. The Corporation is planning to improve the morning peak train service on the Tsuen Wan Line from the existing 30 train trips per hour to 31 some time this year, 32 in 1994 and 34 in 1996. Looking ahead, I am encouraged by the Corporation's commitment to enhancing the safety, efficiency and reliability of its services. The Corporation has made long-term plans to improve its service and to increase cost effectiveness and customer satisfaction. I also welcome the Corporation's regular publication of its performance targets and achievements.
Once agreement is reached with the Chinese side regarding the financing of the Airport Railway, and Finance Committee approval is obtained, the Corporation will be able to proceed with a project that affords much needed relief to the existing system and support for the new airport. All this will bring long-term benefits to Hong Kong.
Finally, I would like to thank the Chairman, the Board, and all staff of the MTRC for continuing to maintain high standards and achieve efficiency during the past year.
Kowloon-Canton Railway Corporation Annual Report 1992
FINANCIAL SECRETARY: Mr President, in accordance with section 14(5) of the Kowloon-Canton Railway Corporation ordinance, I table the annual report and accounts of the Kowloon-Canton Railway Corporation (KCRC) for the year ending 31 December 1992.
The Corporation continued to maintain a strong financial position in 1992. Operating revenue stood at $2.15 billion, an increase of 16.3% over 1991. Including income from property development, the net profit for the year was $526 million, 17% higher than 1991. A dividend of $150 million was paid to the Government after considering the Corporation's long-term cash flow requirements and investment needs. The dividend has had no effect on this year's fare revision. The fact that the Corporation has been able to pay a dividend to the Government reflects the confidence we have in the Corporation's financial strength. I would like to remind Members here that for a railway to be not just financially self-sufficient, but able to provide a modest return to its investor is rare in the world today, and is a tribute to the
2872 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
management of the Corporation. It is also a positive signal to future potential investors in Hong Kong's railway infrastructure.
At the end of 1992, the total assets of the Corporation stood at $6.7 billion, and borrowings at $894 million. The year-end debt to equity ratio was 1 to 5.1. Cash generated by the operating divisions was sufficient to cover ongoing capital expenditure and debt repayment.
The Kowloon-Canton Railway carried 198 million passengers in 1992, an increase of about 5% over 1991. Of these, 35 million travelled to and from Lo Wu, an increase of 13%. Through train traffic between Kowloon and Guangzhou rose by 8% to 2.7 million. A new through train service between Kowloon and Foshan was inaugurated in January this year.
Major improvements were made during the year to enhance customer services. Punctuality was improved, with a daily average of 95% and 98% of trains arriving on time for KCR and the Light Rail Transit System (LRT) respectively.
On the KCR, all trains were operated in 12-car sets, a new station entrance/exit was opened at Kowloon Tong and work began on additional entrances/exits at Fo Tan and Tai Wai stations. Under the escalator replacement programme, 17 new escalators have been installed at Kowloon, Fo Tan and Tai Po Market stations.
Inbound freight traffic faced keen competition resulting in a decline of 11% in inbound freight volume to 2.8 million tonnes. However, outbound freight increased by 14% to 1.2 million tonnes.
The Light Rail Transit System carried 106 million passengers in 1992, an increase of 10% over 1991. The three regional links in Tuen Mun were all commissioned by February 1992. LRT service was further extended to Tin Shui Wai in January this year. Nine of the 30 new vehicles were added to the fleet during 1992, and all 30 new vehicles will have been put into service by August this year. The programme to upgrade vehicle air-conditioning was completed early this year.
Over the next five years, the Corporation plans to invest a further $5.3 billion in infrastructure and service improvements. Major projects include redeveloping the Ho Tung Lau Depot and Maintenance Centre to provide better maintenance and more stabling area for the KCR fleet; improving the signalling system and station facilities; expanding the Kowloon Goods Yard for better cargo handling; and providing noise abatement facilities. This substantial investment clearly demonstrates the Corporation's continued commitment to upgrading its systems to provide high quality customer services.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2873
To conclude, the Corporation has continued to operate successfully. I would like to thank the Chairman, the Managing Board, the management and the staff of the Corporation for their hard work and achievements in the past year.
Hospital Authority Annual Report 1991-1992
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, I am pleased to introduce the Hospital Authority Annual Report for the year ending 31 March 1992.
Between the bright blue covers of this Annual Report is the record of a major breakthrough in the history of healthcare development in Hong Kong. With the setting up of Hospital Authority as an independent statutory body, all public hospitals hitherto operating under two systems are now integrated to facilitate the introduction of management reforms.
The work of the Hospital Authority in the reporting period can be classified into three broad areas: the setting up of a new corporate infrastructure to support 37 000 employees from 16 different organizations, the preparation for management transfer of 36 public hospitals and 56 specialist institutions, and the planning of clinical service improvements.
In order to establish a corporate infrastructure capable of assuming effective control of the various institutions under its common management, the Hospital Authority has successfully developed a new unified system catering for personnel, accounting and procurement functions. A great deal of time and efforts have been dedicated to achieve management transfer and reforms.
Crucial to the smooth transition was the co-operation between the Government and the Hospital Authority on details of financial arrangements, operational relationships and the unified remuneration package for all existing staff working in public hospitals. As at 31 March 1992, 54% of the 34 000 eligible staff had opted for Hospital Authority employment terms, including 93% of former subvented hospital staff and 30% of civil servants.
A determined start has been made on management reforms through the identification of eight candidate hospitals for the introduction of these reforms and the setting up of Hospital Governing Committees to enhance community participation in public hospital management. Additionally, a comprehensive strategy has been formulated for the long-term development and application of information technology to improve the effectiveness and efficiency of service delivery.
The past year has been a productive and dynamic one for the Hospital Authority. However, much remains to be done to prepare our public hospital system for the challenges posed by an ageing population, for example, rapid advancement in medical technology and rising consumer expectations. Through
2874 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
greater community participation and public accountability, the Authority will be able to respond swiftly to changing community needs and deploy resources with flexibility to those areas of need.
I would like to congratulate the Chairman, Sir S Y CHUNG, and members of the Hospital Authority and their staff on their achievements in the past year. I also thank Honourable Members in this Council and the general public for their invaluable support for our mission to improve the quality of patient care in Hong Kong.
Oral answers to questions
Senior Citizens Day
1. MR HUI YIN-FAT asked (in Cantonese): In order to show our appreciation of the elderly's contribution to the community and to promote greater public respect for the aged, will the Government consider designating as "Senior Citizens Day" the third Sunday of November each year, that is the day on which the traditional "Festival for the Elderly" has been held annually by the voluntary social service agencies in the past 14 years?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, there is a discernible trend of increasing awareness within the community to promote greater respect for elderly citizens. Non-governmental organizations have been organizing a "Festival for the Elderly" on the third Sunday of November for many, many years. The Administration's policy is to encourage the organization of such community involvement projects so as to promote respect for elderly citizens.
On many special occasions, for example, Valentine's Day, Mother's Day, Father's Day and Children's Day, programmes are organized to celebrate the meaning of love and respect. We feel that to do the same for elderly citizens is highly appropriate. Since, in practice, the "Festival for the Elderly" has for many years been falling on the third Sunday of November, the marking of a "Senior Citizens Day" is a befitting expression of the community's recognition of the contribution made by elderly citizens. The Administration will continue to support non-governmental organizations to organize activities on this meaningful occasion.
MR HUI YIN-FAT (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary indicates in her reply that the marking of a "Senior Citizens Day" on the third Sunday of November is a benefitting expression of the community's recognition of the contribution made by elderly citizens. Will the Administration inform this Council whether that would mean it has agreed and accepted that the third
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2875 Sunday of November be designated as "Senior Citizens Day" from now onwards?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, it is considered that declaration of a Senior Citizens Day is chiefly to arouse public attention; that being so, it need not be declared separately as a statutory day. It is somehow similar, for example, to the Smokeout Day of 31 May, the World Health Day of 7 April and the Environmental Protection Day of 5 June and the World AIDS Day of 1 December. The question of statutory declaration does not arise. I believe different countries adopt different days to honour senior citizens; for example, I believe, in Japan, they have adopted 15 September as its Senior Citizens Day — which happens also to be my birthday — but, in Hong Kong, the festival for the elderly is annually held on the third Sunday of November. Now, reasons for this choice are manifold; for example, during that time of the year the weather is normally very fine and academic examinations are fewer such that more students can free themselves for volunteer service. It is agreed that the third Sunday of November can be appropriately described as the Senior Citizens Day. In so saying, I would like to suggest that our respect and love for elderly citizens should be always in our hearts and minds and not specifically confined to a particular day.
MR TAM YIU-CHUNG (in Cantonese): Mr President, for the purpose of arousing public attention and to show our appreciation of the elderly for their contribution, will the Government further consider designating the "Senior Citizens Day" a statutory holiday?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, I think Hong Kong's reputation is manifold, one notable feature being its hardworking people. It is a place full of workaholics, one can say. Another feature is that Hong Kong is also a place known for its many, many different holidays. If one looks up the Holidays Ordinance (Cap. 149) one will find a very impressive schedule — a handsome list, so to speak — of holidays which combine both western holidays and eastern holidays and those that come in between. So, we are one of the few places in the world with so many holidays. As I said in reply to an earlier supplementary by the Honourable HUI Yin-fat, the declaration of a day is mainly to arouse public attention and it does not need to be statutory. The declaration of a holiday, however, does require statutory declaration by way of an amendment to the schedule of the relevant Ordinance. And I think that any statutory declaration should not be lightly considered or lightly agreed.
MR FREDERICK FUNG (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary suggests that our respect and love for elderly citizens should be always in our hearts and minds. I think that is an important consideration. Furthermore, as mentioned in the second paragraph of the reply, non-governmental organizations have been
2876 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
providing a lot of services to the elderly, and I consider that equally important. My question is: if the Government is in support of a "Senior Citizens Day", will it give some substantive support such as increasing the subvention to social centres for the elderly from the present 75% to 100%, the same as that given to youth centres?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, the festival for the elderly has received subvention since 1991-92; for example, $231,000 and $137,000 were provided by the Social Welfare Department specifically for the organization of activities for the elderly to mark that particular Sunday. Any funding for any other form of support must be carefully considered, properly justified and will be considered in the normal course, if given priority.
MRS PEGGY LAM (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary has said that the Government greatly supports the "Senior Citizens Day" but that would not be in a form of monetary support. May I ask the Secretary what other actions the Government has in mind to show its support for the "Senior Citizens Day"?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, support for respecting the elderly in our community is not confined to the Government. It should be in the hearts and minds of every single person in the community; the community will make up the whole structure of societal support. We will do what we can in the Government but we have certain procedures in terms of funding. If Members would like to have a project funded by the Government then they are free to put up a proposal and let us consider it in due course.
MR WONG WAI-YIN (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary reiterated in her reply that the Administration would encourage and support non-governmental organizations to do the job. We can see that they have already done a lot on this and in fact many families are going out with the elderly for tea on that particular day. Just now Mrs Peggy LAM also raised the question of funding support. Will the Administration seriously consider what sort of initiative it will take in support of the "Senior Citizens Day" or the "Festival for the Elderly" rather than just giving verbal support? I said this because there had been actual efforts made by the Health and Welfare Branch and the Social Welfare Department in addressing the mentally retarded issue recently.
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, I think I have covered that in my answers to earlier supplementaries. Community support for the elderly is neither confined to the money spent nor confined to government support alone. It must rest in the hearts and minds of the people who respect the elderly. If there are projects where support is sought, then the Social
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2877
Welfare Department and the Health and Welfare Branch will be happy to entertain applications, consider them and allocate funds accordingly when given the right priority.
MR JIMMY McGREGOR: Mr President, will the Government do everything possible to persuade all public transport companies and private sector entertainment companies to reduce or eliminate their charges and fees for senior citizens? And will the Government set up an appropriate committee for this purpose?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, we will continue to do our best. The introduction of various transport concessions is a manifestation of the support from the community, with such concessions cleared with the Government through various channels. The other day we were talking about the idea of issuing a card to elderly persons. The Administration has undertaken to examine the feasibility of implementing this idea, but again, the card is only a card, unless it has overall community support.
Zhuhai-Tuen Mun bridge
2. MS ANNA WU asked: Will the Government inform this Council whether its consent and co-operation had been sought on the proposed construction of a bridge connecting Zhuhai and Tuen Mun before the plans were reported in the press, and the steps it is taking to ensure that authorities in China understand that Hong Kong's agreement has to be obtained before such projects can be carried out both before and after 1997?
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, we have not received any proposal from the Chinese authorities for the construction of a bridge connecting Zhuhai and Tuen Mun. Clearly such a bridge could not be built without the agreement of the Hong Kong Government or the SAR Government after 30 June 1997. This is understood by the Chinese authorities.
MS ANNA WU: Mr President, I thank the Secretary for a very short answer and to compensate for that, subject to you permission, Mr President, I would like to ask a long supplementary question. In view of the need for co-operation and co-ordination between southern China and Hong Kong in the region's development, has the Government taken any step to seek information on the matter? And would the Secretary provide details on the channels of communication for matters of this type generally and the level of contact involved, such as whether it is through the central government or the provincial authorities?
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PRESIDENT: It is a very broad question on a very narrow original question. Do you have the answer for this, Secretary?
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, I will try to answer that. There is at present a formal liaison channel between Hong Kong and China on border matters. There is an annual full liaison meeting between Hong Kong and the border authorities in China plus quarterly meetings on transport matters between the two territories. These cover a wide range of cross border issues such as infrastructure, customs, immigration and other matters of mutual benefit and concern. In addition, there have been numerous exchanges of visits throughout the year. If I recall correctly, there were over 100 delegations from Hong Kong and China at various levels, both formal and informal, which served the purpose of exchanging information and ideas to each other's benefit. I am sure these can continue to develop. I cannot of course give full details on each and every one of these but I can supply that in writing if Miss WU so wishes.
MR STEVEN POON (in Cantonese): Mr President, situated to the east of the mouth of the Pearl River, Hong Kong has a certain economic role to play in relation to the cities on the east coast of the Pearl River, and in return has obtained economic benefits from them. But for the cities on the western coast, as there is the River that separates the two lands, Hong Kong has really only very little to offer to them. So it follows that the economic gains from them are also very small. In view of this geographical factor, does the Administration consider that a high speed bridge connecting Zhuhai and Hong Kong will bring enormous benefits to Hong Kong's economy; if so, will the Administration take the initiative to discuss the issue with the Chinese authorities concerned?
PRESIDENT: Are we talking about the same bridge, Mr POON? (Laughter) MR STEVEN POON: Yes, Mr President.
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, an overall long-term plan for Hong Kong's future development is in place. This is covered by the Territorial Development Strategy under the Secretary for Planning, Environment and Lands. Development covers a wide range of options for future integration of transport and land use planning in Hong Kong and its neighbouring territories. The Administration is always conscious of the fact that we must keep ourselves fully informed of developments in the Pearl River Delta and beyond and we must take the information into account when updating our assessment of Hong Kong's infrastructural requirements. So I am sure Mr POON's point is very well taken by the Administration.
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MR ALBERT CHAN (in Cantonese): Mr President, will the Administration inform this Council what has been done since the announcement of the plan for the Zhuhai bridge to find out the details about the plan; and how it will ensure that there is good co-ordination in respect of the roads in the area concerned and the infrastructural development in Tuen Mun and the northwest New Territories when the bridge is built?
PRESIDENT: The first part of the question is clearly in order; the second part may be hypothetical. But if you have a problem, please let me know, Secretary.
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, we have not, as I said before, received any official proposals from the Chinese authorities. If I again recall correctly, we have heard from press reports that such a proposal was made by the Zhuhai authorities. It has not yet proceeded to the provincial level even for endorsement or consideration. So we believe that it would be premature for the Hong Kong Government to raise any proposal with the Chinese at this stage. As and when the Chinese authorities are ready to raise it with us, we will be very happy to listen to them on this particular project and the details concerned.
MR MICHAEL HO (in Cantonese): Mr President, the construction of the Zhuhai bridge may have positive or negative effects on the economic and transport situations of the western New Territories, but the Secretary said just now that it would be premature to raise any proposal with the Chinese authorities at this stage. Meanwhile, is the Administration going to seek more information from the Chinese authorities?
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, I think I have said that because the proposals from the local authorities in Zhuhai are no more than preliminary, it would not be proper for the Hong Kong Government to raise the matter with the Chinese authorities at the present stage. Having said that, we are always open to any ideas put to us through various channels and I believe such channels are open at the moment and we did receive some preliminary ideas from the individuals concerned. But at this stage I cannot say how far these ideas are authorized; so I cannot comment on such ideas.
MR TAM YIU-CHUNG (in Cantonese): Mr President, will the Administration tentatively assess whether there is any technical difficulty in building such a bridge at the location concerned and whether such a plan is feasible?
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, as I said, I think that we have not got the details. So I cannot really comment on what is likely or not likely to happen. But generally speaking, when considering this project, even as a
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concept, we must consider the transport and land use implications for Hong Kong in general and the western New Territories in particular. But until and unless we receive such details, I really cannot speculate on the implications.
DR CONRAD LAM (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary has many years of experience in this regard. I would like to know what the priority of the construction of this bridge will be when compared with the priorities of the existing projects of the Administration, particularly in the light of competing demands for our limited resources?
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, I wish to thank Dr LAM for his compliment on my experience in transport. I cannot, however, reciprocate by being more forthcoming in replying to his question. As I said earlier, I have not got the details and I cannot speculate on the priority of this project in relation to Hong Kong's own priorities.
MR LEE WING-TAT (in Cantonese): Mr President, it is a very surprising move of the Zhuhai authorities to announce unilaterally the construction of the Zhuhai bridge, because if every province and county announces its plan to construct a bridge to Hong Kong, Hong Kong will then be like a centipede with many "legs". Does the Administration consider this a strange and sudden move? Will the Administration take this up with the Joint Liaison Group or the Border Liaison Group, and express our wish that there will be discussions with the Hong Kong Government before the Chinese side makes any official announcement?
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, the question of whether and why the proposal was made should be addressed to the one who made the proposal, not to the Hong Kong Government. Really, I cannot comment on the implications underlying this particular proposal. We will of course be happy to listen, as I said before, and then to consider as and when we receive a proposal.
PRESIDENT: I do not think that was the question though, Secretary. I think the question was: Will this be brought up at the Joint Liaison Group or the joint border meetings?
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: Mr President, as I said, we have not yet raised this issue, because the issue as reported in the press was only a local level issue raised by Zhuhai. It has not even proceeded to the provincial level for consideration or endorsement. So, it would be improper for the Hong Kong Government to raise this matter on an official level.
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PRESIDENT: I think the question was: Is the policy of unilateral announcements something which the Hong Kong Government will take up with the Chinese authorities? Is that right?
SECRETARY FOR TRANSPORT: I am not sure, Mr President, that we can stop anyone from making announcements to the press about their ideas. I do not think that this is a matter which it will be appropriate for us to raise in the Joint Liaison Group.
Seafood contamination
3. MR STEVEN POON asked (in Cantonese): In view of recent reports from various sources revealing that the seafood available in Hong Kong is contaminated, with shell-fish containing excessive levels of Escherichia coli and heavy metal and that some fishmongers and restaurants may even be keeping marine fish in contaminated sea water, will the Government inform this Council:
(a) whether extensive and systematic tests are being conducted on a regular basis to ensure that all kinds of seafood for daily consumption of the general public meet the food safety standards;
(b) whether it is an offence to keep fish for consumption in unclean sea water, if so, what penalties can be imposed for such an offence and whether prosecution can be instantly initiated against the fishmongers and restaurants concerned, whether consideration will be given to strengthening inspection and introducing heavier penalties; and
(c) if the above practice does not constitute an offence, whether consideration will be given to amending the relevant legislation so that the authorities can prosecute the persons concerned?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, the Hygiene Division of the Department of Health conducts a food surveillance programme on foodstuffs including seafood. Food samples are taken from various wholesale and retail outlets and points of import for laboratory examination. The tests include bacteriological examination for total bacterial count, faecal coliform and food poisoning organisms, chemical analysis for heavy metals, and toxicity test for biotoxins.
At present there is no legislation to regulate the use of seawater for keeping live fish in restaurants or by fishmongers in the market place. The operation of any food business is governed by the Public Health and Municipal Services Ordinance and an operator of any food business is required to obtain a
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licence from either one of the municipal councils before he conducts business. It is an offence to sell food unfit for human consumption. Both the Food Business (Urban Council) Bylaws and the Food Business (Regional Council) Bylaws also require persons engaged in the food business to take all necessary steps to protect the food from risk of contamination. The two Food Business Bylaws also prohibit collection of shellfish, for sale for human consumption purposes, in the waters of the Victoria Harbour, the harbour of Aberdeen, Kwai Chung and Tsuen Wan bays. The two municipal services departments ensure that food business operators comply with the relevant statutory provisions and licensing conditions governing their business.
Live fish, live animals and live birds as well are not defined as food in law. Only after killing and other processing does it become food intended for human consumption. At that point, common food controls apply. The keeping of live fish in restaurants and the market place is relevant to the environmental hygiene aspect which is looked after by the two municipal services departments. They have taken active steps to advise seafood restaurant operators and seafood sellers not to draw seawater from suspected sources for use in fish tanks. A code of practice on shellfish hygiene to guard against contamination of shellfish in wet storage has been also distributed to food handlers.
To ensure food safety, the Department of Health and two municipal services departments organize regular education programmes on good hygiene practice for general public as well as food handlers. Good personal, environmental and food hygiene, such as thorough cleansing and cooking of food before consumption, is no less important than carrying out sample tests on food in ensuring food safety.
MR STEVEN POON (in Cantonese): Mr President, a lot of Hong Kong people of our age used to swim in the New Territories when they were young. When our mother taught us how to swim, she invariably told us: "You must go under water if you want to learn swimming and you must have drunk several mouthfuls of sea water before you can swim well!" Today the waters of Hong Kong are extremely contaminated. We no longer dare take our children and grandchildren to the sea for a swim, not to mention telling them to drink a few mouthfuls of sea water. Therefore when we saw on television that some bad guys were collecting water from the sea and delivered them by truck to restaurants for the purpose of keeping live fish, we were totally shocked. May I ask the Administration if it is possible to introduce legislation to provide for water being used for keeping live fish in restaurants must be taken from waters far offshore, for example, to the east of Hong Kong or in the vicinity of Ninepin Group to the south, and whether it will consider allowing only approved contractors to undertake such a task?
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SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, as far as I am aware, there is no international standard regulating the quality of water in fish tanks. However, as regards whether or not there should be legislation or bylaws or other codes of practice, I would duly refer Members' concern to the municipal councils and related departments. As regards protection of water quality in general, I believe discharges of effluents in water control zones are strictly controlled under the Water Pollution Ordinance via a licensing scheme administered by the Director of Environmental Protection. At present, over 90% of the territory's waters have been declared water control zones. Two more water control zones will be declared this year with the final one, which is Victoria Harbour, scheduled to be declared in phases by 1997. The Government has also embarked on a comprehensive sewerage improvement programme to ensure that all significant effluents can be collected, treated and properly disposed of. I believe also that the Director of Environmental Protection is also empowered under the Waste Disposal Ordinance to control the disposal of waste. Enforcement of the legislation in relation to livestock waste, however, is held in abeyance in most areas pending completion of a review of the Livestock Waste Control Scheme by the Government. In brief, Mr President, I share the Honourable Member's concern.
PRESIDENT: Is there a part of your question not answered, Mr POON?
MR STEVEN POON: Mr President, I take it that the Secretary would refer that to the two Councils and I just accept that answer. But really, my question was: Would regulations be set up to ensure that water from a clean sea is delivered into Hong Kong for putting in a fish tank? Anyway I will accept that the Secretary will put it to the municipal souncils for consideration. Thank you.
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, yes.
DR TANG SIU-TONG (in Cantonese): Mr President, at present surveillance on seafood is conducted by the Department of Health in conjunction with the two municipal councils. May I ask if there are organizations making comments that cause panic, will they be held legally responsible?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, I am not aware of any organization causing any panic. What I am aware of is that the Department of Health acts as a hygiene advisor for the two municipal councils in enforcing food safety under the Public Health and Municipal Services Ordinance. It conducts food surveillance programmes on food samples collected from the wholesale and retail outlets and points of entry. The health inspectorate of the two municipal councils also monitors the operation of various organizations and these three agencies work hand in hand.
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DR HUANG CHEN-YA (in Cantonese): Mr President, although we have laws on food inspection to ensure food safety, will there be practical difficulties in implementation? Will the Administration inform this Council of the number of vendors that were prosecuted for selling fish unfit for human consumption over the past year, and whether the contamination or poisoning is caused by bacteria, cyanide or others?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, as regards fish, perhaps I could cite some statistics for 1992. A total of 231 samples of fish and fish products had been taken under General Food Surveillance Programme for analysis. About 5% of the sample sent for bacteriological testing and about 4% of sample sent for chemical analysis were found to be unsatisfactory. All tested samples passed the toxicity test. As regards shellfish, I refer to my reply to Question 13, which is my written reply in which I have described in some detail the levels of tests and samples we have taken.
DR HUANG CHEN-YA: Mr President, I was asking whether any of these people who sold fish that failed the test were actually prosecuted.
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, I think prosecution will be taken as a matter of course but whether it is specifically related either to food poisoning or samples taken in restaurants requires a written reply. I do not have the statistics in hand. But certainly where there are reasons to suspect food poisoning and contravention of the law, action is taken very swiftly. I think, off the cuff, there were five prosecution cases and I think in my written reply to Question No.13 I gave a range of fines of between $600 and $5,000. But I do not know whether that in itself is sufficient answer to Dr HUANG's question. If not, I would be supplementing that with a further written reply. (Annex I)
MRS ELSIE TU: Mr President, is the Secretary aware that the Urban Council recently sponsored an investigation by the University of Hong Kong into the ill effects of this kind of water on fresh fish and that the result was negative — that is to say, there was no ill effect — and that further tests will soon be made on shellfish? If the Secretary was not aware of that, would she like to check on it?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President, I would like to check on it. I thank Mrs TU for this.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2885 Electric vehicles
4. MRS PEGGY LAM asked (in Cantonese): In order to further reduce the environmental pollution caused by exhaust gas from motor vehicles, will the Government inform this Council whether it would consider adopting vigorous measures to encourage members of the public to use power-driven vehicles instead, such as, reducing the First Registration Tax and licence fees for such vehicles?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, a four phase strategy to tackle vehicle emissions was laid down in the 1989 White Paper on Pollution. It included introducing unleaded petrol, requiring new light duty vehicles to meet the most advanced international emission standards, stepping up control of smoky vehicles and, if feasible, implementing measures aimed at reducing reliance on diesel engine vehicles.
In a recent review of the strategy, the need for the development of a broader approach to vehicle emission control has been identified. This includes recognition that the wider application of electric vehicles in Hong Kong could be one of the longer-term solutions to our vehicle emission problem. Mr President, I shall explain shortly why electric vehicles may be a longer-term solution.
The subject of electric vehicles and their possible use in Hong Kong is being examined by an interdepartmental working party convened by the Planning, Environment and Lands Branch. The working party is looking into areas such as the environmental benefits and energy efficiency of electric vehicles, their availability on the market, their suitability for use in Hong Kong's climate and topography, as well as measures to encourage their wider use. Ideas such as the reduction of first registration taxes, and licence fees, and so on are being considered. And the working party is aiming to submit its report to the Environmental Pollution Advisory Committee in June this year.
In the course of the working party's deliberations, it has become clear that, contrary to popular belief and despite recent work on electric vehicles in Europe and the United States, the electric vehicle option is still at the development stage. As most of the electric vehicles developed are still prototypes, there is only limited scope for considering such vehicles for practical use in Hong Kong at present. Nevertheless, we do see zero emission vehicles or the like as part of the long-term solution to Hong Kong's problem and we will continue to explore ways and means to bring about their use in Hong Kong.
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MRS PEGGY LAM (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary indicated that the use of electric vehicles might eventually help solve the environmental pollution problem. To our knowledge, some large organizations in Hong Kong, such as the China Light and Power Company, are using electric vehicles and the result is very satisfactory. May I ask the Administration if it would take the lead by purchasing some electric vehicles so as to encourage the use of such vehicles?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, there are registered or licensed, as at 31 March 1993, 46 electric vehicles in Hong Kong. One of these is a private car, six are goods vehicles operated by the China Light and Power Company and 39 are special purpose vehicles. They are, as I have said earlier, very much prototype vehicles and they are not available, as one might think, for commercial operation. As far as the Government taking a lead is concerned, on the recommendation of the Working Party on Electric Vehicles, a trial scheme is being considered for implementation shortly to replace one or two existing government vehicles, that are normally due to be replaced, by electric vehicles. The performance of these vehicles in operation will be closely monitored by the Government Land Transport Agency in order to evaluate their possible wider application within the Government.
MR VINCENT CHENG: Mr President, I refer to the first paragraph in the Secretary's reply relating to smoky vehicles. Could the Secretary inform this Council of the number of prosecutions the Government has taken against smoky vehicles over the last 12 months and its plans for reducing reliance on diesel engine vehicles?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, I do not have the statistics that Mr CHENG is seeking readily available but I think it will be quite a simple matter to make them available in writing. As far as other measures are concerned, the broad government policy on vehicle emission control to meet air quality objectives is, firstly, to reduce emissions from vehicles on the road by, for example, introducing inspection and maintenance requirements and converting small diesel vehicles to petrol uses — these measures are to some extent already in place and the question, of course, is whether inspections need to be more frequent and more stringent; secondly, to bring in as soon as practicable the most up-to-date international vehicle emission standards and we have so far kept up reasonably well with international vehicle emission standards and we propose to move forward as quickly as we can to keep up with such changes as will follow; thirdly, to facilitate the use of low emission vehicles, such as electric vehicles which I have already talked about at some length; and finally to manage and meet transport demand as far as possible by taking into account practical considerations and economic factors as well as the use of off-road types of transportation for passengers and freight.
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MR STEVEN POON (in Cantonese): Mr President, electric vehicle is not only environmental friendly but also a very quiet form of transport. If all the vehicles in Hong Kong are power-driven, they will in a way take away some of the noises from our overcrowded city. Furthermore, the batteries of such vehicle are charged at night and that makes the use of it more cost-effective. Will the Administration consider requiring the two power companies to allocate funds each year under the schemes of control for the purpose of promoting the use of electric vehicles in Hong Kong?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, may I respond by agreeing that this idea along with many other good ideas — and some of them not so good — will be put forward to the working party which I have described for consideration within the Government.
DR SAMUEL WONG: Mr President, using electric vehicles does not necessarily improve the environment since it merely shifts the air pollution problem individually at street level to the chimneys at the power stations centrally. Has the Administration carried out an environmental audit to ascertain that by using electric vehicles there would be a net environmental gain globally?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, the simple answer is that the Administration has not carried out such an audit. And indeed from my earlier remarks, I think it will be quite clear that the Administration does have regard to the prospect of the widespread introduction of electric vehicles in Hong Kong, replacing the existing vehicle fleet. The possibility of that being a rather a long-term option means that I believe we have sufficient time to consider the sort of idea which Dr WONG has raised.
MR MICHAEL HO (in Cantonese): Mr President, in the first paragraph of the Administration's reply it was mentioned that measures that were found to be feasible would be implemented, and then some other measures were also mentioned in a supplementary answer a while ago. Would the Administration inform this Council how the feasibility of such measures will be assessed and whether any feasibility studies are being carried out at the moment?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, all these matters are, as I think I have said, the subject of consideration by the working party which I mentioned. And the need for studies, should it arise, will be considered after the working party has itself studied matters. Feasibility studies and so on, of course, require funding and these would have to be placed in the priority assessments which we do every year for new projects which cost.
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DR LAM KUI-CHUN: Mr President, in conjunction with the last paragraph of the Government's reply which states that the working party considers electric vehicles being only prototypes at present, would the Administration inform this Council whether alternatives to electric vehicles are also being considered to reduce atmospheric pollution, such as kerosene driven vehicles that are widely used in South America?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, the working party is considering a very wide range of ideas and amongst these are, of course, ideas such as the replacement of diesel vehicles by petrol vehicles, electric vehicles and indeed the kerosene driven vehicles that have just been mentioned.
Urban renewal review
5. MR JAMES TO asked (in Cantonese): In response to a motion on Redevelopment of Private Buildings passed by this Council in July last year, the Government indicated in October that a review group had been set up to examine the urban renewal process with particular regard to the role of the Land Development Corporation and that the group would complete its initial task by the end of last year before the activities of private developers in the redevelopment process would be looked into. Will the Government inform this Council:
(a) why the review group has placed its emphasis on the Land Development Corporation instead of the private developers in the acquisition of buildings as referred to in the motion;
(b) whether the group has completed its initial task and when its preliminary report will be submitted to this Council; if not, why not; and
(c) whether a time schedule has been fixed for the review on the acquisition of buildings by private developers; if so, what the specific details are; and if not, why not?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, my answers to the seven parts of this question are as follows:
(a) The review currently being carried out of the Land Development Corporation's role and experience in the urban renewal process has focused on the Land Development Corporation (LDC) for two main reasons. First, it was decided before the motion was passed last July that such a review should be carried out to examine the problems experienced by the Corporation since it was set up in 1988. Second,
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we believe that the lessons which will be drawn from this review will be relevant in large measure to the operations of private developers other than the LDC. Although the Corporation's operations may be different from other private developers in some respects, it faces similar problems in such matters as land acquisition and dealing with owners and tenants affected by redevelopment. The Administration therefore believes that it should complete this review and draw conclusions which will have a bearing on future operations of the LDC as well as other developers. Thereafter, it can consider what other areas of study remain to be covered before continuing.
(b) The review group has not yet completed its work. Because the subject is a complex one, the review has taken longer to complete than originally envisaged. We are now aiming to complete it by the middle of this year. Any changes in policy relating to the LDC in particular or to urban renewal or redevelopment in general which may emerge from the review will be made public rather than being submitted formally to this Council.
(c) Because of the way we are approaching the current review, which I have already explained, no time schedule has yet been set for the possible review of the processes through which private developers carry out redevelopment.
MR JAMES TO (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary has mentioned just now that the operations of the Land Development Corporation and most private developers are more or less alike when it comes to redevelopment procedures and approaches. May I ask why more emphasis has not been placed on redevelopment by private developers as they account for the majority of redevelopments in the territory? Is the Administration trying to delay the review to the extent that it is disinclined to even set a time schedule, thus driving the residents to the wall? We know that development is in full swing now; may I ask if the Administration intends to stall the matter until it has driven all the residents affected onto streets or into bedspace apartments and until all the buildings have been demolished, so that the whole matter will naturally come to an end and the whole review is then complete?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, I think the simple answer to Mr TO's direct questions in all cases is no. We do not intend to delay and I think what I have said in my main answer indicates that not only are we not delaying but we have in fact adjusted the target of our review to try to take aboard some of the considerations and problems as regards private developers which have been raised with us over the past year or so in the context of the review which we have already started in
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respect of the Land Development Corporation and the urban renewal process that it is engaged in.
MR ALBERT CHAN (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary has mentioned in his reply that the focus of the review is on the Land Development Corporation, and I think that would be too narrow in scope. In reviewing the question of urban renewal, will reference be made to certain cases in the past? (For example, in the case of Hoi Pa Resite Village in Tsuen Wan, the Government invoked the Crown Lands Resumption Ordinance to resume land and then put it under public auction.) Has the Government drawn any lesson from such incidents? As redevelopment will lead to a host of problems different in nature, should the scope of review be extended? Could the Administration assure us that such incidents will not recur in future?
PRESIDENT: I think your question goes outside the main question and answer, Mr CHAN. Would you like to rephrase it?
MR ALBERT CHAN (in Cantonese): Mr President, my question is on redevelopment which involves private interests in lands and therefore it should come under the review on redevelopment of private buildings. Just now I cited the case of Hoi Pa Resite Village to illustrate that there are a lot of problems encountered in the process of land resumption and to explain the reasons for the delay in the hope that the Administration will take the past incidents into consideration and conduct a comprehensive review on redevelopment. Will the Administration enlarge the scope of the review, taking into account different experiences and circumstances so as to better serve the needs of the residents concerned?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, perhaps I should begin by pointing out that the case to which Mr CHAN referred is not a case of urban renewal. It is a case of new town development and it is related to the resumption of land for such development. I think I have already said in my main response that the extent of the review which began in relation to the experiences of the Land Development Corporation has already been, in effect, extended to take account of the experiences which will relate not only to the operations of the Land Development Corporation but to redevelopment and urban renewal undertaken by private developers. And I believe that that review, which is already a good way down the track, will give us a great deal of information as to how we should proceed and I think that it would be counter productive and likely to cause delay if we were further to change the terms of reference of that review.
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MR CHIM PUI-CHUNG (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Secretary stressed in his reply that the review group has not completed its work. Continual criticisms and adverse comments from the public since the inception of the Corporation in 1988 is sufficient proof that its operations warrant review. Will the Administration look at the Crown Lands Resumption Ordinance (Cap 124) again and amend it accordingly?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, I think insofar as this review is related to the effect of the Crown Lands Resumption Ordinance, if the review produces recommendations that that Ordinance should be amended, then the Administration will put those recommendations to this Council.
MR MAN SAI-CHEONG (in Cantonese): Mr President, since the supply of private flats is dependent upon factors like government's land supply, the smoothness of the resumption process and the number of redeveloped units produced by private developers, will the Administration conduct an in-depth review on the adequacy of current policies and legislation so that due regard is paid to the needs of our economy and the community at large?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, as far as the relative importance of government land and land produced by private developers is concerned, I think it is interesting to note that in the three-year period from 1989-90 to 1991-92 land exchanges and lease modifications which are in effect largely redevelopment cases produced 69 hectares of land. During the same period land for the same sort of development produced and disposed of by the Government through the land disposal programmes was 28 hectares. In the same period, or roughly the same period, approximately 50 000 flats were produced through redevelopment and these were produced in exchange for just over 8 000 flats which were demolished and on the basis of a rough indication of 3.5 persons per flat. Whereas just under 30 000 people were displaced, almost 190 000 people were reaccommodated so that I think, in considering the arrangements for urban renewal and redevelopment, we should not lose sight of the fact that these processes are extremely important in maintaining the supply of new accommodation for our community.
Decoration contractors approved by Housing Department
6. MR PANG CHUN-HOI asked (in Cantonese): Under the Housing Department's present system of using approved decoration contractors to carry out pre-occupation decoration for tenants of newly completed public housing estates, there are complaints from time to time that tenants who choose to carry out decoration work by themselves are subject to harassment and intimidation
2892 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 by approved contractors or their agents. Will the Government inform this Council of:
(a) what improvement measures will be taken to overcome such problems faced by tenants; and
(b) what measures will be taken to ensure the integrity of the contractors and that they respect the tenants' right to carry out decoration by themselves?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, it was indeed to combat criminal activity relating to decoration work in new housing estates that the Housing Authority, with the co-operation of the police and the ICAC, introduced the approved decoration contractor system in 1982. Under this system, the Housing Authority maintains an approved list of such contractors. Only contractors on the list or tenants themselves are allowed to carry out decoration work in new estates.
Contractors on the approved list are required to supply the names and other particulars of their subcontractors and employees to the Housing Department for transmission to the police for detailed screening. Before signing a contract with the Housing Authority, contractors are clearly advised that tenants are free to decorate their flats themselves and must not be coerced to use the services of a contractor. As well as non-compliance with contract conditions, evidence of criminal activities in procuring work will result in termination of contract, suspension of eligibility to tender for a specified period, or removal from the approved list.
To date, there have been no confirmed cases of an approved contractor or his employees being involved in harassment. According to a survey commissioned by the Housing Authority in early 1992, 53% of the public housing tenants decorated their own flats or were assisted by their relatives to do so. The survey also showed that 2% of tenants in new housing estates claimed to have been intimidated or harassed by triad elements during the decoration period. No connection between these cases of harassment and approved contractors or their employees has been established.
The Housing Authority will continue to monitor the work and behaviour of approved contractors rigorously. In addition, the police are alert to the need to strengthen their ground patrols and surveillance during new flat intake periods.
All complaints and reports of criminal activity are investigated. Public housing tenants are advised during intake briefings to report to the police any incidents of harassment. This message is reinforced in newsletters, notices and information handouts.
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The Housing Department is currently reviewing the existing arrangements and practices under the approved decoration contractor system to identify possible areas of improvement. This review will take into account tenants' comments on the system and should take about three months to complete.
MR PANG CHUN-HOI (in Cantonese): Mr President, the Housing Authority has noted that during the new flats intake period, some tenants are intimidated or harassed by undesirable elements in respect of decoration works to be carried out. The contractor or sub-contractor and his employees of course have their part to play and which is to provide information to the police. But may I ask the Secretary whether provisions can be made to require the police or the Housing Authority to issue to approved contractors or sub-contractors identity cards bearing the names and photos of their employees so as to prevent harassment by triads in new housing estates?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, I am not, of course, clear as to whether the provision of the sort of information in recorded details which Mr PANG is suggesting is feasible or would help. But I am certainly happy to put the idea forward to the Housing Authority for consideration in its current review.
DR TANG SIU-TONG (in Cantonese): Mr President, in the third paragraph of the main reply, the Secretary mentioned that the survey showed that 2% of tenants in new housing estates were harassed and that there was no connection with approved contractors in these cases. May I ask the Administration how many of these cases have led to prosecution by the police and the reasons for saying that there was no connection with approved contractors?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, taking the second part of the question first, what I have said is that no connection has been established. In other words, there has been no proof of a connection and as far as I am aware from the material and statistics available to me, there have been no successful prosecutions as a result of tenants reporting intimidation or harassment. But I would like to check that particular piece of information and advise Dr TANG of the outcome of that as soon as I can in writing.
PRESIDENT: Perhaps the Secretary for Security may be able to help.
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SECRETARY FOR SECURITY: Yes, Mr President. Perhaps I could say that the police do not keep statistics of offences specifically related to harassment in the case of decoration. That is not a category of offence that is listed. The police do obviously have statistics relating to intimidation and other triad crimes concerning tenants in newly completed housing estates. I believe that in 1992 there were seven such cases concerning 18 offenders but it is not clear and we do not know whether those were related to decoration work or not. They concern triad offences in general in newly completed housing estates.
MR FRED LI (in Cantonese): Mr President, the survey by the Housing Authority in 1992 revealed that 2% of tenants claimed to have been intimidated or harassed. In fact how many tenants did they represent? Given that a number of tenants claimed to have been harassed yet no cases had been established, has the Administration looked into them and ascertained whether they were due to reasons like failure to report, misunderstanding or exaggeration on the part of tenants, or the skilful tactics of triads to outwit the Administration, making it impossible for them to do anything about it or to substantiate the case?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, the outcome of complaints of this kind — and this is the information I have been given — is the product of a survey conducted by the Housing Authority of a sample of households moving into new estates. So this was not a total survey of all households moving in. I am just trying to put my finger on the precise number of households included in this survey — if Members would bear with me for a moment — and I now have it that just over 1 470 households responded to the survey of a rather larger number — which again I am afraid I cannot put my finger on just at the moment. So it is 2% of 1 470 in this case and I might say that further information from this survey indicated that those who were or claimed to have been harassed by triad groups took the following action: 44% of them paid money to avoid trouble, 34% of them did not take any action at all, 12% of them reported to the police and 7% took on non-approved decoration contractors, whilst 3% informed the estate office. So I think on the one hand we are talking about a relatively small sample and on the other hand, we are talking about a very, very small percentage from that sample. Secondly, I think, as is indicated from the survey, that possibly what is required — and we can feed this into the Housing Authority's review — is a redoubling of the effort to advise people moving into estates that they do not need to respond to this kind of situation in the way that they do and that they are like the other 53% who are perfectly entitled to have redecoration carried out under their own arrangements if they wish to.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2895 Written answers to questions
Nomenclature of government departments
7. MR GILBERT LEUNG asked (in Chinese): Given that Hong Kong will become a Special Administrative Region of China in 1997, will the Government inform this Council whether it will consider altering the names of government departments and departmental emblems and logos that have colonial implications, such as those of the Royal Hong Kong Police Force; if so, what time-frame and details have been drawn up for implementation; if not, why not?
SECRETARY FOR CONSTITUTIONAL AFFAIRS: Mr President, nomenclature of government departments, departmental emblems and logos, uniforms, badges and insignia which are not compatible with the provisions of the Basic Law and the future status of Hong Kong as a Special Administrative Region of China will need to be adapted. The Administration is examining the changes that are necessary and suitable arrangements will be made in due course.
Consumer Council's purview
8. MR LAU CHIN-SHEK asked (in Chinese): Certain organizations listed in the Schedule to the Consumer Council Ordinance fall outside the purview of the Consumer Council. Will the Government inform this Council of the reasons for having the Schedule and provide, for each organization, details of the channels available to consumers for lodging complaints and of the legislative provisions that are in place for monitoring the relevant procedures in handling complaints, so as to ensure the protection of consumers' interests?
SECRETARY FOR TRADE AND INDUSTRY: Mr President, the Schedule to the Consumer Council Ordinance lists the organizations which are already subject to some form of government control or public monitoring and therefore fall outside the purview of the Consumer Council. The following paragraphs describe in some detail the channels available to consumers for lodging complaints against these organizations and the legislative provisions that are in place for monitoring the relevant procedures in handling complaints.
Television and radio broadcasting licensees
(including Asia Television Limited, Hong Kong Commercial Broadcasting Company Limited, Hutchvision Hong Kong Limited, Metro Broadcast Corporation Limited and Television Broadcasts Limited)
Any person wishing to lodge a complaint against a television and radio broadcasting licensee may do so by writing to the Broadcasting Authority or by calling the Authority's complaints telephone hotline. Under sections 10 and 11
2896 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
of the Broadcasting Authority Ordinance (Cap. 391), the Authority will refer these complaints to the Broadcasting Authority Complaints Committee which will make recommendations concerning the complaints to the Authority.
In addition, a complainant may lodge complaints direct to the broadcasters concerned. As a condition of licence, all terrestrial broadcasters are required to receive and consider complaints and to maintain a complete and up-to-date complaints record for submission to the Broadcasting Authority on a regular basis and on demand.
Hong Kong Housing Authority
Tenants may lodge their complaints direct or through established channels with Housing Managers in charge of respective estate offices or the Housing Authority. In all cases the complainant will receive from the Housing Department a reply explaining the situation or reviewing a previous decision. If he is not satisfied with the reply, he may put his case to the Complaints Committee, set up under section 7(1) of the Housing Ordinance (Cap.283), for decision.
Under section 20(1) of the Ordinance, tenants may also appeal in writing to the Appeal Panel, established under section 7A(1), against tenancy decisions made by the Department.
Public transport and tunnel companies
(including China Motor Bus Company Limited, The Cross Harbour Tunnel Company Limited, The Hong Kong and Yaumatei Ferry Company Limited, Hong Kong Tramways Limited, Kowloon-Canton Railway Corporation, Kowloon Motor Bus Company (1933) Limited, Mass Transit Railway Corporation, New Hong Kong Tunnel Company Limited, New Lantao Bus Company (1973) Limited, The "Star" Ferry Company Limited and Tate's Cairn Tunnel Company Limited)
Public complaints in respect of services provided by the public transport and tunnel companies may be made to the companies themselves, the Commissioner for Transport and the Transport Complaints Unit of the Transport Advisory Committee.
The eight public transport operators listed in the Schedule have all established channels for handling public complaints. The most common ones are passenger hotlines and customer service centres. Most of the public transport operators also conduct passenger surveys from time to time to gauge consumers' opinion on their service standard.
The China Motor Bus Company Limited is required under its new franchise to establish passenger liaison groups to liaise, communicate with and receive the opinions of the public. The Hongkong and Yaumatei Ferry Company Limited and the Kowloon Motor Bus Company Limited have also
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2897
taken initiatives to establish such groups. We shall consider making this a requirement in the franchises of public transport operators when these are due for renewal.
Telecommunication companies
(including Hong Kong Telecom International Limited and Hong Kong Telephone Limited)
Consumers may lodge complaints against the Hong Kong Telephone Company (HKTC) and Hong Kong Telecom International (HKTI) with the Telecommunications Authority.
Under section 22 of the Telephone Ordinance (Cap. 269), HKTC is obliged to "provide and maintain to the satisfaction of the Telecommunications Authority a good, efficient and continuous service of public telephonic communication with modern appliances, including all reasonable modern inventions". More specifically, under section 24 of the said Ordinance the Company is obliged to provide service on request and, under section 30, to supply to the Government details of persons who have requested connections "and with whose request the Company has not complied".
Under clause 7 of HKTI's licence, the licensee is obliged to "operate, maintain and provide in a manner satisfactory to the Telecommunications Authority, the services specified in the First and Second Schedules hereto".
Fish and vegetable marketing organizations
(including Fish Marketing Organization and Vegetable Marketing Organization)
Section 17 of the Marine Fish (Marketing) Ordinance (Cap. 291) provides for review of decisions of the Fish Marketing Organization. Any person adversely affected by a decision of the Organization may notify the Director of Agriculture and Fisheries in writing to request such decision to be reviewed. The request will be referred to the Fish Marketing Advisory Board which may hold an inquiry to hear the complaint and will submit its advice to the Governor for final decision.
As for the Vegetable Marketing Organization, a channel of appeal to the Director of Marketing is available under Regulation 8(5) to the Agricultural Products (Marketing) Ordinance (Cap. 277) and Rule 53 of the Administrative Rules of the Cheung Sha Wan Wholesale Vegetable Market.
Power companies
(including China Light and Power Company Limited and the Hong Kong Electric Company Limited)
The China Light and Power Company Limited operates a customer telephone service and customers services centres with which customers can
2898 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 lodge complaints. Its Customer Consultative Group monitors the handling of complaints.
Similarly, the Hong Kong Electric Company Limited operates a customer service centre, an emergency reporting centre and trenching work complaints hotline to which customers can direct complaints. The company also receives complaints from its Customer Liaison Group.
Both power companies are subject to the provisions in the Electricity Ordinance (Cap. 406). Section 42 of this Ordinance provides that a person aggrieved by a decision/action of the companies in relation to the powers and obligations under sections 13 to 18 may appeal to the Director of Electrical and Mechanical Services. In addition, customers may also lodge complaints with the Director against the companies for failure to comply with the safety requirements for electricity supply set down in the Electricity Supply Regulations made under the Ordinance or on any other technical aspects of electricity supply.
Hong Kong Air Cargo Terminals Limited
Customers may lodge their complaints direct with the Hong Kong Air Cargo Terminals Limited (HACTL) or channel them through their trade bodies, namely the Carrier Liaison Group and the Hong Kong Association of Freight Forwarding Agents.
In addition, clause 2 of the Franchise Agreement signed between the Government and HACTL provides that the Company shall operate in accordance with international air industry standards to the general satisfaction of its customers and the Director of Civil Aviation. Where a customer feels that the standards required by the Director are not met by HACTL, he could complain direct to the Director, who would then take up the matter with HACTL under the terms of the Franchise Agreement.
Hospital Authority
At the individual hospital level, public complaints are handled by the relevant Hospital Chief Executive or Medical Superintendent assisted by a Patient Relations Officer. At the central level, appeal cases and referrals from other bodies are handled by a Public Complaints Committee established under the Hospital Authority Board. Separately, the trends of complaints relating to individual hospitals or specialties are monitored by the Patient and Community Relations Committee under the Board.
The Health and Welfare Branch of the Hong Kong Government scrutinizes the quarterly reports prepared by the Hospital Authority on the incidence of complaints or expressions of appreciation, based on the statistics supplied by individual hospitals. Regular visits are made by Justices of Peace to psychiatric hospitals at monthly intervals and to other hospitals at three-monthly
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2899
intervals. Their comments and observations are taken up by the Hospital Authority and monitored by the Health and Welfare Branch for necessary improvements.
General
In addition to the specific channels of complaints described in paragraphs 2 to 20 above, consumers may also lodge their complaints with other bodies like Office of Members of the Legislative Council, Office of the Commissioner for Administrative Complaints and District Boards where appropriate.
Funding for sports promotion
9. MR CHIM PUI-CHUNG asked (in Chinese): Will the Government inform this Council of:
(a) the amount of public funds spent on sports over the past five years; the main recipients of such funds and the standard of performance of local athletes in international competitions during the period; and
(b) the relationship between the Government, the Amateur Sports Federation and the Olympic Committee of Hong Kong; and the Committee's role in the promotion of sports?
SECRETARY FOR RECREATION AND CULTURE: Mr President, public funds for the promotion and development of sports are mainly channelled through:
(a) direct government subventions, before 1990 given direct to the Amateur Sports Federation and Olympic Committee (ASF&OC) and National Sports Associations (NSAs) on the advice of the Council for Recreation and Sports, and after 1990, to the Hong Kong Sports Development Board (SDB) who then provides financial assistance to the ASF&OC and the NSAs;
(b) expenditure by the Urban Council (UC) and Regional Council (RC) on sports programmes and sports events organized by the two Councils for the general public; and
(c) expenditure by the Education Department on school sports programmes and competitions.
2900 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
Excluding staff and administration costs, funds spent on sports programmes and activities through each of the above channels over the last five years are:
(a) Government subventions
Year $Million Remarks
1988-89 10.35 } to ASF&OC & NSAs on advice
} of the Council for Recreation
1989-90 12.10 } and Sports
}
1990-91 26.89 }
}
1991-92 30.01 } to SDB
}
1992-93 33.14 }
(b) Expenditure by UC and RC
Year $Million
UC RC
1988-89 11.49 7.69
1989-90 14.57 8.89
1990-91 15.69 9.08
1991-92 21.26 12.87
1992-93 23.34 13.75
(c) Expenditure by Education Department
Year $Million
1988-89 7.52
1989-90 7.61
1990-91 8.63
1991-92 9.96
1992-93 10.75
The performance of Hong Kong's sportsmen and sportswomen has greatly improved in recent years, particularly in a selected number of sports such as table tennis, badminton, squash, swimming, rowing, windsurfing, soccer and sports for the disabled. Many medals were won in regional and international competitions and Hong Kong's own records were broken. A table showing the medals won particularly in these selected sports by Hong Kong athletes at regional and international competitions over the last five years is at Annex.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2901
The ASF&OC, as its name implies, is a federation of the governing sports associations of Hong Kong as well as the territory's Olympic Committee. It is legally registered as an autonomous and independent body and is responsible for the running of its own affairs without any government representation. However, it maintains close relations with the SDB, and the President of the ASF&OC is an ex officio member of the SDB. It is also financially assisted in its activities by government subventions given to it through the SDB.
The ASF&OC is recognized by the International Olympic Committee as the National Olympic Committee of the territory. It is also recognized by the Asian games Federation (now, the Olympic Council of Asia) and the Commonwealth Games Federation. As such, it is the accreditation body for Hong Kong's participation in these international games. It plays an important role in the promotion of sports in Hong Kong by organizing and encouraging participations in international competitions. The ASF&OC places great emphasis on sports education. It sponsors training programmes for sports leaders, administrators, coaches, technical officials and athletes held overseas or in Hong Kong. It organizes local courses on sports leadership, sports administration, sports medicine and sports science as well as courses on sports management and sports coaching in conjunction with the United States Sports Academy. Together with the NSAs and the municipal councils, it also organizes the annual Hong Kong Festival of Sport, which attracts wide public participation.
Annex
Medals won by HK Athletes
at International Competitions 1988-93
Sports 1988-89 1989-90 1990-91 1991-92 1992-93
Badminton 1G 1G 2G 1S 1S 2S 1S
1B 1B
2B 1B
Windsurfing 2G 2G 4G 1S 3B
Squash 1G 4G 3G 3S 5S 1S 4S 1S
1B 2B 1B
Table Tennis 4G 4G 7G 1G 1G 2S 3S 7S 3S
4B 6B 5B 4B 1B
2902 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
Sports 1988-89 1989-90 1990-91 1991-92 1992-93
Swimming 8G 10G 11G 1G 3G 20S 43S 15S 6S 8S
24B 41B 23B 8B 13B
Rowing 1G 4S 1S
1B 5B 2B
Soccer - - - - -
Disabled sports 1G 3G 2G 3G 2S 1S 4S
5B 6B 4B
Notes (a)
G = Gold Medal
S = Silver Medal
B = Bronze Medal
(b) The Games in which medals were won in these sports include:
Commonwealth Games (Badminton)
Asian Games (Windsurfing, Table Tennis)
Olympic Games (Badminton - Exhibition)
Commonwealth Championships (Table Tennis)
World Championships (Table Tennis, Disabled)
World Double Cup (Table Tennis)
World Cup Meet (Swimming)
World Rowing Championships
Grand Prix Meet Dumferimline (Swimming)
East Asian Championships (Squash, Rowing)
Asian Championships (Squash, Swimming, Rowing, Table Tennis,
Windsurfing)
Asian Rowing Championships
Asian Cup (Table Tennis)
Asia Pacific Age Group Invitation Meet (Swimming)
Asia Age Group Swimming Championships
Asia Pacific Age Group Swimming Meet, Jakarta
Asia Pacific Age Group Championships (Swimming)
East Asian Regatta
IBSA Open Asian Championships (Rowing, Windsurfing)
6th Asian Regatta (Windsurfing)
China Open (Badminton, Table Tennis)
Canadian Open (Badminton)
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2903
Singapore Open (Windsurfing)
Japan Open (Table Tennis, Squash)
Finland Open (Table Tennis)
French Open (Badminton)
Silver Bowl, Melbourne (Badminton)
German Open (Disabled Sports)
Sweden Open (Table Tennis)
Benawi Cup (Table Tennis)
Dianshan Hu Cup, Shanghai (Rowing)
Hong Kong — Singapore Meet (Swimming)
Tokyo Open Championships (Table Tennis)
Samaranch Cup (Table Tennis)
Australian Age Group Championships (Swimming)
Arafura Sports Festival Australia (Badminton)
Qantas Meet, Sydney (Swimming)
Australian National Games (Disabled)
Bellinzona Int'l Meet, Switzerland (Swimming)
British Age Group Championships (Swimming)
British National Swimming Championships
Tokyo International Swimming Competition, Tokyo
Tokyo Excellence Meet (Swimming)
Welsh National Swimming Championships
Penang Open Sailing Regatta (Windsurfing)
Singapore Quantas Speedcrossing (Windsurfing)
Singapore Boardsailing Championships (Windsurfing)
Oita International Wheelchair Marathon
1989 FESPIC Games
1992 Paralympic Games
Localization policy
10. DR LEONG CHE-HUNG asked: Will the Administration inform this Council:
(a) of its targets and time tables for the continued implementation of the localization policy in those government departments which are not yet fully localized; and
(b) whether it has set targets and time tables for promoting this policy among major public bodies which are financially supported by the Government, for example, the Hospital Authority; if so, what these are; if not, why not?
2904 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 SECRETARY FOR THE CIVIL SERVICE: Mr President,
(a) The localization policy applies to all civil service appointments in all departments. Preference is given to suitably qualified local candidates and overseas officers are only appointed if qualified local candidates are unavailable. Since early 1985 overseas officers have only been appointed on agreement (contract) terms. The contract of an overseas officer will not be renewed if a qualified local officer is available to take his place. Promotions however are based solely on merit.
The localization policy has been broadly successful and the rate of progress has accelerated with the expansion of tertiary education, the widening of opportunities for obtaining professional qualifications locally and the achievements of the Government's own training schemes. In 1952 the percentage of overseas officers in the Civil Service stood at about 4.5%. On 1 January it stood at 1.2%. More significantly however, 64% of the directorate is now localized and just over half of the Secretaries and Heads of Departments are now local officers. These figures are expected to increase further in the near future as more and more local officers move up through the ranks of the Civil Service. Current localization statistics are attached.
There is however no general target or timescale to phase out deliberately all overseas officers. Indeed the Joint Declaration and the Basic Law make specific provision for the continued employment of overseas officers, with one exception. These are the future Principal Official posts which must be held by Chinese nationals who are Hong Kong residents without foreign right of abode. Using our present terminology we believe that the future Principal Official posts correspond to our existing posts of Chief Secretary, Financial Secretary, Attorney General, Secretaries, Commissioner of Police, Commissioner ICAC, Commissioner of Customs and Excise, Director of Immigration and Director of Audit. We are in the process of developing a sufficiently large pool of qualified local officers to fill all these posts in good time before 1997.
(b) Turning to major public bodies and organizations outside the Civil Service, Mr President, I would like to stress that these organizations were established to carry out specific functions and are self-governing insofar as personnel practices and policies are concerned. There is no government imposed localization objective and these bodies are free to select whoever they consider the best person for the job. That said, the Government certainly likes to see these bodies giving priority to suitably qualified local candidates where available
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2905
and I understand that many of these organizations now follow such a policy themselves.
Statistics on Localization
As at 1 April 1988 As at 1 January 1993
Local Overseas Total Local Overseas Total
STRENGTH OF THE CIVIL SERVICE
180 203 (98.6%) 2 640 (1.4%) 182 843 187 207 (98.8%) 2 175 (1.2%) 189 382
Directorate 588 (55.6%) 469 (44.4%) 1 057 889 (64.4%) 487 (35.4%) 1 376
Senior management/ professional
1 322 (70.4%) 557 (29.6%) 1 879 2 443 (78.7%) 661 (21.3%) 3 104
Others 178 293 (99.1%) 1 614 (0.9%) 179 907 183 875 (99.4%) 1 027 (0.6%) 184 902
ADMINISTRATIVE SERVICE
284 (66.0%) 146 (34.5%) 430 355 (76.3%) 110 (23.7%) 465
Directorate 120 (58.0%) 87 (42.0%) 207 143 (65.3%) 76 (34.7%) 219 AO & SAO 164 (73.5%) 59 (26.5%) 223 212 (86.2%) 34 (13.8%) 246
POLICE INSPECTORS AND ABOVE
Assistant commissioner and above
1 848 (67.2%) 901 (32.8%) 2 749 2 048 (71.6%) 814 (28.4%) 2 862 4 (18.2%) 18 (81.8%) 22 8 (32.0%) 17 (68.0%) 25
Superintendents 149 (33.4%) 297 (66.6%) 446 195 (41.8%) 271 (58.2%) 466 Inspectors 1 695 (74.3%) 586 (25.7%) 2 281 1 845 (77.8%) 526 (22.2%) 2 371 CROWN COUNSEL 99 (40.2%) 147 (59.8%) 246 119 (47.8%) 130 (52.2%) 249 Directorate 3 (7.0%) 40 (93.0%) 43 10 (18.5%) 44 (81.5%) 54
Assistant Crown
Counsel, Crown Counsel and Senior Crown
Counsel
96 (47.3%) 107 (52.7%) 203 109 (55.9%) 86 (44.1%) 195
The disabled's means of access
11. MR HOWARD YOUNG asked: Will the Government inform this Council whether, in order to provide a barrier-free physical environment for the disabled, it will consider making it mandatory for:
(a) access and other special facilities for the disabled to be provided in all new buildings, including private domestic buildings; and
(b) such access and special facilities to be provided in existing buildings when they are refurbished?
2906 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President, the provision of access to and special facilities for disabled people in buildings is governed by Regulation 72 of the Building (Planning) Regulations. Where a building is one to which disabled persons have or may reasonably be expected to have access, it should be designed in accordance with specified standards to facilitate the access to and use of the building and its facilities by disabled persons. The types of buildings covered under Regulation 72 include hotels, places of public entertainment and schools, and so on. Alteration and addition works to existing buildings which are subject to Regulation 72 should comply fully with the statutory requirements. At present, private domestic buildings are not covered by the Regulation.
In the Green Paper on Rehabilitation published in March 1992, it has been recommended that consideration should be given to extending the requirements under Regulation 72 to private domestic buildings. The Administration is considering the way forward on this and other recommendations in the Green Paper in the light of public views.
Private homes for the aged
12. MR WONG WAI-YIN asked (in Chinese): Will the Government inform this Council:
(a) of the progress of preparing legislation to regulate private homes for the aged and the timetable for it to be introduced to this Council; and
(b) whether difficulties have been encountered in the drafting of the relevant legislation which have repeatedly delayed its introduction to this Council?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President,
(a) The drafting of the Residential Care Homes (Elderly Persons) Bill has been accorded high priority in the legislative drafting programme by the Health and Welfare Branch. The drafting work is now at an advanced stage. We intend to introduce the Bill to the Legislative Council in the 1993-94 Session.
(b) The drafting of the Residential Care Homes (Elderly Persons) Bill is now near completion. There are no longer any drafting difficulties.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2907 Food hygiene
13. MISS CHRISTINE LOH asked: In view of the public concern over contamination in seafood and vegetables, will the Government inform this Council:
(a) of the reason for adopting less stringent standards for heavy metal contamination for foodstuff, as set out in the Food Adulteration (Metallic Contamination) Regulations, than those of neighbouring countries such as Malaysia, Singapore, and Australia;
(b) of the number of each type of samples of crustaceans, molluscs, and fresh vegetables tested by the Government in the past 12 months, and the number found to contain an unacceptable degree of bacterial, metallic or pesticide elements by Hong Kong standards;
(c) of the number of prosecutions against suppliers or vendors of contaminated seafood and fresh vegetables in the past 12 months, and the penalties involved;
(d) whether it will inform consumers about all contaminated foodstuff on a regular basis; if not, what the reasons are; and
(e) what measures it will take to control the quality of the water in which fish, crustaceans and molluscs are bred and, in particular, whether it will consider legislative amendments to facilitate effective control of the water quality of oyster breeding beds?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President,
(a) The maximum permitted concentrations of heavy metals are set out in the Food Adulteration (Metallic Contamination) Regulations with reference to guidelines including the Provisional Tolerable Weekly Intake recommended by the World Health Organization. The standards spelt out in our law are considered appropriate and in line with WHO guidelines.
It is not correct to say that our standards are less stringent than those of Malaysia, Singapore or Australia. There is no single international standard. The maximum permitted concentrations vary from place to place, taking into account local considerations.
(b) The bacteriological, metallic and pesticide content in our food is monitored through the food surveillance programme by the Department of Health.
2908 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
The relevant statistics for the period between 1 April 1992 and 31 March 1993 are as follows:
Testing on Crustaceans
No. of samples completed
examination
No. of samples not complying with standards
Bacteriological 161 5 Metallic 46 1 Pesticide residue - - Testing on Molluscs
No. of samples completed
examination
No. of samples not complying with standards
Bacteriological 367 42 Metallic 61 12 Pesticide residue - - Testing on Fresh Vegetables
No. of samples completed
examination
No. of samples not complying with standards
Bacteriological - - Metallic - - Pesticide residue 885 15
(c) In the past 12 months, there were 14 prosecutions taken, all against suppliers of pesticide-tainted vegetables. Eight of these cases secured conviction and the remaining six are pending judgment. The penalties imposed ranged from $600 to $2,000.
(d) The Urban Services Department, the Regional Services Department and the Department of Health regularly conduct health education
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2909
activities including health exhibitions, distribution of leaflets, Announcements of Public Interest in the media and at the market places and food establishments to publicize the importance of adhering to good personal hygiene and food hygiene practices.
During an outbreak of diseases, we will, through special announcements and arrangements, not only inform consumers immediately but also intensify efforts of publicity and control. For example, a special interdepartmental committee is immediately activated to address the problem.
Shortly, we will publish on a regular basis reports on the results of food testing for the information of the general public.
(e) For protection and regulation of culture of marine fish (including crustaceans and molluscs but not oysters), the Marine Fish Culture Ordinance (Cap 353) empowers the Director of Agriculture and Fisheries to take prosecution action against any person who pollutes the water in any fish culture zone.
As regards protection of water quality in general, discharges of effluent in water control zones are strictly controlled under the Water Pollution Ordinance via a licensing scheme administered by the Director of Environmental Protection. At present, over 90% of the territory's waters have been declared as water control zones. Two more water control zones will be declared this year with the final one, Victoria Harbour, scheduled to be declared in phases by 1997. The Government has also embarked on a comprehensive sewerage improvement programme to ensure that all significant effluents can be collected, treated and properly disposed of.
The Director of Environmental Protection is also empowered by the Waste Disposal Ordinance to control the disposal of waste. Enforcement of the legislation in relation to livestock waste, however, is held in abeyance in most areas pending completion of a review of the livestock waste control scheme by the Government.
Of all oysters consumed in Hong Kong, about 10% are bred locally. Of these 10%, the majority are imported from China and kept in local waters for a short period for fattening before sale. The only significant local breeding beds are in Deep Bay which is already a water control zone. Statutory means are in place to control discharges of effluents and disposal of waste. However, the major contributor to pollution in Deep Bay is livestock waste and Deep Bay is one area in which the enforcement of controls over livestock waste disposal is currently suspended pending review.
2910 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 Volatile solvent abuse
14. REV FUNG CHI-WOOD asked (in Chinese): Will the Government inform this Council:
(a) whether the problem of sniffing volatile solvents from substances like thinner by teenagers is becoming increasingly acute;
(b) what measures are being taken by the departments concerned to rectify such an undesirable situation; and
(c) whether consideration has been given to the ways by which the public should be educated on the pernicious effects of such behaviour and to introducing legislative control on the sale of these substances?
SECRETARY FOR SECURITY: Mr President,
(a) Information received by the Government's Central Registry of Drug Abuse reveals that solvent abuse among teenagers is increasing although the numbers involved are still very small. In 1990 there were three reports involving young people under 21; in 1991 there were 17; and in 1992 there were 25.
(b) The principal measure to reduce solvent abuse is publicity and preventive education. In all such programmes undertaken by the Action Committee Against Narcotics, the danger of solvent abuse is included.
A number of initiatives are being taken to educate youngsters, parents, educators and others who have an interest in the matter, about the danger of drug and substance abuse. These include a new series of Announcements of Public Interest, for TV and radio broadcast, and an accompanying poster and leaflet. Drug education talks to parents whose children are attending secondary schools are being launched with the assistance of schools. Workshops and seminars for final year students of colleges of education are also being conducted, so that they are more aware of the danger of drug abuse and the resources available to help teachers deal with the problem. In September, a new drug education talks programme will be introduced to help Primary VI students understand the proper use of drugs and the dangers of abusing drugs; and learn correct attitudes and life skills.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2911
(c) Given the limited extent of solvent abuse and the widespread, legitimate, industrial, commercial and household uses of solvents, we have no plans to introduce legislative controls on their sale. Instead, preventive education and publicity will be continued; the harmful effects of drug and substance abuse, including solvents, will be explained; and parents and schools will be alerted to detect signs of their abuse at an early stage so that appropriate remedial action may be taken.
Target and Target Related Assessment
15. MR ERIC LI asked (in Chinese): As the Education Department is planning to introduce the "Target and Target Related Assessment" Scheme to all Primary IV classes in Hong Kong in May this year, will the Government inform this Council:
(a) whether the Education Department has issued guidelines to local textbook publishers on how the contents of textbooks and exercise books should be revised to tie in with the scheme; if not, when such guidelines will be issued to allow the publishers sufficient time to make the necessary revision; and
(b) what assistance the Department will offer should the publishers have doubts in revising the contents of the textbooks and exercise books?
SECRETARY FOR EDUCATION AND MANPOWER: Mr President, the Education Department (ED) considers it unnecessary to make major changes to textbooks in order to introduce Target and Target Related Assessment (TTRA). For this reason, it has not issued any formal guidelines to local publishers on how textbooks should be revised to tie in with the TTRA scheme. At the moment, ED is reviewing the May 1993 timetable for introducing TTRA to Primary IV, in the light of the outcome of the pilot project. This review will cover the need for textbooks and support materials. If it turns out that substantial changes to existing publications are warranted, suitable guidelines will be issued and ample time will be allowed for their preparation and production.
In the meantime, publishers are kept informed of developments on the TTRA. The Education Department briefed publishers on the TTRA and answered their queries at a meeting in January 1993. It will maintain a dialogue with publishers through regular meetings and periodic briefing sessions.
2912 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 Strategic landfill projects
16. MR TAM YIU-CHUNG asked (in Chinese): Will the Government inform this Council:
(a) how the conditions in the contracts to commission private contractors to undertake the strategic landfills projects are worked out and how the bids for such contracts are processed; and
(b) whether such contracts will go beyond 1997; if so, whether the Chinese Government would be consulted?
SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS: Mr President,
(a) The contract documents for the strategic landfill projects were developed by consultants commissioned by the Government specifically for the task. In the course of their work, the consultants drew on professional and specialist expertise from various fields including waste management, engineering, legal and financial. They also examined practices followed elsewhere in the world and where appropriate adapted them as necessary to suit Hong Kong. The process was supervised by a steering group consisting of representatives from government branches and departments.
Bids for strategic landfill projects are evaluated in accordance with procedures established by the Central Tender Board. The evaluation criteria are drawn up and agreed by a Tender Selection Panel consisting of representatives from government branches and departments and approved by the Central Tender Board before tenders are received. The consultants assess each tender against these criteria and put forward their evaluation for consideration by the Tender Selection Panel. The Panel then makes recommendations to the Central Tender Board for approval.
(b) The contracts for the strategic landfill projects will go beyond 30 June 1997. The Chinese are being consulted on them.
Community halls
17. MR LEE WING-TAT asked (in Chinese): As the management of community halls has been handed over to district boards since 1 April 1993, will the Government inform this Council whether the community halls will be renovated or refurbished, so as to provide proper facilities for the holding of cultural and recreational activities and meetings, while making such facilities available to the disabled at the same time?
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2913
SECRETARY FOR HOME AFFAIRS: Mr President, as from 1 April 1993, district boards will be fully consulted on operational and management matters affecting the 34 community halls. This is intended to enable district boards to have a greater influence over the operation and management of these facilities while City and New Territories Administration District Officers will continue to be responsible for the day-to-day operation of the halls.
The Architectural Services Department (ASD) has a rolling programme for maintaining the external facade of the community halls. For community halls within housing estates, the Housing Department has a similar maintenance programme.
Internal maintenance and improvement works are also carried out by ASD. Improvements to community halls take place as and when appropriate. Recent improvements have included installation of air-conditioning in all halls, upgrading flooring, and enhancement of security installations.
Since 1987, community halls have included facilities for the disabled such as special access, toilets and emergency escape routes. Where technically feasible, such facilities have also been introduced in the older halls.
The present schedule of accommodation for community halls includes a multi-purpose hall with a stage and dressing rooms for holding cultural and recreational activities as well as a conference room for meetings.
In future, district boards will be invited to advise the District Officers on how these facilities should be operated to meet the needs of their community. This will include advising on upgrading the standards of maintenance, the introduction of new or different uses for these facilities, booking arrangements, operating hours and so on. District Officers will act on the advice of district boards whenever it is practicable to do so.
Contaminated grapes from the United States
18. MR ALBERT CHAN asked (in Chinese): In view of recent reports that grapes produced in the United States have been contaminated by toxic pesticides which may lead to cancer, will the Government inform this Council:
(a) how it will ensure that imported fruits, especially grapes from the United States, meet the necessary health standards to safeguard public health;
(b) whether it has examined grapes imported from the United States; if so, how many random samplings were made over the past year and how many of them were found to have failed in the health standards tests; and
2914 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 (c) how those grapes which do not meet the health standards are disposed of?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President,
(a) The Department of Health maintains close liaison with countries exporting food to Hong Kong and requires from the exporting authority food test reports on the export items. Under its food surveillance programme, the Department regularly takes samples of imported food, including fruits, from points of entry and retail or wholesale outlets for examination. Any food item considered unfit for human consumption will be denied import.
(b) 16 samples of grapes, 15 of which were imported from the United States, were taken for examination in 1992. No pesticide residue was found in any of the samples taken.
(c) There has not been any case of grapes found with pesticide residue. If there had been, the grapes would have been destroyed.
Caseworkers' workload
19. DR CONRAD LAM asked (in Chinese): With regard to a recent inquest in which the lack of care has been returned as the cause of death of a baby girl, will the Government inform this Council:
(a) how many cases, on average, each caseworker of the Social Welfare Department has to handle concurrently; whether the present workload of the caseworkers has exceeded the level that is considered reasonable by the Government; and
(b) whether there are any specific measures and plans in hand to rationalize the workload of the caseworkers; if so, what the details of such measures and plans are; if not, why not?
SECRETARY FOR HEALTH AND WELFARE: Mr President,
(a) Child abuse cases are handled by the Child Protective Services Unit of the Social Welfare Department. At present, the average caseload of a caseworker in the Unit is 39. This caseload is in line with the approved manning ratio of one child protective caseworker to 40 child abuse case, and is considered reasonable.
(b) The Social Welfare Department has strengthened the Unit by deploying more experienced social workers to it. Since January
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2915
1991, the establishment of the Unit has been increased from eight to nine caseworkers, and the ranking of the caseworkers has been upgraded from the Assistant Social Work Officer rank to the Social Work Officer rank, in view of the increasing complexity of the cases handled and the need for outreaching investigation duties. The Department will continue to monitor the caseload of the caseworkers.
Duty on cosmetic products
20. MR HENRY TANG asked: Will the Government inform this Council whether it is aware of the reasons why the abolition of 30% duty on cosmetic products will only result in a reduction of the retail prices of such products in the current year by an average of 10- 20%; and will it ask the Consumer Council to look into the matter to see whether the small reduction is justified?
SECRETARY FOR TRADE AND INDUSTRY: Mr President, in his 1993 Budget speech, the Financial Secretary announced that he would introduce legislation to abolish the 30% duty on cosmetics. He also mentioned that he had received an undertaking from the cosmetics trade associations that, if the duty were abolished, retail prices of cosmetic products would be reduced in the coming year by an average of between 10-12%.
The abolition of a 30% duty can only be translated into a lesser percentage reduction in the retail prices because the duty on cosmetic products was based on the imported price of the products or, in the case of locally manufactured cosmetics, on the production value, and not on the retail prices. The imported or production value of cosmetics is, of course, less than the retail price because it does not include costs for local distribution, advertising, sales promotion and so on; nor does it include a profit element.
The proportion of the sale price of cosmetics previously represented by the 30% duty ranged from about 3% to 13%. It was on this basis that we negotiated the promised price reductions of 10-12% with the cosmetics trade. In the circumstances, we do not see the need to ask the Consumer Council to look into the matter.
Motions
MARINE FISH (MARKETING) ORDINANCE
THE SECRETARY FOR ECONOMIC SERVICES moved the following motion:
"That the Marine Fish (Marketing) (Amendment) Bylaw 1993, made by the Fish Marketing Organization on 28 January 1993, be approved."
2916 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 She said: Mr President, I move the motion standing in my name on the Order Paper.
On 15 July 1992 this Council passed the Marine Fish (Marketing) (Amendment) Bill 1992 which amended the Marine Fish (Marketing) Ordinance so that the Fish Marketing Organization might, instead of prescribing its rate of commission in its bylaws, prescribed the rate by notice in the Gazette, after consultation with the Fish Marketing Advisory Board. The purpose of the amendment was to streamline the procedure for prescribing the rate of commission, while ensuring that any decision to change the rate was taken only after consultation with representatives of those who buy and sell fish through wholesale fish markets.
On 28 January 1993, the Fish Marketing Organization made the Marine Fish (Marketing) (Amendment) Bylaw 1993 enabling it to prescribe a rate of commission by notice in the Gazette. The Bylaw has been submitted to the Governor pursuant to section 15(3) of the Marine Fish (Marketing) Ordinance. This subsection also provides that the bylaw shall be subject to the approval of this Council.
Mr President, I beg to move.
Question on the motion proposed, put and agreed to.
MAGISTRATES ORDINANCE
THE SECRETARY FOR THE TREASURY moved the following motion:
"That the Magistrates (Fees) (Amendment) Regulation 1993, made by the Chief Justice on 14 January 1993, be approved."
He said: Mr President, I move the first motion standing in my name on the Order Paper.
Under section 134(1) of the Magistrates Ordinance, the Chief Justice may, with the approval of the Legislative Council, make regulations fixing a scale of fees payable at the magistrates' court in respect of any proceeding or the issuing, service or execution of any process. The purpose of the amending regulation is to increase the fees by about 60%. This takes into account inflation since the last fee revision in April 1988.
Mr President, I beg to move.
Question on the motion proposed, put and agreed to.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2917 MATRIMONIAL CAUSES ORDINANCE
THE SECRETARY FOR THE TREASURY moved the following motion:
"That the Matrimonial Causes (Fees) (Amendment) Rule 1993, made by the Chief Justice on 14 January 1993, be approved."
He said: Mr President, I move the second motion standing in my name on the Order Paper.
Under section 54 of the Matrimonial Causes Ordinance, the Chief Justice may, with the approval of the Legislative Council, make rules prescribing the fees payable under the Ordinance. The purpose of the amending rule is to increase the fees by about 60%. This takes into account inflation since the last fee revision in April 1988.
The opportunity has also been taken to update the Schedule by introducing three changes. First, the fee relating to appointment before a registrar is proposed for repeal, because it is no longer necessary to make an appointment before a registrar. Secondly, it is proposed to introduce a single fee to replace the two-tier fee on the taxation of a bill of costs. Thirdly, a new fee will be introduced on filing an election to take fixed costs under the District Court (Fixed Costs in Matrimonial Causes) Rules.
Mr President, I beg to move.
Question on the motion proposed, put and agreed to.
First Reading of Bills
INLAND REVENUE (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
ESTATE DUTY (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
ENTERTAINMENTS TAX (REPEAL) BILL 1993
STAMP DUTY (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
DUTIABLE COMMODITIES (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
MOTOR VEHICLES (FIRST REGISTRATION TAX) (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993 ROAD TRAFFIC (MISCELLANEOUS AMENDMENTS) BILL 1993
2918 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 CROSS-HARBOUR TUNNEL (PASSAGE TAX) (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993 INLAND REVENUE (AMENDMENT) (NO. 2) BILL 1993
INLAND REVENUE (AMENDMENT) (NO. 3) BILL 1993
EDUCATION (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
SEWAGE TUNNELS (STATUTORY EASEMENTS) BILL
COMPANIES (AMENDMENT) (NO. 3) BILL 1993
Bills read the First time and ordered to be set down for Second Reading pursuant to Standing Order 41(3).
Second Reading of Bills
INLAND REVENUE (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Inland Revenue Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Inland Revenue (Amendment) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
This is the first in a series of 10 Bills which I will be introducing this afternoon, in order to give effect to the revenue-related proposals in this year's Budget. Since these proposals were fully covered in the Budget speech, I will keep my introduction to these implementing Bills reasonably brief.
The Bill now before Members seeks to make two major concessions in respect of salaries tax.
Clause 2 of the Bill widens the second and third marginal tax rate bands from $20,000 to $30,000, applicable from the 1993-94 year of assessment.
Clause 3 of the Bill amends the 4th Schedule of the Ordinance in order to increase substantially salaries tax allowances, again with effect from the 1993-94 year of assessment. Specifically, basic and married persons allowances will go up by nearly 22% to $56,000 and $112,000, respectively, while allowances for dependents will be increased by between 10% and 48%.
We estimate that the cost to the general revenue of these concessions will be nearly $2.6 billion in 1993-94 and about $17 billion over the period up to 1996-97.
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Mr President, as indicated in the Budget speech, the combination of these concessions will result in reduced tax bills for over three quarters of salaries taxpayers, while more than a quarter of a million other taxpayers will fall out of the tax net altogether.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A). PRESIDENT: As you have got so many Bills to move, you may wish just to keep on. FINANCIAL SECRETARY: Thank you, Mr President.
ESTATE DUTY (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Estate Duty Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Estate Duty (Amendment) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
The effect of this Bill would be to change the levels at which estate duty is levied so as to reduce the impact which this tax has on relatively small estates. The level below which no duty is payable would be raised from $4 million to $5 million. Above that level, the Bill would reduce the rates of duty payable on estates valued between $5 and $7 million.
The cost of this concession to general revenue will be $50 million in 1993-94 and approximately $220 million up to 1996-97.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
ENTERTAINMENTS TAX (REPEAL) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to repeal the Entertainments Tax Ordinance, the Entertainments Duty Regulations and the resolutions by the Legislative Council made under that Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Entertainments Tax (Repeal) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
The purpose of the Bill is to abolish the tax on the entrance to race meetings which was previously collected by the Royal Hong Kong Jockey Club on behalf of the Government. This concession follows the abolition in the 1992 Budget of the entertainments tax on cinema tickets.
2920 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
Since no other taxes are collected under this Ordinance, the Bill repeals the Ordinance altogether. The cost to revenue will be about $50 million in the period up to 1996-97.
Mr President, I can confirm to Honourable Members the Financial Secretary's earlier statement that the Jockey Club has kindly agreed to donate to the Community Chest an amount equivalent to the tax which was previously payable every year. The donation will go, in the first instance, towards the Chest's operating expenses and will therefore ensure that every dollar of the donation to the Chest will in future directly benefit the charity for which it was intended.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
STAMP DUTY (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Stamp Duty Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move next that the Stamp Duty (Amendment) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
The effect of this Bill will be to reduce the rate of stamp duty payable in respect of the sale and purchase on transfer of stock from 0.4% to 0.3%.
This concession is designed to ensure Hong Kong's continued competitiveness in international stock trading, and I am confident that the industry will pass on the full benefit of this concession to investors.
The cost of this measure to the general revenue will amount to approximately $800 million in 1993-94 and nearly $4 billion over the period up to 1996-97.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
DUTIABLE COMMODITIES (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Dutiable Commodities Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Dutiable Commodities (Amendment) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
This Bill has three purposes. First, it abolishes the duty on cosmetics. This concession will cost approximately $400 million in 1993-94, or $1.7 billion up to 1996-97. As the Financial Secretary stated in his Budget
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2921
speech, the cosmetic trade associations have undertaken to reduce the retail price of cosmetics by an average of 10% to 12% during the year.
In view of recent queries from some Members, I should perhaps take this opportunity to clarify that the previous ad valorem duty of 30% was levied on the imported price of cosmetic products or, in the case of locally manufactured cosmetics, on the ex-factory price. The actual cost of cosmetics to consumers of course also includes incidental costs incurred in the selling process, as well as the profit element. The proportion of the sale price of cosmetics previously represented by duty ranged from about 3% to 13%. It was on this basis that we negotiated the promised price reductions with the cosmetics trade.
Secondly, clause 5 of the Bill would increase the duty rates on liquor, tobacco and fuel. I should emphasize that these are nominal increases designed simply to maintain the real value of the duty imposed in line with inflation. I have deliberately avoided any increases in real terms. For this reason, those duty rates which are set on an ad valorem basis have remained unchanged.
Thirdly, Mr President, I am today introducing a series of three Bills, the effect of which will be to provide additional tax concessions to disabled drivers, the total cost of which will be about $25 million up to 1996-97. Clause 5 paragraph (h) of the present Bill is part of this package of concessions. It has the effect of exempting from duty on fuel for disabled drivers of motor cycles or tricycles, up to a limit of 100 litres a month.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
MOTOR VEHICLES (FIRST REGISTRATION TAX) (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Motor Vehicles (First Registration Tax) Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Motor Vehicles (First Registration Tax) (Amendment) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
The effect of this Bill would be to amend the Ordinance to provide that First Registration Tax will not be payable in respect of a motor cycle or motor tricycle registered by a disabled person, regardless of the vehicle's taxable value. This Bill is one of three Bills which I will be introducing this afternoon to extend to drivers of motor cycles and motor tricycles the same tax exemptions that already apply to disabled drivers of cars.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
2922 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 ROAD TRAFFIC (MISCELLANEOUS AMENDMENTS) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Road Traffic Ordinance and a number of Regulations made under it."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Road Traffic (Miscellaneous Amendments) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
This Bill would extend to disabled drivers of motor cycles and motor tricycles the exemption from vehicle and driving licence fees now applicable to disabled drivers of cars.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
CROSS-HARBOUR TUNNEL (PASSAGE TAX) (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Cross-Harbour Tunnel (Passage Tax) Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Cross-Harbour Tunnel (Passage Tax) (Amendment) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
This is the third Bill in the Financial Secretary's package of concessions in relation to the disabled. The Bill would provide that any disabled person who can satisfy the Commissioner for Transport that he requires, as a driver of a motor cycle or motor tricycle, to make use of the Cross-Harbour Tunnel, will be exempt from the payment of the tunnel tax.
Mr President, I should take this opportunity to remind Members that in parallel with this Bill, the Commissioner for Transport has exempted all disabled drivers from paying tolls when using government tunnels since 1 April 1993. This concession does not require separate legislation.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
INLAND REVENUE (AMENDMENT) (NO. 2) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Inland Revenue Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Inland Revenue (Amendment) (No. 2) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
The purpose of the Bill is to introduce a system of Composite Tax Returns, or CTRs, with effect from 1 April 1994. A CTR will be a single
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2923
return covering all taxes levied under the Inland Revenue Ordinance. Its introduction will simplify procedures for taxpayers who now have to fill in two or more tax returns for the Inland Revenue Department, as well as allowing redeployment of resources within the department to help to combat tax avoidance and evasion.
Mr President, I should like to repeat the assurance given in the Budget speech that the introduction of CTRs will affect neither the rates of tax nor the amounts payable. Its purpose is simply to make life easier for all concerned.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
INLAND REVENUE (AMENDMENT) (NO. 3) BILL 1993
THE FINANCIAL SECRETARY moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Inland Revenue Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move that the Inland Revenue (Amendment) (No. 3) Bill 1993 be read the Second time.
The Bill before Honourable Members relates to section 21A of the Inland Revenue Ordinance. In essence, this section now provides that only 10% of certain sums received by a person, such as royalties for the use of intellectual property, are treated as assessable profits.
Some Hong Kong companies are exploiting this provision by entering into arrangements with overseas associates to reduce their profits tax liabilities. A Hong Kong company can, for example, sell a trademark to an overseas associate and then, in exchange for a royalty payment, continue to use the trademark in Hong Kong. The Hong Kong company's royalty expenses would be tax-deductible but only 10% of the royalty received by the overseas associate would be liable to profits tax.
The Bill would provide that where a relevant payment is derived from an associate, the full amount (rather than the present 10%) would be treated as assessable profits. To prevent revenue loss, the Bill would take effect from the day following the Budget speech, that is to say from 4 March 1993.
During the Budget debate, some Members of this Council suggested that the Bill could adversely affect the legitimate importation of technology into Hong Kong. I believe that, for two reasons, this would be unlikely. First, the amendments are only directed at arrangements where associated parties are involved. Second, the measures should not result in any general increase in costs to non-resident technology exporters or technology users in Hong Kong. This is because Hong Kong tax paid by a non-resident will generally give rise to a foreign tax credit in his home country.
2924 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
Following the Budget debate, certain Members of this Council and professionals within the financial community also expressed reservations over the use of the term "associate" in the Bill. They suggested that the term as used in the Bill was not specific enough, and could discourage genuine transactions involving the transfer of patents or trademarks within bona fide multi-national companies with branches in Hong Kong. The Bill now before Honourable Members has been amended to address this concern.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
EDUCATION (AMENDMENT) BILL 1993
THE SECRETARY FOR EDUCATION AND MANPOWER moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Education Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move the Second Reading of the Education (Amendment) Bill 1993.
The Education Ordinance was enacted in 1971 on the basis of an earlier (1952) Ordinance. The present Bill seeks to remove out-of-date provisions and redundancies and to propose additions to take account of more recent developments in the education field.
Regarding the general tidying up of provisions, the Bill proposes to delete section 4 which sets out the responsibility of the Director of Education to superintend matters relating to education in Hong Kong. There are two reasons for this proposal. First, separate bodies or authorities have been created to be responsible for some specific sectors of the education system, such as the Vocational Training Council for technical education and vocational training, the University and Polytechnic Grants Committee for the funding of the tertiary education institutions and the Hong Kong Examinations Authority for public examinations. Secondly, it is not the normal practice to set out the functions of a head of department in legislation.
The move towards more division of labour within the education community has also made it necessary to make minor amendments to the provisions in section 7 of the principal Ordinance relating to the Board of Education, to take account of the present functions of other advisory bodies within the education field.
Section 14 of the Ordinance sets out the grounds on which the Director may refuse to register schools. Some of these grounds are repetitive and we propose to streamline them. Others, such as the provision enabling the Director to refuse registration for political reasons, are no longer appropriate. Similarly, the provisions under sections 68 and 69 which give the Director and the Governor in Council additional or special powers to refuse or cancel the
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2925 registration of teachers are no longer necessary. We propose to repeal these provisions.
The Bill also proposes to streamline the system for registering school managers under sections 23 to 26. At present applicants have to be accepted as approved school managers first before they can apply for registration as such. This procedure was originally intended to provide a pool of persons suitable to be managers (somewhat akin to the Jury List), but has proved to give rise to unnecessary work in practice, because no one applies for approval unless he or she wishes to be registered as a manager of a particular school. A single stage process is therefore proposed instead.
The Bill proposes new definitions for different levels of education to accord with the usual age of entry and duration for nursery, kindergarten, primary and secondary education.
Under section 17 of the Ordinance, there is a provision that the Director shall not, without the consent of the Governor, register any school which provides post-secondary education. The involvement of the Governor is no longer necessary and the Bill proposes to delete this requirement.
Turning to clarifications and new provisions, the Bill proposes to give the Director new powers to inspect and remove documents from suspected unregistered schools. At present he has the power to do so only in respect of registered schools. Removal of this lacuna will enable the Director to tackle more effectively the problems posed by unregistered schools. The Bill also seeks to empower the Director to take action against unregistered schools which claim falsely to be registered schools in advertisements. The absence of such a provision now has hampered attempts to exercise proper control over illegal schools.
Experience has shown up another lacuna. The Director has the power to refuse, at the time of registration, a school name that he considers inappropriate or too similar to that of an existing school. However he does not have this power when registered schools wish to change their names. The Bill proposes to fill this gap.
The Bill also seeks to introduce a new provision to strengthen school management. In the subvented sector, each school is operated by a registered association or company commonly referred to as a sponsoring body, which holds title to the land and school building. At present, the Ordinance only provides for school management committees which run the schools on behalf of the sponsoring bodies. The Bill proposes to give sponsoring bodies appropriate powers in appointing and dismissing school managers and supervisors. By formalizing the role of the sponsoring body in the school management hierarchy, this amendment will help to facilitate the implementation of the School Management Initiative.
2926 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
The Bill also proposes to add to the definition of a "school". At present, an operation providing education to less than 20 students during any one day is not required to be registered as a school. There is increasing public concern that private tutorial centres which make use of this opportunity by operating in small domestic premises in high-rise buildings do not sufficiently safeguard the safety and the interests of students. We propose to limit the number of students who can be taught in such circumstances at any time during the day to less than eight while retaining the present provision of not requiring operations involving less than 20 students on any one day to be registered. This change will not affect interest groups, such as those run by voluntary agencies, which offer courses of a non-academic nature.
Mr President, the Administration has consulted the Board of Education, the Private Schools Association Advisory Board and the Hong Kong Association of Sponsoring Bodies of Schools on the relevant parts of the Bill. They have indicated their support.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
SEWAGE TUNNELS (STATUTORY EASEMENTS) BILL
THE SECRETARY FOR PLANNING, ENVIRONMENT AND LANDS moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to provide for the creation of easements and other rights over land in favour of the Crown for the purpose of the construction, maintenance and operation of sewage tunnels; and for connected matters."
He said: Mr President, I move the Second Reading of the Sewage Tunnels (Statutory Easons) Bill. I beg your pardon, Statutory Easements Bill. Please excuse that slip, Mr President, due possibly to the subconscious feeling that I have given Members their money's worth this afternoon. The Bill seeks to empower the Government to construct and operate deep underground tunnels which will pass beneath private land. These tunnels are required as part of the long-term strategy for sewage collection, treatment and disposal to transport sewage to major treatment works before disposal through an oceanic outfall.
Under common law, the Government has no power to construct or operate tunnels under private land unless either the owner agrees or the rights to do so have been reserved by the Government in the lease. An alternative would be to provide through legislation for the resumption of underground strata but because the sewage tunnels will be very deep underground, usually more than 100 metres below the surface, resumption is not necessary. Given existing tunnelling technology, the actual effect of the tunnels on private property or private development rights should be minimal or nil. We therefore propose that the Government should be provided with the necessary powers through legislation to permit the construction and operation of the tunnels.
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2927
The system provided for in the Bill involves four main aspects. The first is the preparation and gazetting of plans. A plan will be prepared showing the proposed route of a sewage tunnel and the land situated on the route in respect of which easements and other rights in favour of the Government may be created. Notice of the plan, together with details of, for example, the land affected and the right to object will be published in the Gazette. If there are no objections, an order creating the easements will be made and gazetted.
Second, as regards objections, the creation of easements might be seen as reducing the value of land. People having an interest in land situated on the route of a tunnel and registered in the Land Registry should therefore have the right to object to the route. And if there are objections, the possibility of changing the route should be explored. Unwithdrawn objections will be put to the Governor in Council for decision. If the objections are not upheld, an order creating the easements will be gazetted. The Governor in Council may also order that the plan be modified before easements are authorized and gazetted.
On the basis of current engineering knowledge and experience, the indications are that the tunnel works should cause little or no damage. Nevertheless, it would only be fair to provide for compensation in cases of proven loss or damage. Thus the third aspect of the Bill relates to compensation. Any person who claims to suffer loss or damage to property beneath which an easement has been created or a tunnel constructed by virtue of the provisions of the Bill may seek compensation. The grounds for possible claims, as well as the procedures for and timing of claims, are provided for in the Bill. In general, these provisions are along the lines of other legislation which provides for compensation for reduction in the value of land.
Finally, as regards protection of the tunnels, the Bill amends the Buildings Ordinance to empower the Building Authority to refuse approval or impose conditions in respect of building works which are incompatible with tunnel works under the Bill. A decision of the Building Authority may provide grounds for claiming compensation under the Bill.
Mr President, the sewage tunnels are an integral part of our sewage strategy and will contribute significantly to our solution to the water pollution problem, particularly in the central harbour. The Bill is an essential step prior to the commencement of the construction of the tunnels in late 1994. I commend it to Members for favourable consideration.
Thank you, Mr President.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
2928 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 COMPANIES (AMENDMENT) (NO. 3) BILL 1993
THE SECRETARY FOR FINANCIAL SERVICES moved the Second Reading of: "A Bill to amend the Companies Ordinance."
He said: Mr President, I move the Second Reading of the Companies (Amendment) (No. 3) Bill 1993.
This Bill repeals the existing provisions of the Companies Ordinance on disqualification of company directors and introduces provisions that are more extensive and more readily enforceable. It also contains a few minor provisions to streamline the operation and administration of the Ordinance.
The concept of disqualifying directors and persons involved in the management of companies is not new to the Ordinance. The existing sections 157E and F stipulate circumstances under which the court may disqualify such persons for up to five years from participating either directly or indirectly in the management of a company. The relevant circumstances include those where a person has been convicted of an indictable offence in connection with the promotion, formation or management of a company; has been persistently in breach of his obligation under the Ordinance, or it appears to the court, in the course of a winding up, has been guilty of fraud or any breach of his duty as an officer of the company. Under section 157F, a person who has been a director of two companies which have gone into liquidation within five years of each other and that person's conduct as a director of those companies makes him unfit to be concerned in the management of a company may also be disqualified.
These existing sections are modelled on provisions in United Kingdom legislation which have since been superseded by the Company Directors Disqualification Act 1986. This Act was introduced to provide measures which were more effective and more readily enforceable against company directors who abused their office or who paid little regard to their statutory obligations. The existing provisions in the Companies Ordinance suffer from the same inherent weaknesses as the earlier United Kingdom legislation in that, for example, they provide the court with the maximum discretion but little guidance as to the specific circumstances that would merit disqualification, and they set preconditions for action to be taken that are unnecessarily stringent. Since the Company Directors Disqualification Act was introduced in the United Kingdom, however, there have been a considerable number of disqualification orders made under it and the United Kingdom Insolvency Service firmly believes that the legislation has had a beneficial effect in impressing on officers of companies the need for vigilance and diligence in complying with their statutory and common law duties.
The new provisions in the Companies (Amendment) (No. 3) Bill are based upon the Company Directors Disqualification Act. They represent a significant advance on the existing provisions by prescribing more specific measures to deal with the problem of directors' misconduct. In relation to insolvencies, for
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example, it will no longer be a precondition that a person must be involved as a director in two insolvent companies within five years before a disqualification order may be made. Instead, it will be mandatory that an order be made by the court if a person is or has been a director of one company which has become insolvent and if, in the opinion of the court, his conduct as a director of that company either alone, or taken together with his conduct as a director of any other companies, makes him unfit to be concerned in the management of a company. An application for an order under this particular section may be made by the Financial Secretary or if he directs, in the case of a company being wound up by the court, by the Official Receiver. The Bill also introduces a separate schedule outlining matters to which the court should have regard in determining the unfitness of directors. These new provisions should help to prevent unscrupulous directors from simply starting up again in a similar vein without any concern for creditors who may be subsequently left empty-handed as a result of their irresponsible or cynical conduct.
The Bill also provides that the Financial Secretary may apply for a disqualification order to be made if it appears from an inspector's report under section 146 of the Ordinance or from documents or information obtained under sections 152A or B, that it is in the public interest that a person should be disqualified.
While other provisions of the Bill parallel more closely the grounds for disqualification under the existing sections 157E and F, they are more sharply focussed and provide greater assistance to the court. It is, for example, made clear that where a court may make a disqualification order in the course of prosecution of an offence, the court may itself take the initiative to make such an order without waiting for an application.
Under the various provisions of the Bill, disqualification orders may range from one to 15 years depending upon the seriousness of the misconduct. Such orders may be made not only against persons who are named as office bearers but also against persons who are acting as shadow directors. This concept is not new. The existing sections 157E and F already apply to persons in accordance with whose directors or instructions the directors of a company have been accustomed to act. It is clear that such persons should not be immune from disqualification.
Acting in contravention of a disqualification order will be a criminal offence, as it is under the existing sections, but the Bill also provides that a person who becomes involved in the management of a company while disqualified or who is involved in the management and who follows the instructions of a person whom he knows to be disqualified, may be held personally liable for any debts of the company incurred during the relevant period. Furthermore, the Registrar of Companies will be required to keep a register of disqualification orders which will be accessible to the public upon payment of a suitable fee.
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The proposals have been recommended by the Standing Committee on Company Law Reform after consultation with a number of professional and trade bodies.
The office of a company director is a position that carries considerable influence and, often also, considerable power. The duties attaching to that position are weighty and the public expects quite rightly that directors should accept and discharge the responsibilities of their office conscientiously. This legislation will help to ensure that effective regulatory action may be taken against those who choose to ignore or disdain these responsibilities.
Bill referred to the House Committee pursuant to Standing Order 42(3A).
COMPUTER CRIMES BILL 1992
Resumption of debate on Second Reading which was moved on 1 April 1992 Question on Second Reading proposed.
MR STEVEN POON: Mr President, the Computer Crimes Bill 1992 seeks to amend three Ordinances in order to make certain forms of computer misuse criminal offences. This includes adding a new section to the Telecommunication Ordinance to make it an offence to gain unauthorized access to a computer by means of telecommunication. A new section is also added to the Crimes Ordinance to make it an offence to gain access to a computer with dishonest intent. The Bill further seeks to amend provisions in the Theft Ordinance and the Crimes Ordinance relating to burglary and criminal damage to properties respectively in order to cover such acts in relation to a computer, its data or any programme held in a computer. Other provisions in these two Ordinances are also amended to make it clear that offences of false accounting, forgery and making a false entry in a bank book apply to information stored in a computer.
The Bill was introduced into this Council on 1 April 1992. A subcommittee of 13 members was formed on 9 October 1992 to study the Bill. Altogether we had eight meetings, including five with the Administration. We met representatives from the banking, accounting and computer professions and considered submissions from 10 interested organizations. As chairman of the subcommittee I would like to take the earliest opportunity to thank my colleagues in the subcommittee for the time and effort they put into the discussion, the Administration for their co-operation, and the interested organizations for submitting their views and taking part in our deliberations.
Mr President, I now come to the major issues considered by the subcommittee. The main question about the Bill, which has been thoroughly considered by the subcommittee, is whether the term "computer" should be defined. Some organizations favour defining "computer" to remove possible
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ambiguity. They consider that an appropriate definition can make the law more easily understood and assist in prosecution. Accordingly, a number of definitions are proposed. On the other hand, views against defining "computer" in general centre around the difficulty in finding a suitable definition which can adequately and accurately define a computer and can withstand the test of time.
In particular, the Administration considers that the definition is not only unnecessary but also undesirable for the following reasons: (a) The meaning of a computer is reasonably easy to understand. It would be risky to tie it down at the time of drafting legislation as the speed of new development in computer technology will quickly cause any definition to become outdated; (b) By defining "computer" unnecessarily this will place a constraint in every case and a definition will be used by the defendant to attempt to raise a doubt. If it is not defined the court can refer to its common meaning and seek expert advice if necessary; (c) The Computer Crimes Unit of London Metropolitan Police in New Scotland Yard has confirmed that they have not experienced any difficulty in prosecution due to the lack of a definition of the term in the Computer Misuse Act 1990; (d) There are practical difficulties in finding an appropriate definition. All the proposed definitions vary in one way or another and it will be difficult to find a satisfactory one to embrace the essence of all these definitions.
After detailed discussion the subcommittee considers it preferable to leave it to the court to decide whether a particular device in the circumstances of the case is a computer or not and agrees with the Administration that the term "computer" should be left undefined.
Another question which has been actively pursued by the subcommittee is what constitutes unauthorized access. The subcommittee holds the view that unauthorized access to computers should not include accidental access such as dialing a wrong number or mistyping a key scenario. To address the subcommittee's concern the Administration has agreed to amend the relevant section by building in an element of intent to the effect that only a person who intentionally obtains access to a programme or data held in a computer without authority will be penalized. The necessary amendment will be moved by the Administration at the Committee stage.
Some organizations have raised the point as to whether the sending of junk fax and electronic mail constitutes unauthorized access. The Administration explains that as fax machines are not normally regarded as computers, the sending of junk fax to fax machines would not be an offence. Neither would the sending of electronic mail to a computer in a public network as there is no restriction on access and consequently no question of authorization will arise. The subcommittee is satisfied with these explanations.
The different levels of penalty have also been discussed. Some organizations consider that the penalty of a fine for unauthorized access is somewhat low and should be brought in line with other offences, such as access
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with criminal intent, by imposing a custodial sentence. The Administration explains that the former offence is created to protect the privacy of legitimate computer users and should be regarded as a regulatory offence for which a custodial sentence will be inappropriate. Access with criminal intent is a more serious offence and will warrant a custodial sentence.
As regards computer related offences of criminal damage and burglary some organizations are concerned that the maximum penalty for such computer misuse is too heavy as the result of "force-fitting" them under the existing offences of criminal damage and burglary. The Administration explains that the level of penalty is appropriate as the criminal nature of the computer related crimes is no different from similar offences under the Crimes Ordinance and the Theft Ordinance. The subcommittee accepts these explanations.
One further point that the subcommittee has expressed concern is the time limit for prosecution. The subcommittee is worried that the provision for the six months time limit for initiating prosecution is unfair to the defendant as the period will be counted from the date on which the Attorney General is satisfied that there is sufficient evidence to warrant prosecution. As the investigation process prior to that period can be rather lengthy, fading memory will put the defendant in a vulnerable position. I am glad to say that the Administration has agreed to amend the relevant section to the effect that the proceedings can be brought any time within three years of the commission of the offence or within six months of its discovery, whichever period expires first. The Administration will move the amendment at the Committee stage.
Apart from the amendments mentioned above the subcommittee has agreed with the Administration on other amendments which are purely technical but are considered necessary for improving the drafting of the relevant provisions. These amendments will be moved by the Administration at the Committee stage.
Finally the subcommittee has suggested that the Bill, if enacted, should be reviewed on account of the following factors: (a) The statutory offences created by the Bill are new; (b) It is necessary to keep pace with rapid technological changes in the computer and telecommunications fields; and (c) Certain aspects of the Bill are related to matters being studied by the Law Reform Commission. We have been given to understand the Secretary for Security will respond to our suggestions in his speech this afternoon.
Mr President, with these remarks, I support the Bill.
SECRETARY FOR SECURITY: Mr President, I should like to thank Mr Steven POON and members of the subcommittee for their thorough and careful study of the Computer Crimes Bill. The Committee stage amendments which I am going to move are the agreed outcome of detailed discussions in the subcommittee.
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I should like first to make some general points on the proposals in the Bill. One question which was raised was why, instead of the present approach of amending a number of existing Ordinances, we did not choose to enact a separate piece of legislation to deal with computer misuse. Both approaches were in fact considered before the present Bill was drafted. Our conclusion was that the present approach has distinct advantages. By fitting computer misuse into existing criminal legislation the existing case law can be applied. The offences we are concerned with are essentially offences of dishonesty or criminal damage and are better dealt with as such.
The question was also raised whether the term "computer" should be defined in the Bill. As Mr POON has explained we believe that to do so would probably cause more problems than it would solve and that it is best left to the prosecution to prove as a matter of fact the device concerned is a computer.
There was also discussion in the subcommittee of the intention behind the new offence of access to a computer with criminal or dishonest intent, proposed in clause 6 of the Bill. This offence is aimed at penalizing access to a computer for acts preparatory but falling short of the commission of a fraud. Examples would include someone obtaining access to computerized bank records to obtain details of credit balances for later fraudulent use or an employee writing instructions to a computer that will result in due course in the computer making automatic payments to his account. Currently such activity would not amount to an offence. Once the fraud is put into effect this section would no longer be relevant as other provisions of the Theft Ordinance will apply.
There has been some concern expressed that this offence could be used to prosecute copyright related activities. The offence has not been designed to tackle copyright related activities, which are regulated under separate legislation. It is the Administration's intention to continue to keep the copyright regime separate and not to use this provision for the prosecution of copyright offences.
I would now like to turn to the amendments which I will move at the Committee stage. The first amendment relates to clause 2 of the Bill. This clause creates an offence of unauthorized access to computer by telecommunication. Some consider it too wide as it covers any unauthorized access including accidental access. Others feel that the time limit for bringing a prosecution under this provision may not be fair to the accused. I accept these comments. In the amendment to be moved we propose to add an element of intent to obtain access to a computer programme or data so that accidental access will be excluded. We also propose to change the time limit for bringing a prosecution, thus shortening the time gap between commission of the offence and prosecution.
In respect of clauses 3 and 7, it has been suggested that the meaning of the criminal act of causing the computer not to function normally is not very clear and that the link between this act and the proviso is difficult to comprehend.
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We intend to rectify this in the amendments to be moved in respect of clauses 3 and 7. The amendments will make it clear, among other things, that destroying or damaging property in relation to a computer includes causing it to function other than it has been established to function, even if this does not impair the operation of the computer.
We also propose to delete clause 4 of the Bill because this clause is no longer necessary. As a result of an amendment to the Crimes Ordinance which became law in June last year, the definition of "document" has already been incorporated into the definition of "instrument" for forgery offences.
The amendment to clause 6 of the Bill concerning access to a computer with criminal or dishonest intent will modify this provision so that it covers access to obtain data in transit in any part of a computer system, with dishonest or criminal intent.
Finally, Mr President, the subcommittee has asked that this legislation should be reviewed after one or two years in the light of experience. Given the rapid advances being made in computer technology I agree that it will be necessary to review this legislation regularly and we certainly intend to do so in the light of experience of its operation. Thank you, Mr President.
Question on the Second Reading of the Bill put and agreed to.
Bill read the Second time.
Bill committed to a Committee of the whole Council pursuant to Standing Order 43(1).
CRIMES (AMENDMENT) (NO. 3) BILL 1992
Resumption of debate on Second Reading which was moved on 11 November 1992 Question on Second Reading proposed.
MR ANDREW WONG: Mr President, the Crimes (Amendment) (No 3) Bill 1992 was introduced in the Legislative Council on 11 November 1992. The purpose of the Bill is to remove capital punishment from our statute books.
On 26 June 1991 this Council voted in favour of the introduction of legislative measures which would abolish the death penalty and replace it with life imprisonment. The Crimes (Amendment) (No 3) Bill 1992 makes adjustments in two Ordinances. First, the Crimes Ordinance and second, the Offences Against the Person Ordinance to the effect that the death penalty is abolished and substituted with the mandatory sentence of life imprisonment.
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In Hong Kong, capital punishment is currently the mandatory penalty for murder, treason and piracy with violence. The death penalty may also be provided for by the Governor in Council under the Emergency Regulations. A Bills Committee was set up to study the Bill. The Bills Committee, chaired by me, has held a total of four meetings only, two of which were with the Administration. The Bills Committee also received written representations from the Hong Kong Bar Association, the Law Society of Hong Kong, and a group called the Hong Kong Citizens Alliance.
The two legal bodies made written representations to the Bills Committee and commented on the aspect of penalty only. Both subscribe to the view that the death penalty ought to be abolished. The Hong Kong Bar Association considers that the only offence for which there should be a mandatory life sentence is that of murder, while the Law Society of Hong Kong is of the view that life imprisonment should only be the maximum sentence, rather than the mandatory sentence, for all three crimes. The Hong Kong Citizens Alliance, on the other hand, is totally against the abolition of capital punishment.
After the first three meetings the Committee arrived at the following conclusions: (1) Capital punishment should be abolished and the substitution should be life imprisonment; (2) For the crime of murder the Committee agrees the substituted penalty should be a mandatory sentence of life imprisonment; (3) The Committee holds no strong views as to whether (a) the existing review procedure for long-term prison sentences, on the basis of a report from the trial judge, should be retained or, (b) the court should be allowed to attach a rider in open court recommending the minimum period to be served prior to the consideration being given to the question of the release of the person sentenced; (4) For the crimes of treason and piracy with violence the Committee is, however, of the view that they are offences of a category entirely different from murder and hence a discretionary life sentence should be the preferred substitution.
By virtue of Article XV of the Letters Patent, the Governor may grant to any offender, convicted of any crime or offence, a pardon or any remission of the sentence passed on such offender. The Board of Review of Long Term Prison Sentences is an administrative body set up to review sentences of all prisoners in the categories prescribed by Prison Rule 69(a) and to tender advice to the Governor on the exercise of prerogative. The paramount function of the Board is to examine the circumstances pertaining to a prisoner at the time of the review to determine whether any change to his sentence would be justified. Currently for prisoners aged 21 or over at the date of conviction, and who have been sentenced to life imprisonment or for a prison term of 10 years or more, the review of sentence will be conducted initially after five years and subsequently every two years thereafter. Members of the Bills Committee felt strongly that provision for the formalization of the Board of Review of Long Term Prison Sentences should be included in legislation with the Board's composition and duties clearly spelt out.
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Now these views of the Bills Committee were conveyed to the Administration, which after reverting to the Executive Council, responded in March to the points raised by the Bills Committee. The Administration agrees that the penalty for treason and piracy with violence should be changed to a discretionary life sentence and agrees to support two amendments to be moved later today at Committee stage by me. The Committee also accepts the Administration's recommendation that the existing review system should continue to operate for the mandatory sentence of life imprisonment for the crime of murder and also for other long-term sentences. The Administration agrees that the Board of Review of Long Term Prison Sentences should be made a statutory body but considers it inappropriate to effect the change in the current Bill, which deals with the abolition of the death sentence rather than the review and remission system. The Administration, however, has undertaken to make a public commitment to the effect that necessary legislative provision would be made in a separate Bill to be introduced in the 1993-94 Session.
Mr President, I now wish to finally say that I am an abolitionist and I am proud to be one. I do not intend to bore Members with a long exposition of my views, which can be found in Hansard for 26 June 1991. This Bill is long overdue. I am indeed honoured to be the Member to help steer it through.
Mr President, with these remarks, I commend the Crimes (Amendment) (No 3) Bill 1992 to Honourable Members.
MR CHIM PUI-CHUNG (in Cantonese): Mr President, death penalty is one of the issues which Hong Kong people have shown deepest concern. Death sentences have been meted out in our courts from time to time but then commuted without exception. We, both as members of the community and Legislative Councillors, have to understand that the Bill of Rights, which was enacted not long ago, protects our human rights. Yet, with the abolition of the death penalty, the human rights of offenders are safeguarded but not their victims. This is actually in breach of the Bill of Rights. That is to say, the abolition of the death penalty is in principle against the Bill of Rights. What comes to your mind when you see an awe-inspiring criminal wielding an AK47 rifle on the street? Will you support the abolition of the death penalty?
Secondly, China is pursuing an open policy and apparently social development will lead to an increase in crimes. If the death penalty is abolished in Hong Kong, offenders across the border would certainly regard it as an invitation to them to come and commit crimes in the territory. As representatives of the Hong Kong people, we always ask China's public security authorities to assist Hong Kong and co-operate with our law enforcement authority to curb these criminal activities before the situation gets out of hand. However, we, on the other hand, ask for the abolition of the death penalty. This is in fact indirectly encouraging the criminals and enticing offenders of serious crimes to challenge our law which we want to maintain.
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Thirdly, as we all know, some so-called liberal Members are quite inclined to learn from foreign countries, especially the United States. In this connection, I would like to draw their attention to the fact that the United States carried out an execution last year. This clearly demonstrates, by the example of such a world leader, that the abolition of the death penalty is not necessarily a common feature in a land of freedom or democracy.
Fourthly, we will later have a debate on Mr SZETO Wah's motion to see whether we should hold a referendum on the electoral arrangements. In fact, the death penalty is even of greater immediate concern to all Hong Kong people. I personally think that it would be more appropriate to hold a territory-wide referendum on the abolition of the death penalty so that we can know whether Hong Kong people support or oppose the death penalty. This seems to be more practical than just leaving a matter of our people's immediate concern to be decided by any lawmaker or any of our Members. For this reason, I think "whether we should abolish the death penalty" is a much worthy topic for a referendum.
Fifthly, whatever happens, Hong Kong will become a Special Administrative Region of China after 1997 when it is returned to China (at least in terms of sovereignty). So far capital punishment is still carried out in China (what happens in the future is another story). With this in mind, I see no point to challenge our future sovereign state through this piece of legislation. In what way will it benefit Hong Kong people? I think it is futile if one wishes to make political capital out of such a piece of legislation.
Mr President, some Members may turn a deaf ear to the five points I just now cited because they have already made up their mind when it comes to casting their vote. Yet, if they really work in the interests of the people, it is, in any case, never too late to change their mind at this moment. As a matter of fact, Mr President, I share the view that death penalty should be abolished ultimately. But, given the present situation, the abolition of capital punishment will only spawn confusion in Hong Kong during the transition period. We should really think twice about this matter. Some Members have asked me to mention their names in my speech to show that they support my opposition against the Bill. These Members include Mr TAM Yiu-chung and Mrs Peggy LAM.
Mr President, with these remarks, I oppose the abolition of the death penalty.
MR SIMON IP: Mr President, the Crimes (Amendment) (No. 3) Bill is a very important Bill making a significant amendment to the criminal law. While I am strongly in favour of the abolition of the death penalty, I am doubtful whether a mandatory life sentence is most appropriate.
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Nobody will deny that murder is a most serious crime for which the penalty should carry unequivocally the most serious social denunciation of the offence. Nor should the deterrent effect of the penalty be diminished given our recent concern for deteriorating law and order. However, even after taking these considerations into account, I doubt whether a mandatory life sentence is indeed the appropriate punishment for murder, for it runs against two cherished principles of our criminal justice system.
Foremost, to impose the identical penalty upon all persons convicted of an offence — irrespective of their different circumstances, motives and intention — can create injustice. Mercy-killings do not carry the same culpability as callous robbers killing an innocent pedestrian on a crowded street. To put these two situations on the same par deprives the vital discretion available to a judge to hand down a sentence that fits the crime.
Secondly, a mandatory life sentence imposed by a judge coupled with a review and remission of the sentence carried out by the executive will blur the separation of powers between the judiciary and the executive.
If we rely on remission to mitigate the harshness of a mandatory life sentence, we are in effect asking the executive to perform a function which properly falls within the jurisdiction of the courts. Judges in murder cases will have little say in how long the prison term should be, other than submitting a report on the case together with their recommendation on the minimum period of imprisonment which will form part of the consideration of the Board of Review. It will primarily be the executive, through the Board of Review and the Governor in Council, who will exercise the function of sentencing by determining when convicted prisoners should be released.
Because these two important principles are at stake, it seems to me that a better alternative is simply to have a discretionary life sentence. The Law Society is of a similar opinion.
Subject to the reservations mentioned, I support the Bill.
DR LAM KUI-CHUN (in Cantonese): Mr President, the few crimes that attract the mandatory sentence of capital punishment in Hong Kong have all along been regarded as heinous crimes, whatever their gravity. Nowadays, social attitudes have changed significantly. These crimes can no longer be lumped together to come under a blanket definition of heinousness. Among these crimes which attract capital punishment, treason, for example, has as its objective the change of government and the leadership. As such it is a right of the people in a democratic context, unless it involves the now rare collaboration with outside forces in acts of subversion. In many countries, it is a fundamental human right provided for under the constitution. In presentday Hong Kong, attempted treason normally means no more than the holding of a different political opinion. It is a manifestation of the diversified thinking of the community as
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well as a healthy social phenomenon. The so-called acts of "treason" in the past should be legalized today. Some people in Hong Kong harbour the fear that the future government of Hong Kong might one day invoke this statute to persecute people holding a different political opinion. The abolition of capital punishment by this Council today for the crime of treason is welcomed by many Hong Kong people.
Piracy with violence in the presentday world is no different from robbery with violence on land or in the air. Recently, all cases of robbery at sea committed on vessels inbound for or outbound from Hong Kong happened outside Hong Kong's jurisdiction. To maintain different penalties between robbery with violence at sea and on land will be out of keeping with the times. I am in favour of the maximum penalty for robbery with violence at sea or in the air being made equivalent to that for robbery with violence on land. Capital punishment for these crimes will not be necessary. The keeping of life imprisonment as maximum penalty, especially when the courts are prepared to exercise it, will achieve an appropriate degree of deterrent effect.
The general public of Hong Kong and many Members of this Council however hold contradictory views about murder. While I do not intend to extend here the exhaustive debate Council Members had conducted on this matter in the last Session, I should like to raise three points for the record. Firstly, from the angle of the criminal, in the absence of capital punishment as a deterrent, it would be safer and more to his benefit if he were to kill the victim so as to remove a principal witness after he had committed the crime of wounding or robbery, especially if he was at a stand-off with the police. It is reported that the going rate charged by triads in Hong Kong for taking out a contract for murder is cheaper than that for wounding. That killing the victim so that a dead person cannot talk would be more to the benefit of the criminal would lead to more innocent people such as hostages being killed. Regardless of the statistical data of European countries and the United States, we should do our best to minimize the probability of murder in Hong Kong society through legislation. Secondly, from the angle of the victim, especially a hostage held captive, the absence of capital punishment would remove his/her last and only line of protection in saying: "If you kill me, you will pay with your life". A number of victims have told me that the realization that the murderer would have to pay with his life was their only consolation at the most dangerous and helpless moment. Thirdly, to the Hong Kong community as a whole, it is regarded right and proper that a murderer has to forfeit his life, whatever the laws of other countries may otherwise provide. It is utterly unfair for a murderer not having to pay with his life. The law sees to it that justice is done, but it must also see to it that justice is being seen to be done. It would constitute a major threat to the safety of witnesses having testified in court if the murderer were to have the opportunity of revenge on release after serving his sentence. In recent years, the execution of capital punishment has been restored in many civilized countries such as the United States. The general public of Hong Kong will feel that the abolition of the death penalty for murder is a piece of unfair and retrogressive legislation. In view of the current public opinion in
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Hong Kong, we need to restore the execution of capital punishment rather than abolishing it, if we are really to practise democracy.
Mr President, I think that: (1) the death penalty should be abolished for acts of treason which should eventually be legalized if they do not involve collaboration with outside forces and the crime of treason should be dealt with the way murder is dealt with if it involves the killing of political personalities; (2) the death penalty can be abolished for piracy with violence, but the punishment for robbery with violence at sea, on land and in the air should eventually be the same; (3) as to murder, I share the opinion of the majority of Hong Kong Chinese that the death penalty should not be abolished and that execution of capital punishment should be restored.
Mr President, I so submit.
MRS PEGGY LAM (in Cantonese): Mr President, first I would like to thank Mr CHIM Pui-chung for expressing my cherished views in his speech. I did ask him to speak for me but later I thought that such an issue was too important. If I only relied on Mr CHIM alone without personally voicing any support, it would be unfair to many Hong Kong people. A lot of people in Hong Kong have often told me that law and order here is getting worse and worse. Criminals commit armed robberies and wound people with firearms. They ignore the law of Hong Kong and are totally indifferent to the police. Such a situation makes the people of Hong Kong very worried. We do have a very brave and excellent Police Force who are willing to undertake all risks in maintaining law and order in Hong Kong. Yet we are not giving them enough support in terms of laws to facilitate the effective discharge of their duties. The police arrest culprits and murderers after a painstaking effort but the courts let them get off lightly. Is this a correct way to maintain law and order, prosperity and stability of a society? Capital punishment is the only penalty which will have some effect. If we abolish this penalty, what else will the culprits be afraid of? I think if the present Bill to remove capital punishment is passed here this afternoon, many people will be celebrating this like mad somewhere else.
Hong Kong is generally described as a shoppers' paradise; yet there are also many people telling me that Hong Kong is no longer so. It is because prices here are not low any more while there are many other places which have lower prices than Hong Kong. However, Hong Kong today is still a paradise. What kind of paradise is it? It is the paradise for criminals. They can come to Hong Kong to "pull a job" but do not need to receive the penalty they deserve. We need democracy, we heed human rights. I think nobody will deny that the United States is the most democratic country, and it is also a country which most emphasizes human rights. Nevertheless, at present among the 52 states of America, 37 of them, which means over half of the total number, have capital punishment on their statute books and have also carried it out. Can we then say that since the United States carries out capital punishment, it is therefore not a democratic country, and does not respect human rights?
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Criminologists believe that the death penalty has a certain degree of deterring effect. The Chinese have a philosophical saying that "All murderers have to die". We are nurtured in the Chinese culture. Despite the fact that Hong Kong is a British colony, 99% of our population is Chinese. We Chinese all believe in Chinese philosophy. However, today in this Council, public opinion is being totally ignored. If we conduct a questionnaire on the street about whether the public supports the abolition of capital punishment, I believe that the result will be that nine out of 10 or over 90% of the interviewees will say, "How can capital punishment be abolished?" If this is so, how can we still live in Hong Kong? We do not need any other reasons for our leaving Hong Kong or migrating elsewhere, because just this point is more than enough to make us fainthearted and dare not continue living in Hong Kong. Therefore, Mr President, I have to deliver these words today at this eleventh hour because I earnestly hope that our colleagues can think carefully before they cast their votes later on. The abolition of capital punishment is definitely unfavourable to Hong Kong. We who shall continue to live in Hong Kong without migrating to other countries have to think for the 6 million population. We need to have stability and prosperity. I hope later on Members will follow their conscience in casting their votes.
Mr President, I am opposed to the abolition of capital punishment absolutely.
SECRETARY FOR SECURITY: Mr President, the Administration supports the amendments to be moved by Mr Andrew WONG to clauses 2 and 4 of the Bill. We agree that the offences of treason and piracy with violence are different in nature from murder and that a discretionary rather than a mandatory life sentence is the appropriate penalty for these two offences.
I also accept the wish of the Bills Committee that the Board of Review of Long Term Prison Sentences should be made statutory and that its duties, procedures and guidelines be set out clearly in legislation. It would not, however, be appropriate to provide for this in the present Bill which deals with the abolition of the death penalty. Instead I will seek to introduce a separate Bill in the next Session of this Council to establish a statutory board. The functions of such a board will be same as those of the present Board of Review, that is, to review the sentences of all prisoners aged 21 or above at the date of their conviction and serving prison sentences of 10 years or more; of all prisoners under 21 at the date of their conviction serving determinate sentences; and of all those under 18 at the time the offence was committed detained at Her Majesty's pleasure. The board will advise the Governor on the exercise of his prerogative to remit in these cases.
Thank you, Mr President.
2942 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 Question on the Second Reading of the Bill put.
Voice vote taken.
MR CHIM PUI-CHUNG (in Cantonese): Mr President, I claim a division.
PRESIDENT: Council will proceed to a division. The division bell will ring for three minutes.
PRESIDENT: Would Members now please proceed to vote?
PRESIDENT: Are there any queries? If not, the results will be displayed.
The Chief Secretary, the Attorney General, the Financial Secretary, Mr Allen LEE, Mrs Selina CHOW, Mr HUI Yin-fat, Mr Martin LEE, Mr PANG Chun-hoi, Mr SZETO Wah, Mr Andrew WONG, Mr Edward HO, Mr Ronald ARCULLI, Mr Martin BARROW, Dr LEONG Che-hung, Mrs Elsie TU, Mr Peter WONG, Mr Albert CHAN, Mr Vincent CHENG, Mr CHEUNG Man-kwong, Rev FUNG Chi-wood, Mr Frederick FUNG, Mr Timothy HA, Mr Michael HO, Dr HUANG Chen-ya, Mr Simon IP, Dr Conrad LAM, Mr LAU Chin-shek, Miss Emily LAU, Mr LEE Wing-tat, Mr Eric LI, Mr Fred LI, Mr MAN Sai-cheong, Mr Steven POON, Mr TIK Chi-yuen, Mr James TO, Dr Samuel WONG, Dr YEUNG Sum, Mr WONG Wai-yin, Mr Roger LUK and Ms Anna WU voted for the motion.
Mr Stephen CHEONG, Mr NGAI Shiu-kit, Mr TAM Yiu-chung, Mrs Peggy LAM, Mr Marvin CHEUNG, Mr CHIM Pui-chung, Dr LAM Kui-chun, Dr Philip WONG and Dr TANG Siu-tong voted against the motion.
Mrs Miriam LAU and Mr LAU Wah-sum abstained.
THE PRESIDENT announced that there were 40 votes in favour of the motion and nine votes against it. He therefore declared that the motion on the Second Reading of the Bill was carried.
Bill read the Second time.
Bill committed to a Committee of the whole Council pursuant to Standing Order 43(1).
HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993 2943 PROTECTION OF WOMEN AND JUVENILES (AMENDMENT) BILL 1992 Resumption of debate on Second Reading which was moved on 8 April 1992 Question on Second Reading proposed.
MR WONG WAI-YIN (in Cantonese): Mr President, as the convenor of the ad hoc group to examine this Bill, I have to thank all the group members for having spent a considerable amount of time and provided many valuable opinions. I am also grateful to the Administration for the many assistances provided during the examination of the Bill, even though our views diverged in some matters. As I said, the group and the Administration were divided on some matters; so I will explain in detail where the differences lay, such that Members of this Council will have more information for consideration during the Committee stage.
The Bill before us has two main objectives. One is to widen the coverage of situations where children or juveniles are regarded as in need of care or protection, to the effect that the authorities concerned can issue care and protection orders under the amended Protection of Women and Juveniles Ordinance in cases of mental abuse and lack of care. The other is to add into the Ordinance a provision for a child assessment procedure, which requires the Director of Social Welfare to arrange for a medical or psychological examination on the child concerned whenever the Director is in doubt as to whether or not the child needs care or protection, and to consider the report of the examination before deciding whether or not to issue a child protection order. The Bill also requires the Director to make application to a court within 48 hours of the removal or detention of a child or juvenile under the Ordinance.
This Bill was introduced to this Council on 8 April 1992. The ad hoc group responsible for studying the Bill has had eight meetings to discuss the content of the Bill with the Administration. The group has also examined six submissions and met with five outside organizations including those of the legal and welfare professions for exchanging views on the Bill. The group and these outside organizations in general support the main purpose of the Bill, but there have been fundamental differences between the Administration and the group on matters like how to protect children. This explains why it has taken a whole year for the group to discuss with the Administration in the hope of reaching a consensus on those contentious matters.
Our existing laws for the protection of children have a shortcoming, which is that the relevant provisions are scattered in different Ordinances. The welfare and legal sectors have for years expressed concern at this problem. The ad hoc group thought that in order to better serve the purpose of protecting children, Hong Kong should have an "omnibus" Ordinance which included all the provisions relevant to the protection of children, like the Child Act 1989 of
2944 HONG KONG LEGISLATIVE COUNCIL — 21 April 1993
the United Kingdom. However, the Administration's response to this proposal was that it was not feasible because the relevant Ordinances covered different matters, so that it would be very difficult to extract only the provisions relevant to children and combine them into a separate Ordinance. Besides, it would take a lot of time for the relevant review, and it would be a very difficult task both in terms of time and resources. Nevertheless, the Administration agreed in principle that a consolidation Ordinance for the protection of children should ideally be enacted, and it would study this possibility. The ad hoc group was not fully satisfied with the explanation by the Administration, but we understood that such a study would take a long time, and could be conducted separately later. So we accepted the Administration's views in order to avoid delaying the passage of this Bill.
Mr President, I will now report to this Council the views of the ad hoc group on the two most controversial provisions of the Bill.
The first one is clause 6(c), which lists the four preconditions for deciding whether a child can be regarded as being in need of care and protection. In these preconditions, the word "significantly" has been added before the word "neglected". The ad hoc group thought that the word "significantly" was too subjective and might cause confusion during enforcement. Furthermore, neglecting a child was a very serious matter, and the addition of "significantly" would pitch the minimum criteria at much too high a level for deciding that a child needed care and protection such that the interest of children might not be fully protected. To avoid any possible uncertainty in the meaning of "significantly", the ad hoc group suggested the deletion of the word. The Administration's explanation on this point was that the word "significantly" was to describe the extent of the lack of care and prevent the Director of Social Welfare and the police from having too much discretionary power. So the deletion of the word would render the proposed section 34(2) applicable to all the lack of-care situations, regardless of their seriousness. The Administration pointed out that such situations might even include leaving children unattended at home. If the Ordinance empowered the law enforcement bodies to exercise, in the case of children being unattended at home, the power under the Ordinance by removing such children, that would obviously be contrary to the public's views, since the public consultation conducted earlier by the Administration showed that the public was not supportive of penalizing the parents who had left their children unattended at home. The Administration also cautioned that the over expansion of coverage caused by the deletion might also lead to the problem of abuse. The ad hoc group found the explanation of the Administration unconvincing, since members were generally worried that the word "significantly" might lead to the criteria being pitched at too high a level, which was not instrumental in ensuring children's interest. The ad hoc group thought that the Administration's worry of abuse of power was groundless. Generally speaking, the public has confidence in the professional ethics of our social workers. The ad hoc group had suggested to the Administration to consider defining that word in the Bill, but the Administration explained that any definition was liable to a subjective
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