CO885-(16-18) — Page 817

PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE

Reference :-

C.O.885

18 PUBLIC RECORD OFFICE, LONDON

ALLY WITHOUT PERMISSION OF THE BE REPRODUCED PHOTOGRAPHIC- COPYRIGHT PHOTOGRAPH-NOT TO

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Fifteenth Day, annual report of the trade of the Empire, no common year book of the

trade of the South African Customs Union, nor of the West Indies. 14 May 1907.

INTERCHANGE OF PERMANENT

STAFF.

(Mr. Deakin.)

44

44

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Dr. JAMESON: It is want of knowledge on his part.

Mr. DEAKIN: The article says "There is no common system, as there "should be, for India, the Straits Settlements and other Asiatic Possessions.' He mentions the Crown Colonies apart from India, an Empire of 2,678,330 square miles, a population of over 36,000,000, a total trade of 180,000,000l. a year," which rather supports what I said about the

"and a

revenue of burden which must rest upon your shoulders,

19,500,000l. sterling." He does say "even the statistics we have are difficult to understand, because it is not customary to prefix a note explaining the system of valuation, of registration, or origin of destination, inclusion and exclusion and transit, trade, bullion, and specie, bunker coal, &e." These are details, but we are all occasionally driven to statistics to the sorrow of our hearers; and when we must be sure that we are measuring things which are properly comparable. These questions, now go to the Board of Trade. If there had been a real secretariat it might have been desirable to consider whether, as imperial questions, they ought not to be either collected, or at all events collated, there. Industrial issues are matters of deep interest but are not so general as what are termed Chamber of Commerce questions. Legislation and its administration affecting commerce within the Empire are matters which, I venture to British hope, the secretariat, even in this office, will take in charge. merchants freely apply for information in regard to our changes in these matters, and so far as possible we supply it, but it is desirable that we should all be brought into line with changes of administration and, still of legislation. Copies of laws, regulations, and full explanations concerning them, night be forwarded from all the Dominions classified, and made complete, so as to serve all of us.

more,

There are a great number of other matters which are referred to in this article, to which I need not call attention; but the general idea of the secretariat was that it should act very largely as an intelligence department for all the self-governing dominions and the mother country in relation, to all other matters of common concern. The number of persons who scek for detailed and exact information of an Imperial range are not great, but they include the publicists of every dominion, and through our newspaper press, which freely avails itself of any such knowledge, it would filter through to the public. It is laid before Parliament, and affects to a certain extent legislation and administration.

Mr. Haldane's proposal for a general staff and an exchange of officers is only another illustration of what is proposed here to be done on the civil side. With regard to officers, Mr. Haldane suggests that, to some extent at all events, his staff might be described as the brain of the army; so also we might have in this secretariat the brain of the empire so far as that operates here and within the self-governing Colonies.

The main aim of the secretariat is so well understood that it is not necessary to repeat and explain its ramifications. Its regular work will largely consist in giving effect to the resolutions arrived at in Conference and following up any action taken by His Majesty's Government in connection with such resolutions; but it also lies in the way of preparing for future Conferences, and responding to requests from the dominions in order that when they meet their members may find information ready to

hand.

I have to acknowledge the fulness of the details supplied to us on this occasion, and believe it exceeds that of any other Conference which has ever met.

207

In 1887, it is true, we had a great mass of matérial laid before us, because that was the first of all the Conferences, but a good deal came too late even then to be of much use. I regret to say the circumstances under which these sittings have been held have prevented me from making anything like the use I ought to have made, and would have been glad to have made, of the information supplied. If I may venture to look forward to future Conferences, in the interest of those who attend them, I think all here well advise that it is highly desirable that this information should be in their hands, or as much of it as can be, before they leave their homes, so that they may have an opportunity on the journey here, or, if possible, before that, of discussing them with their colleagues, in order that they may do justice to that information, take full advantage of all that it offers, and prove their appreciation of it.

CHAIRMAN: The difficulty we have here is to know what the subjects are sometimes. This may, to some extent, meet it, but hitherto we did not know until a very late date what subjects were to be brought up. Another thing and I meant to have brought it up at the Conference--is the diffi- culty of fixing the actual date. That postpones final arrangements very much, because we want the figures up to the latest possible date. I wish even now before you separate you could indicate in some way or consider among yourselves what sort of date in the year would be the most convenient for these Conferences.

Sir WILFRID LAURIER: It is difficult to agree, because the antipodes and the other regions vary so greatly in regard to the time when Parliaments meet.

Mr. DEAKIN: It is rather difficult, but I think we are all becoming converts to the conviction that we ought not to meet at a time when social obligations are numerous. I think we would also agree that we ought not to meet when the Imperial Parliament is sitting. To do so imposes an unfair strain on Ministers of departments, and, moreover, prejudices to some extent our proceedings here. Do what we will, or say what we will, we are interpreted as if we had some relation to political proceedings in this country. In addition to that the comments in the House of Commons and House of Lords here suggest that the proceedings of the Conference are being watched with somewhat similar ideas. It would be much better for both of us that when any future Conference is held here it should be at a time when Parliament is not sitting, when Ministers are disengaged, when departments are free, and social obligations are not enforced.

CHAIRMAN: It is rather difficult to say when Parliament will not be sitting, and as to saying when a Minister is disengaged, I decline altogether.

Mr. DEAKIN All Ministers are in the same position; it is with the greatest difficulty one can tear oneself away from one's responsibilities. When any criticisms of mine of the Colonial Office are being read it should be remembered that I have admitted how precisely the same criticisms apply not only to our own departments, but to ourselves as politicians. We are just as absorbed in our own affairs on that side of the world as you here are in yours. The great bulk of our affairs do not interest or attract you, and will not be brought before you, just as the great bulk of your affairs in this country have but a secondary interest for us. Our large common ground is admitted, but it is because we become so absorbed in local matters which have but a general

Fifteenth Day.

14 May 1907.

INTERCHANGE

OF PERMANENT STAFF.

(Mr. Deakin.)