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PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE

Reference :-

C.O. 885

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ALLY WITHOUT PERMISSION OF THE BE REPRODUCED PHOTOGRAPHIC- COPYRIGHT PHOTOGRAPH-NOT TO

PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON

16 November 1896.]

Mr. Murray-continued.

Mr. M. H. GRAY.

the shore there, the bottom is very regular there.

434. And you have assumed practically that the bottom is fairly regular?--Yes.

435. And that there are no very great ups and downs?—Yes, no very great ups and downs. One has frequently to judge of the soundings from those that are available in the neighbour- hood.

436. Then as to the weight of your cable. You are quite satisfied, especially after Lord Kelvin's opinion, that your specification is suf- ficient? Yes.

437. That would not be the heaviest cable actually laid, would it ?—No.

438. What is the heaviest cable ?-650 lbs. of copper, 400 of gutta percha.

439. Do you know what induced the cou- structors of that cable to make it so heavy ?— Competition was one thing, and they wanted to have lugh speed, I believe; I should imagine that is the cause.

440. What is the speed of that cable?-I un- derstand from reports of it that the speed is 48.8 words; it has been reported so, but I believe it is slightly higher. There is one published ac- count by a man who was engineer in the laying of that cable, and he, 1 think, gives the working speed actually obtained after laying words of five letters a minute, and press work is satisfactorily done at 50 words of five letters per minute.

as 47 to 48

441. What cable is that?—That is the Anglo- American Telegraph Company's cable laid in 1894.

442. What is the longest length of cable that a message has ever been sent through ?-That I cannot say. Of course, for experimental pur- poses there may be various cables looped and one might not hear of it.

443. You do not know of any experiments of that kind? No, I do not; I have not heard any of the results of such experiments.

444. Have you done anything in that way yourself? No.

445. You have never looped two cables?— Oh, we have joined cables together from end to end for a smaller core, 1,600 miles, I think, to try the mirror instrument.

416. Have you any idea what the effective carrying speed of a 12 word per minute cable is; how many paying words it carries, I mean? That I could not say; I have not experience in it.

447. Were you quite right in what you said about the Post Office estimate! though, perhaps, You said that they it is not very material. calculated for a longer distance ?-I believe 80; they allow 20 per cent. of slack.

448. Yes; but you will observe that their estimate was not for a cable to Australia, but for one to New Zealand ?—Oh, it was only the one Bection, I believe, that I was referring to-only one section-Vancouver to Fanning.

449. The total length, of course, under Route No. 1 is rather more than the Post Office estimate. It is 7,100 knots. Theirs, I think, was 6,300?—Yes; but, I think, in reference to the subject, the only figure given for core

Mr. Murray-continued.

[Continued.

by the Post Office authorities refers to the Vancouver and Fanning section.

450. The 940 lbs. The 940 lbs., and it was of that only that I was speaking; but I believe they added their 20 per cent. for slack, and added that to the core; the carrying capacity.

451. What is your experience of the cost of maintenance of deep sea cables ?— It is variable ; it varies with the cable.

452. Your own cables, for instance?—I could not give any figures, but it is not very con- siderable.

453. It is not very considerable?—No; that is maintenance and repairing. There are occa- sions on which we have had to send shipe away, and perhaps they have been away for two or three months, but of course those ships are kept for other purposes.

454. Do you think that 57, per year per knot would be too much on an average?-1 could not say off-hand, but I have made an approximate figure for maintaining and repairing ships on the Pacific, for the repairs there, and it comes to a little over 40,000%, the two ships. Of course the cable itself that night be used in the repair is a matter to consider; of course there would be a certain amount of surplus cable after laying, which would be available for that purpose.

455. And does the cost of maintenance extend

tolerably equally over the whole life of the cable? -I do not think so; I think it is perhaps in the first few months that there is more risk of re- pair being necessary than in the course of many years afterwards, according to the type of cable.

456. If you get

over the first few months you

I

are fairly safe?-Fairly safe.

457. What would you consider would be the life of a cable such as you have specified for?-- That is a question rather difficult to answer. should have perhaps too sanguine a view of it, but I should think 30 or 40 years in a good bottom, and that is allowing for some slight ac- cidents in various places, but if a cable were lying on a good bottom, I see no reason why it should not last for 100 years.

458. Why does the bottom affect its life?- If the bottom Well, it affects it in three ways.

is rough rock and there is a current moving it, it would saw the cable through; if it were very rough coral it might possibly saw it through there; if there are any chemical substances on the bottom it might corrode the iron in some types of cable, but the type we recommend is pro- tected against corrosion.

459. What is the greatest depth at which you find coral?-I cannot say; that is a question which has been variously answered by the men who have made a speciality of that. I could not say myself.

460. It is never very deep, is it?-The dead coral is sometimes deep; but the live coral, it is a question how far the live coral can go down, but I believe in the West Indies that coral has been found to the depth of 700 or 800 fathome.

461. How does the bottom of the Pacific, s0 far as you know it, compare with the Atlantic for this purpose? - I should say it stands about

the same.

462. Then you would expect the life of a

16 November 1896.]

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Mr. M. H. GRAY.

Mr. Murray continued. Pacific cable to be not shorter than the life of an Atlantic cable so far as the bottom was con- cerned?—Yes.

Sir Donald Smith.

463. I think you mentioned the longest unbroken stretch of cable as 2,700 odd miles?- Two thousand seven hundred and seventeen.

464. That is with slack, allowing for the slack?—That is including slack.

465. Do you know what was the greatest depth found there? I could not say; I could only guess; I could not tell.

466. Then we cannot compare it with the distance to Fanning Island as to depth of water? I should estimate that the depth was approach- ing 2,700 or 2,800 fathoms, but I could not say.

467. You have no data to substantiate that?- No, not any, without going into the charts.

468. Would it be possible to make a cable such as that tendered for that would be per- fectly good at the end of three years and yet of which there would be a fear of its breaking down within a year or two or a few years afterwards; that it could be made so as to be good and sub- stantial for three or four years and not be ser- viceable afterwards -I do not think so.

469. It would not be possible to do that? I do not think it would be possible to do so; it would require ingenuity to do so.

470, I do not suggest that any firm of good standing would do so. — No.

471. Do you consider that there would be n reasonable prospect of having unbroken com- munication for a number of years with only one cable, or do you consider it would be necessary to duplicate?—I consider that there is a very good prospect of communication continuing for many years with one cable, and I do not see the Of course duplica- necessity for duplicating it.

tion is an advantage, there is no question about that, but it is not a necessity.

472. On the Atlantic several companies have duplicated and have even three cables, have they not ?--Yes, some more; one company has five, I believe.

473. Is that because several of their cables It may be by in- gave way? I cannot say. crease of traffic, but the types of the Atlan- tic cables were not such as those recommended by us. In fact, the people who laid these Atlantic cables, some of which have been abandoned, made use of a type which they themselves have since seen fit to change, and adopt a type which we have been making for some 12 years in their most recent cable.

474. In the event of a breakage in the Pacific cable, how long would it take to repair it, to connect it, and to put it in perfect working order again? That is a matter of circumstance.

475. Quite? If the ship were near at hand, and everything going favourably, it might be done in a very short time; in the course of a few days or a week or two, everything being favourable."

476. Then, may I ask if it was proposed by your company, in making the tender, proposing to make a contract, to have a ship at hand on the

[Continued.

Sir Donald Smith-continued. Pacific coast for that purpose?It was ¡roposed to have two ships.

477. Always?-During the three years.

478. And in that case how long might it be supposed it would take to repair and to put into working order again any breakage? what is the greatest length of time?—I should say a month ; I should allow a month for that.

479. A month? -Yes.

480. But you think it could be done within a mouth? I think so.

481. And would it be equally strong, that breakage; those portions repaired, would they be equally strong and serviceable ?—Just as strong and serviceable.

482. I think it has been said that it would really in some casca be stronger than the original? Well, it would be at least as good; I am quite convinced of that.

483. And that they have not been known to break at the same spot or same point again?— Quite so. Of course it would mean a joint, which would only be one additional joint to several hundreds that are always in a cable.

Sir Saul Samuel,

484. You are aware that the East India Ex- tension Telegraph Company have three lines to Australia? Three lines from Java; two to Port Darwin, and one to Roebuck Bay.

485. Those lines have been laid in conse- quence of frequent interruptions in the coral seas, I think-The last interruption to the duplicate cable which runs to Port Darwin is one which was due to earthquake and some submarine movement in the neighbourhood of Banjoewangi in deep water, and they have been frequently interrupted, I cannot tell in what place; but that one I do know, I read a report of it.

486. A portion of this line would run through coral sens, would it not ?-It would have to touch on coral islands in some places in the Pacific.

487. The lines in these sens are more liable to

interruption than they are in the Atlantic, I think, is that so ?--In the shallow coral water, yes. Just taking these lines to which you referred: the line from Port Darwin, of which many miles, some 700 or 800, I think, are run in shallow water and coral banks, in Torres Straits; it is very dangerous water; that water is very shallow there it does not run above 50 fathoms.

:

488. Would there not be great difficulty in picking up the cable at a great depth in the event of any interruption ?-No, it is a matter of the tensile strength of material; I do not see

difficulty there at all. any

489. The depth would not have anything to do with it; I mean the picking up of it?—I mean such depths as one might encounter in the Pacific.

490. Three thousand fathome?--Three thou- and fathoms.

491. They could pick up a cable casily in 3,000 fathoms?-Yes, it has actually been done, I hear, in 2,900 fathoms.

492. And have you considered the amount of traffic that would be along this line if it were

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