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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE

Reference :-

TILIC.O. 885

6

ALLY WITHOUT PERMISSION OF THE COPYRIGHT PHOTOGRAPH-NOT TO BE REPRODUCED PHOTOGRAPHIC-

PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON

SIXTH

DAY.

TUESDAY, 24TH NOVEMBER 1896.

PRESENT:

THE RIGHT HONOURABLE THE EARL OF SELBORNE, CHAIRMAN, Presiding.

The IIon, Sir DONALD SMITH, G.C.M.G. The Hon. Sir SAUL SAMUEL, K.C.M.G., C.B. The Hon. D. GILLIES.

The Hon. A. (1. JONES, P,C. Mr. G. II. MURRAY, C.D.

Mr. W. H. MERCER, Secretary.

Captain WALTER Goodsall, called in ; and Examined.

Chairman.

recent

1224. I THINK you were lately Commander of the Eastern Telegraph Company's ship "Chiltern"?—Yes.

1225. And

are author of a you pamphlet on Submarine Telegraph work ?--Yes. 1226. Can you tell the Committee what experience you have had of repairing cables in deep water-I have recovered cables in over 2,000 fathoms, brought them to the surface. removed the faults, and put the same cables down again.

1227. Can you tell the Committee how you manage to lift a cable at that depth?-By care- ful attention to the work, that is all. It has grot to be done; it does not matter what depth the cable is laid in; if you give time, devote full If the attention to the work, it can be done. cable had been very nearly 3,000 fathoms the cable could have been lifted.

1228. I suppose you are very dependent on the weather, are you not ?—Yes; you must have the best of weather for cable-repairing work.

1229. I suppose at a depth of 3,000 fathoms you drag your grapnels until you catch the cable?

-We do.

You

1230. And when you lift to the surface at 3,000 fathoms, how many miles of cable will be hanging on the grapnel ?-The chances are that you might not bring the bight or loop to the sur- face at that depth; you would have to break your cable at that depth. May I just show you? 1231. Certainly ?--I think this will show you (producing pamphlet with illustrations}. see in that case you lift a bight there. That picture there, I take it, shows five miles, and we only lifted it 500 fathoms from the bottom. We thought the bight was the old 1865 Atlantic Cable; that represents what the "Great Eastern" did, but unfortunately it was not the cable we bad lifted and weighed from that depth, but it We brought the was a piece of grappling rope. grappling rope to the surface, and were, of course, wonderfully astonished; we had not got the cable. 1232. Can you explain to the Committee ex- actly what happens-we want to know--when

Chairman-continued.

you have to repair a cable in 2,000 or 3,000 fathoms-There is a descriptive account of re- pairing a cable in 2,000 fathoms in that pamphlet. You grapple for the cable, and weigh at certain distances, we will say 500 fathons, from the ground. Of course, there is then a depth of water between the grapnel and the surface of 1,500 fathoms; we then buoy the bight or loop and then go on

side of the buoy and Well, to make sure, I went tu grapple. the southward of the buy and put down what was called a Johnson's cutting grapnel, and I booked the cable again, then heaved up, pulled the cable in the grapnel, and cut the cable. It gave me a free end, and 1 brought that to the surface. That was 2,025 fathoms, the depth of water, and that cable, mind you, had been lying on the bottom of the ocean in that depth for 10 years, and after my bringing it to the surface I was wonderfully astonished to find that there was no wear and tear on that cable; that even the whitewash which is put upon the cable when it is coiled into the ship's tank remained there ; between the ridges of the pitch, which is put on the outer covering, you can see them all around it, and also just the wash of whitewash that is put on it so that there was no motion down at the bottom of the decan at that depth

1233. Then I understand that at these great depths you cut the cable ?--We cut the cable.

1234. And treat both ends separately?—Yes, we recover both ends separately.

1235. So that it is not a question of having many miles of cable hanging on a grapnel? Oh, no. To lift it at 2,000 fathoms, at that depth you must have had a tremendous amount of slack paid out, and then at that depth it is a great mistake to use a large quantity of slack. All you want is to let the cable lie the same as you lay a piece of thread along this table, and if it comes to this piece of material (pointing) let it just gradually slip over it. Of course it is steep- to-this would be steep-to on that desk-that is a term we use at sea. You would have to work differently. For all cables it is quite

24 November 1896.]

Captain GooDSALI..

Chairman-continued. necessary that a thorough survey should be taken; a very thorough survey.

I have got eases here which will show you places where you may get 2,000 fathoms, and in a very little distance only 190 fathons. There is a specimen (showing drawing), you will see there is a ridge there; I know that exists, because 1 took three soundings following to make perfectly sure that there was only 191 fathoms.

1236. And did the cable go right over that? -Fortunately, no. It avoided that. There was another ease of laying a cable. The cable was laid in that pond there (pointing), as it were, and when the cable was laid, of course they did not know why the cable ran out of the ship at such a tremendous rate, it was because they were going over that gulley. It did not last very long. They should have gone round on the outside, because there is a ridge; they went right across that gulley they went round here; they thought they were only in 80 fathoms of water, but in- stead of that they were in 400 or 500, or some- thing like that.

1237. Five hundred ?—You see it is impossible for a cable to take the proper contour of the bottom.

1238. Given that the bottom has been properly surveyed, what percentage of slack do you think ought to be paid out?--If it is properly laid and it in a perfect level-on this table you do not want any slack-if you get a level ground; if you make sure of your survey and you find you have got your ocean bed--mind you, you must allow more than the exact distance. I have been checking the l'acific according to the last chart that was published by the Admiralty in the seventh month of this year-I see. the soundings on that chart appear to be, some about 120, others 60 miles apart. That is too much. When I have been going in for getting an accurate sur- vey of the bottom I have always gone in for each mile. Of course it takes time, but when you are in a repairing ship you are able to do it.

1239. What distance would you put as the maximum at which soundings ought to be taken apart? With such a long stretch of cable as you are going to put in the Pacific, you ought to linve the soundings each mile if you can get them, but it is an awful expense to do it,

Mr. Murray.

1240. A mile ?-A mile apart. It is an awful expense, but still you can so readily get into a deep hole.

Of course if you fund by getting

a few soundings there are no breaks, then sounding every few miles might serve, but you can see by that drawing there how quickly you can go from 190 fathoms down to about 1,000.

Chairman,

1241. Have you ever known a survey as com plete as that?—No, I have not I am only speaking of my own work; I have surveyed and

taken them.

1242. For a whole route ?—No, not for a long

Chairman-continued.

[Continued.

route but in cases of repairing. I took a survey for a cable hetween Obokli, that is a French settlement in Africa, to P'erim Island. I think all my soundings were very nearly two miles apart.

1243. Have you any knowledge of what the average mileage apart is for the survey of a route a long route along which a cable is going to be laid; have you any experience of that?— The Atlantic; no, I cannot say that I have. Of course, in making repairs in lines, and altering the position of the cable for better bottom, I have taken soundings continuously.

1244. Can you tell the Committee the heaviest cable you have raised from 2,000 fathoms ?— Going with the Telegraph Construction Com- pany's type; that is type 1.

1345. Do you know how many pounds of copper and gutta-percha that is to the nautical mile?-That is 130, and 130 if I remember rightly; 107 and 140-they vary so.

1246. What would you say to raising from 3,000 fathoms a cable of 940 lbs. of copper and 940 lbs. of gutta-percha?—Oh, it can be done.

1247. It can be done?-Oh, yes.

Of course

the weight is in the outer coating, the wire. You must take off the rim to allow for the larger core -how many wires you have got on the outer coating.

1248, Would you cut such a cable on the bottom-Well, if you put sufficient weight on- the grapnels you could,

1249. And then you could raise ouc end of a cable of that weight ?—Yes,

1250. You would require very special appa ratus. 1

suppose You would have to use good grappling ropes and good machinery for that everything would have to be of the best, but the chances are that if you get a cable down, and the ground is thoroughly surveyed at first, that cable will last many years; many.

1251. What has been, in your experience, the effect of long immersion on cables?—It all depends. If you get it on a good bottom it will last there always in very good order. Of course,

if you get it on a rocky bottom the chane a arc the wires will be all eaten away; the outer coating.

years

and

years.

1252. Given a thoroughly well manufactured cable lying on what you would call a good bottom-It will last for

1253. Twenty years ?-Oh, yes, 20 years. --The 1866 cable which is now lying, I believe, is put down as the 1880 cable, because the deep-sea section has been renewed. But I believe that the old 1866 shore ends and inter- mediate portions now lying in the Atlantic are in good order.

years.

1254. Fifty years-It has not been there 50

It was laid in 1866; that is 30 years. 1255. I am asking if you can give us an opinion whether, given such a cable as I have supposed, it would last 50 years?—Yes; I think it would.

1256. One hundred years ?-Well, it might. I would take it at 50 years. The knowledge of submarine cables is not 50 years old properly

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