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sent to labour outside, with guards. The long-sentenced men-men sentenced by the Supreme Court for serious offences at all the Settlements-will be brought down here, sentenced probably to four or five years penal servitude, or to transportation, and perhaps to longer sentences, for serious crimes, and I must say that I think it would be a very dangerous experiment indeed to lessen, or modify in any way, the proposal made by the Committee of six months rigorous penal fabour. After six months of good behaviour, they might be placed where their labour would be more remunerative, and might labour without the walls; but for the first six months, as far as the means of the Colony will allow, there should be penal diet and shot-drill, and I am perfectly certain that in a short time the Judge will be able safely to relax the severity of their sentences.

Dr. Little-I would make a very few observations indeed on this subject. The system adopted here, as far as I understood, was one which was commenced with the transmarine convicts, and has been very slightly modified, and I certainly think, from the very long experience we have had of the system, that it has been very excellently conducted. People from Europe, Asia, and America, have said that they considered Singapore to be a wonder in convict discipline-that there were more than two thousand men who governed themselves and looked after themselves, and there was not a soldier to look after them. The punishment is well adapted for them; the place is quiet; there is no insurrection, or riot, or breaking out of prisons, as in India and elsewhere, endangering the lives of good and honest people, and running the risk of being shot down; there is never any conspiracy or breaking out; and therefore I think the system we have got is well adapted for them. But they are going away, and with a new class of convicts we have to levise our system; I would draw attention to one thing: we ought to think not only how to punish our criminals, but how to look after them afterwards. When those men leave the gaol, what must they do they must go amongst their former associates, and live by stealing. Unless while in gaol we devise some provision for them when they go out, all the punishment they have received-all the deterrent things, shot- drill, or what else-is of no avail, because they cannot starve. think we are going back to a barbarous age when we cut off their tails.

On another question, I almost as well brand them as thieves. That punishment has been put an end to, and I I think we might think the other should also be. When a man has his tail cut off he is disgraced among his countrymen, and therefore that mark of ignominy makes him desperate. If his tail is cut off, his punishment does not stop with his discharge, and I think we have no right to do it. I have no objection to the shot-drill; no doubt it is an excellent thing though I have never seen it in operation. But we can only do what we have means for." I do not think we can carry out the separate system entirely. Some of the worst cases, perhaps, we could keep separate, but not the whole. Regarding the estimates here I perfectly agree, the only thing that I would again mention is that we must do all we possibly can to prevent these men from returning to their former associates after their discharge, which they will and must do if nothing is done to support them.

Mr. Greenshields.-I think, Sir, there is no question that has come before the Council, or that is likely to come before it, on which there is greater unanimity than on the necessity of improvement in our prison system. What the honourable member has said relates to the transmarine system, with which we have nothing to do; it is a local system that we Justice since the last riots, for instance, must have seen the utter inadequacy of the are considering, and everyone who has done the part of a Visiting system as it exists.

The honourable member on my right truly described its effect that petty thefts were committed for the sake of being well fed and well cared for; and the proposal of the Colonial Secretary to inflict sharp punishment ou these men is a good one. I have no doubt that if the recommendations of the Committee be adopted, and the shot-drill and penal diet introduced, that in the course of three months the prison, instead of being crowded as it is now, will be half empty. very well, we have read the correspondence on the table, and I think we are quite prepared We all understand the case to deal with it.

The Governor. It is a very late period of our sitting, and I will not detain you, but for one or two observations which I think I ought to make upon what has fallen from some honourable members. Council on the subject which I have thought it my duty to submit for your consideration, I am glad to find that there is such unanimity in the and that you concur so fully with the Government in the necessity of making these changes in the system of prison discipline in force in the Colony. I would remark in reference to what bas tallen from an honourable gentleman, that one object of punishment, and that by no means an unimportant one, is not only to deter from crime the individuals who are the subject of punishment, but to deter others from it, and we look upon it that this new system when introduced will have an extremely deterrent effect upon people

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outside as well as those in. Take, for instance, the Klings: I think none shrink from physical suffering more than they do, and when this shot-drill is brought to their notice-- of the nature of which, as one honourable member has at times declared himself ignorant, I may just say that it is one of the severest labours that men can be subjected to-and when it comes to be known that it is one of the punishments at the first stage of the sentence, I anticipate that the knowledge will have not merely a deterrent effect on those natives who are actually subjected to it, but also on others who would otherwise subject themselves to it.

One honourable member says that cutting off the tail is a disgrace, and it is not desirable that a man should leave the prison disgraced. I confess I see no objection to cutting the tail any more than to cutting the hair. This is invariably done to prisoners, especially soldiers at home, and the soldier, when he comes out of prison, is known as a gaol-bird, because he has got no hair on his head. It is true that one great object in this hair cutting is the promotion of cleanliness, but in military prisons it is also certainly introduced as part of the punishment. I do not agree with that view of the case which regards this punishment as a barbarous one, and I should be quite ready to extend it even to Chinamen who were committed for a short period.

I agree with the honourable member as to the expediency of having remunerative labour if possible, but I am quite satisfied that if you want to make your punishment felt it is impossible to have such remunerative labour in the first stages of imprisonment. There is no more severe punishment than tread-wheel and shot-drill, and i hold that it is very desirable that in the carlier stages the prisoner should be subjected to these or similar description of hard labour.

It is no doubt very desirable to get something out of prisoners' labour, but bearing in mind the number of long-sentenced prisoners there will be, think, you have every assur- ance that much remunerative labour will be got out of the prison. I may say that I have been much struck with the observations of one honourable member as to the introduction of machinery into the prison for the manufacture of coir, an arrangement which would no doubt be attenped with great advantage to the Colony, though it would involve large attention in the prison and consequent expense.

The Colonial Secretary proposed "that the Council concurs with his Excellency the Governor that the time has arrived when steps should be taken to improve the state of the Colonial Prisons by the introduction of a better system of management and a more rigid discipline, and that it is prepared to vote the funds which may be necessary for commencing this work in the way suggested in the report of the Acting Colonial Engineer on the correspondence relating to prisons, laid before it on the 4th instant."

Mr. Shelford.—I beg to second that; and if your Excellency will allow me, the reason why I proposed three months instead of six months, was that we should be able to have our short-sentenced as well as long-sentenced prisoners, outside the prison as well as in it, at productive labour. There is no reason why they should not, if the warders would make them work, instead of lolling at the side of the road, as they too often do now, keep thein from talking among themselves and holding communication with strangers.

The resolution was carried unanimously, as was also the following, which was moved by the Colonial Secretary and seconded by Dr. Little :

"That the Council agrees with his Excellency the Governor that the establishment of prison officers now employed in the Singapore Gaol is altogether inadequate for carrying out the amended system of management and discipline which it is intended to introduce, and approves of the scale of prison establishment proposed by his Excellency in his Minute of 13th June, 1872."

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