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16 November 1896.]

Mr. Gillies--continued.

Mr. SIEMENS.

are about 301., and therefore I think it will earn the same.

609. But in time?—Yes; I say quite clearly, "This figure will naturally not be reached during the first two or three years, but it is even under the average of the earnings of all submarine cables seven years ago, and since that time telegraphic correspondence has continued to increase rapidly."

Sir Donald Smith.

610. May I ask you what was the longest continuous stretch of cable that has been laid, up to this time, from one point to another?— Yes: I think the French cable from Brest to St. Pierre, which is the longest, is about 2,500 miles; something like that.

611. What is the capacity as to words of the last cable of the Commercial Company?-It is about 40 words per minute.

612. Forty words per minute?-Yen, duplex working. This means to say they can send 40 words from England to Nova Scotia, and at the same time 40 words from Nova Scotia to England, so that is 80 words per minute.

613. And we speak now of 15 words, do we not? That means also each way. I mean you can send 15 words to Vancouver to Fanning Island, and at the same time 15 words from Fanning Island to Vancouver.

614. Which is 30 words ? -Yes.

615. What do you consider the life of a cable such as you propose to lay or as you tendered for what would you consider the life of auch a Cable -I am afraid I could not tell. That comes into the construction part of the business. If the cable is manufactured with the proper precautions about which I am to talk afterwards, there is no deterioration whatever. I obtained from the Commercial Cable Company from tests which they make every Sunday I think, and I got them for November for four weeks in

four weeks November 1894, and for

in November 1895, and for four weeks in October 1896, and the insulation is practically exactly the same of the cable. There is no deteriora- tion whatever, and they have not spent a single penny on repairs. I mean nothing has gone wrong with the cable at all, and there is no reason why it should not go on like that.

616. As a proper guarantee or precaution against breakage, breaking of the cable and obstruction to telegraphing, do you consider it not only desirable but necessary that there should be a duplicate, that it should be duplicated? Well, a duplicate cable is always a greater security, naturally.

617. Has it been found in other cables of great length that such breakages have taken place at a comparatively short time after the cables were laid ?-Yes, certainly, and that also forms part of what I had better say afterwards of the way the core is manufactured, That has a great influence on that, and on that point I should like to say something afterwards.

618. Then might I ask what you consider would be necessary in respect of repairing cables; what with regard to abips and appli-

[Continued.

16 November 1896.]

Sir Donald Smith-continued. ances, or facilities for mending them ?-Well, that is what I stated in that pamphlet; I would think that two repairing steamers, about the same size as the Mackay-Bennett," I do not know whether you have seen that in Nova Scotia.

619. I have, yes.--Should be stationed, the one in Fiji and the other in Vancouver, perhaps.

620. They should be always on the Pacific ?-- Oh, yes, they should be there. That is the charge of 17,000l. a year, I think, or whatever the sum is which I call the permanent charge.

Mr. Murray.

621. You mentioned, just now, the cable of the Commercial Union Company, with a capacity cable of of 40 words a minute. Supposing that type was laid over the distance from Vancouver to Fanning, what would be its carry. ing capacity?-Well, the carrying capacity gues as the square of the distance, and the length of the Commercial Cable is about 2,200 miles, 2,164, exactly; so if you square that, that is 484, and the other cables 3,600 miles, with the slack, so that if you square that, that is 1,296, and so it would give about one-third of the words.

622. About 13 words? About 13 words; but as a matter of fact the accurate calculation gives 15 as a matter of fact, we have proposed the

same core.

623. This is exactly the same?-This is exactly the same, except that in the deep sen type we should take a better quality steel wire.

624. When you allow 90,000% maintenance. for the three years, do you think that the same estimate ought to be allowed for all the remaining years of the cable's life? Yes. Well I mean I calculate that having repairs to do, and substituting every year 200 miles of cable, and if you go on that assumption, that sum of 90,0001. does not only cover the repairs but also the renewal of the cable, so that prac- tically speaking you would have no accumula- ting reserve fund, but only simply take from the 90,0001. all the money that is not spent in the year, and put it back as a reserve fund.

625. You mean, in fact, that if you renewed the cable, and repaired it properly every year, that it would be as good at the end of 25 years as it was at the beginning?-Certainly.

626. How far would you carry that?-Well, I really do not know. I want to show you this. (Producing portion of French cable.) This cable has been 16 years in the water. I want just to another. (Producing another specimen.) show This is one of the proposed cable to Fanning Island, but you see there is hardly any differ- ence. The outer cover of jute and compound is there just as it was on the first day.

627. Then with proper renewals you consider that a cable is practically immortal?-Well, I think so. Yes, because if anything the insulation of the gutta-percha increases with time. It is not affected by water like indiarubber is, and there is really nothing to destroy as it lies in the bottom of the sea.

think that 90,000/ 628. Do

you

a yeur for that cable is a full estimate to produce that

Mr. SIEMENS.

Yes, I

Mr. Murray-continued. result? For repairing and renewal. certainly think that.

629. You expect, do you not, that prices of materials have gone down since that tender of 1894 ?--No; we had assumed very high prices for materials in 1894. I mean, as I tell you quite openly, we knew that that tender would not be accepted, and therefore we put it high, so as not to give our competitors any clue as to what we could do it for. Well, certainly we were perfectly certain it would not be accepted.

Sir Donald Smith.

630. You knew it would not be a firm tender? -Yes, exactly.

631. That is, you looked upon it so; only a proposal, only a proposition?-Only to give the Governments an idea what the thing might cost. And we thought it was also for their purpose much better to be prepared for 2,000,000. or

[Continued.

Sir Donald Smith-continued. over, and then afterwards find they could do it cheaper.

632. And you would now be very glad indeed had you got the tender at that; very glad indeed think we should have done it; we should have to carry it out on those terms?—No; I do not

called the attention of the Governments to it, that it was not a bond file tender.

633. But at least you would have considered that you would have been in a capital position financially yourselves if you did do so; that it would have been a great benefit to you?—No, I mean to say we would have told the Govern- ment that we would not take so much money.

634. Yes, yes; I quite understand. Of course it was a thing too, from all that I could hear and see, I understood that it was not to be accepted, and therefore we estimated everything very high so as to give the Governments a safe idea of what the cost would not exceed.

The Witness withdrew.

Adjourned till To-morrow, at Half-past Eleven o'clock.

G

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