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303
Hong Kong
[ 25 OCTOBER 1984]
not think that they would like lightly to turn aside the benefits to them of maintaining the present system in Hong Kong.
Lord Molloy: My Lords, may I put two brief points to the noble Lord? I preface what I have to say by adding my congratulations to the Government on this remarkable achievement; to our Foreign Secretary for his arduous work and massive contribution and of course also to the representives of the Chinese Government for their so generous, sincere and worthwhile response. May I please ask the noble Lord if he can give the House an assurance that the policy which the Government have already adopted of keeping as many of the ordinary people of Hong Kong as possible involved in these negotiations will continue? Secondly, can he say, with regard to the joint liason group, to whom it will be reporting and how often? Also will there be discussions on the reports of the joint liason group?
Lastly, on the question of nationality is going to be very important. Can the noble Lord give some indication as to how it might be tackled in the years to come?
Lord Trefgarne: My Lords, the noble Lord asked how the people of Hong Kong could be involved in this matter. I think I can principally point to the assessment process on which we have embarked. No less than two million copies of the White Paper have been distributed in Hong Kong, most of them I believe in Chinese. Happily, this one is not! Therefore the people of Hong Kong, most of whom speak Chinese, will be able to determine what is proposed and express their views upon it.
As for the joint liaison group, that will report to both Governments from time to time. I am not quite sure with what frequency it is proposed that that group should report. However, if I can find any more information about that, I shall certainly let the noble Lord know.
Lord Fanshawe of Richmond: My Lords, is my noble friend aware that I fully support the comments made by the noble Lord, Lord Shepherd, regarding the result of this very excellent agreement over the future of Hong Kong?-although perhaps I do not share in total the euphoria expressed in some quarters.
I want to ask the Minister two brief questions, one of which he may be able to answer and the other which he may not. What is going to be the situation regarding the judiciary in Brunei, which at the moment comes under the judiciary in Hong Kong? Will they continue to be administered from Hong Kong up to the time of the treaty taking effect in 1997, or will there be special arrangements made?
The second point relates to the position of the Brigade of Gurkhas. The battalion of Gurkhas which is stationed in Brunei is administered and run from Hong Kong. What will be their position in the future? I ask this question because my noble friend is a Minister in the Ministry of Defence and I thought that this might be an appropriate time to raise the subject of the Brigade of Gurkhas.
Lord Trefgarne: My Lords, it is clear from the agreement that the question of the defence of Hong
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Kong will pass to the Chinese Government in 1997. So there will be no question of the Gurkhas remaining in Hong Kong after that time.
As regards the judiciary, I am aware that there have also been some changes in Brunei recently. I therefore suspect that the arrangements after 1997 will be different from what they are now. However, I fear I was caught slightly on the hop with that question. If my noble friend will allow me, I will see what additional information I can find and convey it to him.
The Earl of Bessborough: My Lords, having been in the People's Republic of China during the final stages of these negotiations, and indeed at Shanghai at the time of the initialling of the text, is my noble friend aware how remarkably well this joint declaration was received, not only by the mainland Chinese but also, as I have found in Hong Kong-by many of our friends there who had perhaps been doubtful and anxious at the outset? I do not know whether the noble Lord is aware of this, but it was very striking that in the course of the protracted negotiations with Chinese corporations they were constantly referring to the entrepreneurial ability of the British in Hong Kong and the British in this country. I hope the Minister is aware of that. It struck me very forcibly that both sides to this agreement seemed to receive it remarkably well.
Lord Trefgarne: My Lords, I am grateful to my noble friend. I think his remarks underline what I said earlier, that there are some advantages to both sides in the agreement that has been reached.
Lord Caccia: My Lords, as an old China hand, having served there over 50 years ago, may I from these Benches, add my words of congratulation upon the agreement that has been reached and to the people who have been engaged in it? It is a remarkable agreement. I cannot speak for those on these Benches but I should not want them to remain silent on such an occasion.
Lord Soames: My Lords, is my noble friend aware that this is a great achievement for the diplomacy both of Her Majesty's Government and of the Government of the People's Republic? As to the longer term future, this must surely depend upon the awareness of the People's Republic of China of Hong Kong's importance for them as well as for the people of Hong Kong. Her Majesty's Government will have a considerable part to play in the next 10 or 15 years in assuring that awareness.
Lord Trefgarne: My Lords, I am grateful to my noble friend for that observation. It is indeed great achievement for British diplomacy. I fancy it is almost as great an achievement as the one four years ago in which my noble friend played such a distinguished part.
4.59 p.m.
Buses
Lord Teviot rose to ask Her Majesty's Government what action they are proposing to take following the publication of the White Paper on Buses (Cmnd. 9300).
No comments yet.
Private notes are available after approval.