903
Defence
[MR. GILMOUR.]
13 MAY 1974
The right hon. Gentleman will not save much by getting out of Singapore, where the Five-Power arrangements have in their way been extremely valuable. I hope that the right hon. Gentleman will not be motivated by spite or jealousy that our arrangements worked despite the predictions and advice of the Labour Party.
We do not yet know what the intentions of the Americans are towards Diego Garcia, but since they have offered to pay entirely for the improvements I hope that the right hon. Gentleman will con- firm that, if they do wish to go ahead, the Government will not stand in their
way.
Mr. Tam Dalyell (West Lothian): Is it wise to do something against the com- bined wishes of Mrs. Gandhi, Mrs. Bandaranaike, Mr. Bhutto, Mr. Whitlam, President Suharto and many heads of African States which are deeply involved? Why should we go along trailing after Washington on this matter?
Mr. Gilmour: One reason is that we happen to be allies of the Americans.
Mr. Dalyell: The United States Senate Foreign Relations Committee has more sense than the right hon. Gentleman.
Mr. Gilmour: The hon. Gentleman is entitled to his opinion, but I do not think that the Committee is as ordered by the hon. Gentleman's reasons as by the ques- tion of expense, and no expense will fall on this country. The fact is that the number of Soviet ship movements in the Indian Ocean has multiplied over the last few years, and it would be unwise for the West to allow the Indian Ocean to become a Soviet lake.
As the right hon. Gentleman knows, there are a number of reasons why we should not get out of Cyprus. It is not in NATO but it provides a valuable ele- ment of stability in a rather vulnerable corner of NATO. There is not much saving to be obtained by getting out of Malta and Gibraltar and presumably even hon. Gentlemen opposite below the Gangway would not want to get out of Gibraltar because they do not mind spend- ing money defending the country against General Franco even if they object to defending it against other people.
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Defence
904
Even if the right hon. Gentleman with- drew from all these overseas bases, which would be a considerable folly, and even, if having done so, he discharged all the men who are now there and got rid of all the equipment they now have, which would be an even greater folly, he still would not come anywhere near to mak- ing the cuts that he has been enjoined to make by his party manifesto.
Presumably at a time of enormous expansion of the Soviet Fleet, in quality and quantity, he cannot consider slash- ing our Fleet. It is therefore quite plain that areas outside NATO do not provide the sort of savings that the hon. Gentle- man wants to make. Some money can be saved on research and development by cancelling British equipment and buy- ing American. That was a favourite expedient of the last Labour Government. As the Secretary of State has frankly admitted, that would cause unemploy- ment. To create unemployment and spoil British defences seems a a pretty poor double, more especially as the Chancel- lor's Budget will evidently unemployment, anyway.
cause
Even if the right hon. Gentleman com- mits that folly, unless he is to denude British forces totally of their equipment, that will not provide the sort of money he is looking for. The last Government brought considerable stability to the British defence industry-a stability sorely needed-through the Rayner Report. The setting-up of the Procure- ment Executive greatly rationalised and improved the whole process and operation of procurement policy.
It would be a tragedy if the right hon. Gentleman were to upset all that good work. There is another point to bear in mind about procurement. The right hon. Gentleman has it in his power to do irretrievable damage to the cause of international collaboration. Last month I gave the Minister of State the oppor- tunity to allay fears about the future of the MRCA. The hon. Gentleman con- spicuously did not take the opportunity. I trust that the Secretary of State will set that right. International collaboration is important, and if the right hon. Gentle- man were to cancel the MRCA, as his predecessor cancelled TSR-2, enormous damage would be done to the whole cause of international collaboration. It would
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