1923-02-09 — Page 5

Page

tervals.

many

THE HONGKONG DAILY PRESS, FRIDAY, FEBRUARY DIR, · 1928.

to..

The Hon. My POLLOCK:-1 beg to move an amandment in Clause 2 to make it direct and to run as follows:-

·· The ATTORNEY-GENERAL moved that the -The lot of the majority of the müi already traversod, but I know I can enlate. I say this because I wish that

teai in Hongkong is far better than count upon a patient hearing. The crux both sides had had an equal chance of Council go into Committed to consider that of the children of poor faimles

of the matter seems to us to be whether presenting their respective cases to the the Bill lause by alause. The CotONTAL in the interior of China, the former

a mui taai is a slave or not. If she is, Secretary of State Those in favour of SECRETARY Recorded and this was agreed being much better fed and clothed.

The Council accordingly went into Their parents, if they au wish, are we should not tolerate the system" for the Bill have undoubtedly been actuated "allowed to see them at regular in-even one day longer in this Colony; "but by generous motives and lofty ideals, committeo,

this point is disposed of by clause 2 of but I am afraid that their burning real 3-Alul tani are not always sold; some the Bill. Still, in spite of such a definite has not permitted them to study the

poor people, having too children and being unable to sup pronouncement from the Government, problem with that calmness and im we cannot get away from the fact that partiality which the importance of the port them all, may present some to

I do not keep, and well-to-do Families in

order to cases of cruelty have from time to time subject demands.

We therefore consider have never kept, any mai tsai, but this enable them to be properly brought come to light.

that the mui taai need special protection does not blind me to the unwisdom at up and married off.

While I abhor trying to sweep away in a day the by the Government. cruelty to children and consider a fine, custom with its good points. My Chinese however heavy, totally inadequate for colleague and I have given this grave Anxious of the mui tsai in Hongkong are offenders, I agree with those who hold problem much careful and

Those employers who that the present Bill would not deter the thought; and, while we recognise that

otherwise ill-treat or. their mui-tsai would not be deter-mall number of people, who are by there is much to be said for the argu- asture cruel, from ill treating their muiments adduced by both sides, we have tani. For such people I advocate a long telt it our bounden duty to state, as I term of imprisonment with hard labour. have done, the conclusions we I strongly deprecate, as do all my arrived at, without fear or favour. Honourable Unofficial colleagues, the in- remains for us to signify our support to troduction of registration. Endless in the amendments which will be moved in convenience and trouble would be cansed committee by the Honourable. Senior Un- to the people by requiring them to re- official Member. gister their mai tsai, to report any change of address, and wherever they

4-It can truthfully be said that about niacty or even ninety-five per cent.

well-treated. overwork

red by registration, and the only remedy would seen to be imprison ment without the eption of a fine in case of gross cruelty. If there are cases of ill treatment of mai tai there are also cases of ill-treatment я cruel of one's own children; hearted person in a rage loses the sense of discrimination.

Ili-treat-

H.E THE GOVERNOR,

have

ment of children is not the fault leave the Colony with a mui taai, even H.E. THE GOVERNOR: Gentlemen,

system, but of individuals.

of a

It

"It is hereby declared, and enacted that no payment of money to the parents, or the guardians, or the employer of a female, child, such pay ment purporting to be in return for the transfer of the child"confers upòa any person any right of property in the child, or the right to retain possession or custody or control of the child, either as against the child's parcut, guardian, or employer, or is against the child herself."

In apport of this amendment sir, I would say that it seems to me a far more direct and definite statement of what you mean to effect than the present declarar tions Clause 2, which begins in'" a round- about sort of way Whoras certain persons have erroneously supposed" etc. Your Excellency has stated that the cortain persons cannot possibly refer to

The illustration that to take men-temporarily. I do not agree with the Before we pass on to the next stage of the 300,000,000 to 400,000,000 people living sare merely for preventing cruelty supporters of the Bill that registration the Bill I desire to make a few general in China, but they must be restricted to

in this case would not cause undue incon- remarks on the subject. I should like, the 600,000 Chinese in this Colony. But,

to mui tsal, without abolishing the venience, judging by the smooth working in the first place, to make it perfectly Sir, I would beg leave to point out, with system, resembles leaving the poi-et the laws governing the registration of clear that I dissociate myself entirely deference, that this is pot so, because the 'son in the system, is not as con- vincing as the one that to get rid of birtha, schools, companies, and medical from the venomous attacks which have number of mui tsai who are principally i a boil on the head one does not cut/practitioners. This is arguing on totally been made on the whole Chinese populin "Hongkong are a very trifling percent wrong premises. A little thought willation of this Colony by ignorant per age indeed. The mui tsui who have off the head. 3-Before the Bill, with its present convince any impartial persor that it is sons at Home who seem to assume that found their way to Hongkang come from system is liable to abuse it is cutside, within the vast Empire of China therefore essentially bad. At the same itself which is subject, as we know, to irksome provisions,, becomes Inw, one thing to have, for instance, a birth some people may send their meilor a school registered, and quite

13

lation.

eighteen

are

ren, but, on the contrary, would in-

ment.

ticket, 8.5

an-

because

of

slaves. These arguments were

not

use than are the laws for the

this

tsai to the interior to be sold, or other to have to repert every intended time, I think it must be admitted that such very severe and distressing economia given away, or kept with friends. removal of a mui tsai from the Colony, there is, from the Western point of view, conditions, with famine prevalent in very even temporarily, and every change of strong case against the maintenance farge areas With regard Sir to your With the already over-populated address of the mui tai or of the Western mind, is very difficult to disti- present system, 1 must confess I have a system which, to the unsubtin observation about the desirability of the state of the country, the conditionployer. Further, according to the Bill, of the mut tani would become worse, the employer, whatever his station in guish from slavery owing to the passing found it very difficult to apply that of money and the acquisition of services observation to the remarks which have a direct cutcome of the legis life. has to take out

an identification

which are subsequently unpaid." The been made by myself or by my Chinese if (to use the words of a 6.-If mui tsai of or over the age of Chinese gentleman) he were a discharged ents which have been, brought for colleagues. And, furthermore, Sir, I ward with regard to the general content must have expressed myself very in suddenly released convict who has periodically to reportment of the mani tai and the general differently if you have not apprehended from control, when control is more himself to the police. Moreover, regis excellence of the system, may very likely the fact that my whole contention is that than ever desirable, they may mistration in this case, if it is to be perfectly correct. I have very little clause & of this Bill absolutely shatters their freedom in all sorts of effective, would necessitate semicliary doubt that many of the statements are the maui tari system as it hitherto existed; ways; and so to free them would in visits, which would open a door to all I have very little doubt that ninety per that it brings: it to an end completely; reality mean the removal of neces- sorts of abuses, such as bribery, thieves 7.-The abolition of mui tsai would not masquerading as detectives to gain ad.fent, of the statements are correct. But that it does away with any possibility of

sary and salutury control.

mission into houses and interference to read up the literature of the early condition or as a proprietory condition. if any hon. member will take the trouble its being represented either as a servile do away with kidnapping of child- with the privacy of the home: a thig part of the nineteenth century he will and the amendments which I shall sak crease the sale of girls to evil-dis. repugnant to all Ireemen.. Registration find in numerous pamphlets of West your Excellency to make by and by in) of muitsal will not prevent their Indice' Societies precisely the same Clause, 19, of this Bill will make the posed persons 38 "daughters." maltreatment any more than registration.

argument, reproduced in almost exactly point even stronger, perhaps, than it is These girls are brought up as of shop fokis will prevent thefts and the same words, as to the rare occurrence at present, I do not say that the system "daughters" without being requir embezzlements. Rather than have this ed to do domestic work; some with Buch tender care that their hands registration law imposed on them, the of cases of ill-treatment amongst negro as it has existed hitherto is satisfactory: are not exposed to hard labour in/employers of mui taai would sooner give allowed to stand in the way of the If I thought it were mtisfactory I should I do not do that them up at once, either to the Governs abolition of the system of slavery in the Oppose this Bill in toto. order not to coarsen them.! The ment or to such institutations as the British Colonies, and I fear that it inor do my honourable colleagues Wo object is obvious.

Government would tame. This would

impossible to

allow arguments, of the realise that considerable part of thia -If the Bül is passed, the Guvern mean that the Government bas to pro- same kind to stand in the way of the measure is desirable in the interests of. ment will be faced with the stupen-vide accommodation and find employ abolition of a system of keeping mui tsaid the protection of mui teaf. We cor- dous task of finding accommodationment for the mui tsai, of whom there

is Hongkong The hon, member who tainly do not contend that this measure, or employment for the large num are about ten thousand in the Colony spoke on behalf of all the unofficial trouting it as a whole, is either un ber or mui tsai who may seek As

correspondent to the Chinese emancipation or whose "employers General Chamber of Commerce has said, members commented on the reference to necessary or undersirable. Your Ex- may voluntarily surrender theta to there are unfortunately, very few found-certain persons" who had "erroneously cellency has referred, incidentally, to those been passed in China. But I can say, "the Government." If the Governing houses in Hongkong or in China, supposed" certain things, in Clause 2 of certain laws which are stated to have ment does not take charge of all and so the present homes of the mui the Bill and he suggested that

Sir, that from all 1 learn, these laws are "certain persone" who bad made these girls they must perforce tsai constitute a sort of foundling houses

It more make their employers continue to for them, otherwise, a large number of erroneous suppositions were all the 300 or 20 more tarried into force and are of no

400 million inhabitants of China. Keep them. Thus, whatever may them would have been drowned by their seems to me that it may conceivably be suppression of opium in China, and there. be the change in the name of thei

the case, that these three or four hundred fore I think we may treat them as a ni tani, they can have no change parents or starved to death.

Hongkong is so bound up with Canton, millions had an erroneous impression. A negative entity.. I think it necessitry in their position, and it may fur ther be said that they are kept Ecographically and economically, that to we have heard here to-day, the system to say that, because I want to make the in such a position with the approval stop, the employment, of mai tsai after was declared to be unlawful in the position of the unofficial members or even the authority of the Govthe Bill becomes law as prescribed by Manchu Dynasty and subsequently, in the council perfectly clear. That is all

clause 4 would be impracticable unless time of the first Republic, and I am not have to say on Clause 2 of the Bill. I 9-To enforce the provisions of the China acts likewise. I am of the humble quite clear that they bad good grounds again urge that it is far more emphatic Bill, particularly that part relat- opinion that no real improvement of any for their belief, but I should like to and far more direct to say that it is

can time-honoured social custom be make a strong point that we are not hereby declared and enacted," instead of ing to inspection and registration, affected by sudden and violent change legislating for the 400 millions of China, trying to refer to erronecas suppositions means the employment of a large The mui tezi system has been in exist but for the 600,000 odd, inhabitants of a of certain persons with reference to the army of inspectors and detectives. for domiciliary visits, and for in-ence for thousands of years, having British Colony, This is a matter which mui, tsai system. I do not think, Sir, it spection work upon the arrival and grown up under the economic conditions must be decided-with all due regard to is an erroneous supposition. I believe the departure of all the trains and of life. The while publicity that has re Chinese rentiment and prejudice on the custom of Chica is that the payment of steamers which bring in and take gently been given to the question should principles of British law and the sent money does coufer certain rights for a to bring about the ments of a British community. The main Period of years, at all events till the out thousands of people every day, help materially This would be costly to the Gov-attainment of this object. The best point of the Bill is that the system of girl attains the age of eighteen years, the the method to this end would seem to be keeping mui tsai must be abolished. On marriageable age. I do not think it is at ernment, and vexatious

a gradual and cafeful education of public that point, I have definite instructions all incorrect. It is not an people

opinion

from the Secretary of State who ic supposition; it is a true supposition. These, Sir, are the views of those who

The Anti-Mui Teni Society and the presents the British Government and the The Chinese custom, as I understand it, There can be no com- undoubtedly is that the payment of ask for the withdrawal of the Bill

Protection Society can assist in the British people. There is, besides, of the Chinese Community who, while carrying out of the present Bill by promise on that point: the system must money does confer certain rights on the advocating the ultimate abolition of the having all mai tai informed of their be abolished, and if the system is to be person who pays that money. I cannot see mui tsai system, consider that the time status as declared in clause, and of abolished I can see no reason why you any good or any advantage to be got by. I understand the. is not yet, and in any case strongly their right to report at once to the should not say so. For that reason I think saying that people erroneously suppose depreciate registration." Now, I bare Government in case they are ill-treated: it is necessary-in fact essential to keep a thing, when, as given, to the best of my ability, the and also by advising employers to treat Clause in the Bill, but I am quit position they do not erroneously suppose arguments put forward by the various their mui taai well, otherwise they would prepared to recept my alternative form the thing at all. That is, all I have to of words which will convey the same in-say, Sir, with regard to my amendment

But there can be no com as to Clauso 2... parties, for and against the measure, be punished" severely. It should be re-

The ATTORNEY-GENERAL: "One appré The English Secretary of the Anti-Mui membered, as analogous to this matter.pression. Teal Society has also sent me a letter that the foot-binding practice which had promise on this point: that hereafter no

person can be allowed to have a mui tsai ciates the desire to make this clause more think the giving a gist of the views of his Executive been in existence in Chine for nearly two

in his employment in British territory. direct and arresting, but I Committee on the Bill, which I have thousand years, and which was, na ra

The matter of registration is, to my omission of the preamble obscuren one handed to the Honourable the learned cently as twenty five years ago, tenac- Attorney-General for his consideration. iously clung to by the people, was event-mind, not of the first importance. The very important point, namely, that the am, however, asked to say here that ually abolished, not by legal enactments Secretary of State has expressed his clanse does not make any change in the what they recommend constitutes the but by gradual pressure of enlightened readiness to listen to any arguments law whatever, for the payment of money to-day against the imposition of registration inin return for obtaining the possession of "irreducible minimum. In effect, they public opinion, until we acc support the Bill, with certain proposed middle-aged dames and young girls, in theee matters and will, no doubt, weigh a child has never, in Hongkong, con- amendments which, they consider, should stead of being carried on the backs of very carefully what has been said by the ferred any rights whatever on strengthen it. My Chinese colleague and amabs, merrily tripping about in the hon, senior Chinese member in deciding purchaser. I must confess I am rather I have also received from the Chinese streets in short skirts and high-heeled what instructions he shall give with re surprised to hear the bon member Labour Unions, the Chinese Y.M.C.A shoes, just like their Western, sisters. gard to bringing into force what may be question the correctness of the preamble and Y.W.C.A., the Chinese Christian What has happened to foot-binding called the reserved portion of the Bill, and suggest that it is not an erroneous Union, and the Chinese General Cham should happen to the custom of keeping that is the part of the Bill that is coming supposition at all and that payment does into force by proclamation. With regard confer righta We are speaking, Sir, in bor of Commerce written representations mui tsai.

me now recapitulate which we have likewise turned over to

the to the other minor amendment of the this clause of English law, Hongkong law, It is undoubted- the Government.

views of my Chinese colleague and hon, member, Mr. Pollock, I think many and whatever the rights may be in China.

can say, of them may with advantage be adopted, they do not concern us. Having divested myself of the task im. myself, which, I think I

also the views

of my other and 1 should like to say now that I am ly an erroneous supposition that payment posed upon me by the two sides, of reare stating their opinions here, I will endea Unoficial colleagues, namely, that to much obliged to the hon, member of money for a child confers, or has ever your to express the views of my Chinese make illegal the engagement of mai tsai although I cannot agree with his views conferred any rights co the purchaser, colleague and myself. We feel that in Hongkong at this juncture would be in some. Justances for the trouble which and I think it is important to keep the where there is a divergence of, opinion it impracticable, that, as preventive of he has taker in endeavouring to get this preamble in this clause to make that is not enough for a member of this ill-treatment of mui taai, persons guilty Bill into the best possible shape so that point quí's clear. Honourable Council merely to express of gross cruelty should be sent to prison it may serve its object. of protecting the H. E. THE GOVERNOR-I think the the views, however impartially, of the for a long-term with hard labour. It interests of mu tai, while causing the hon, member's objection will be quite in people when he represents. He should has been a source of regret to me that, least possible friction and difficulty. The order if we cut out the word "erroneous- also weigh the value of the conflicting while the case for stopping the employ remaining points raised may be dealt ly which means nothing very important arguments, endeavour to unravel the ment of mui tsai has been so ably and with more suitably on the individual from my point of view, but seems to mexa web of confusion woven by the disputa widely presented, those who are in clauses of the Bill as they arise. It is a great deal from the hon. member'a tion, and from his own judgment. In favour of retaining the system for the proposed and seconded that the Bill be point of view. There is no question I

think that certain persons expressing Our " "own conclusion our present, with certain radical improve read a second time. hopest convictions-it would be necessary meats in their position, bave, until only The second reading of the Bill was then this erroneous supposition. for me to go over some of the grounds quite recently, zemained almost inarti carried.

another section

Let

erroneous

(Continued on have 1

"

the

made

LANE, CRAWFORD, LTD.

PROVISION DEPT.

English York Cut Hams, "Pineapple" Bacon American Cheese MacLarens Imperial Cheese Gruyera Cream Cheese Ox Tongues "Libbys" Bologna Sausage

Oliver Drings Cambridge Sausage C & B Oxford Sausages

1)

Cambridge Walls Fork

GROCERY DEPT.

per lb. 1.30 1.30 0.90

H

... per jar 1.00 and 1.50

per tin 1.30

$3.50, $5.00 and 6.00

per tin 0.85

Noels Jams, Strawberry, Blackcurrant, Raspberry,

Greengage and Red Currant (Glass jars) ........* Del Monte Asparagus

Brussel Sprouts Parsnips

English Merrowfat Peas Ceylon Tea

Hankow Tea

Breakfast Blend Tea

Coffee, Finest Blend (Roasted and Ground daily)

PHONE 1741.

"1.00

1.15

0.75

1.20

0.70

per tin 0.90

0.50

0.50

21

0.65

per lb. 1:00:

1.00

1.00

0,85

LANE, CRAWFORD, LIMITED.

EST. 1850.

SHIPCHANDLERY "DEPT.

COMPLETE SHIPS' OUTFITS.

DECK AND "ENGINE ROOM STORES.

OILS, PAINTS AND VARNISH IMPORTERS.

ENGINEERS' TOOLS, INDICATORS, COUNTERS, Eru, PACKING AND ASBESTOS GOODS, AGRETS FOR DOBBIE MOINNES NAUTICAL SPECIALTIES

NOTICE OF REMOVAL.

THE ANDERSON MUSIC CO., LTD.

HAVE NOW REMOVED

FROM

5. BEACONSFIELD ARCADE

TO

QUEEN'S BUILDING, ICE HOUSE STREET

Tel. 1322.

(OPPOSITE CAFÉ WISEMAN)

Powell

TELEPHONE 0. 887.

JUST BEFORE STOCKTAKING WE OFFER AT VERY ATTRACTIVE PRICES,

ORETONNES, TAFFETAS

SHADOW

AND

PRINTS,

For CURTAINS and LOOSE COVERS.

Our Representative will call with a Full Est of Patterns, on request, and give Quotations on the Spot,